I feel for Alec Baldwin but
I totally disagree with the kind of language he used to communicate to his daughter. We all say awful and regrettable things when we are mad and he has sincerely apologised for the tirade towards his daughter. I also feel very sorry towards his daughter Ireland and that's why I'm getting so mad because innocent kids like her are the ones bearing the brunt of heated custody disputes. But does anyone stop to think what led Alec to this outburst? Read between the lines in the voicemail that he left his daughter and you can learn that he was overly frustrated because he could not reach out to his daughter. Judges are the main culprits in allowing alienation to go on with no repercussions. Kim has numerous contempt charges of interfering with visitation yet the judge has not addressed that. Yet the family courts keep on claiming they are geared towards the best interest of the children. That's pure BS. That's why a lot of custodial parents(mostly mothers) get away with interfering with visitations coz they know they can get away with it. These kind of parents are so vindictive and immature coz they can't even see the negative effect on their children caused by their selfish acts. Get over it, the marriage is over and its about the children's welfare, not about trying to get even with the other person. Most people on this site have seen the pain experienced by children when they are denied a continued relationship with either parent(could be mom/dad) by a vengeful custodial parent. As ugly as this Alec Baldwin issue is, hopefully it is an eye opener to family court judges first and foremost, followed by divorced parents to really see how harmful parental alienation is mostly to the child and to others. In such heated custody cases, judges need to stop slacking on the job and discipline the parent who is found to be in visitation contempt. This is only a tip of the iceberg. These type of custody and visitation battles go on everyday in family courts and its high time judges delivered on their motto of doing what is right for the children. Judges should strip custody of the parent interfering with visitation, and especially like in Kim's case where she has done it for a very long time. The problem is that in Alec's case, he already has blemished his fatherhood which might affect his chances of trying to obtain full custody. I agree with someone who noted that mostly it's custodial mothers who interfere with visitation terms. One rarely hears of fathers doing that. I am talking out of experience. Before my ex abandoned his child, his court ordered visitation was erratic and he was not paying child support yet i did not refuse him from seeing or talking to his child until he eventually disappeared. My child loved her father and I had no right to interfere with their relationship though technically, I had reason enough to keep her away from him. It was not easy for me to do it, but I had to keep on reminding myself its not about me, its about my child's happiness. If I can do it, anyone else can for the sake of their kids and life will be so much easier in the long run.
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Link
My DH emailed me this link:
http://tv.msn.com/tv/article.aspx?news=259626>1=7701
After trying and trying to straighten out SS and getting no where because of BB interference, my DH says he can really understand where Baldwin was coming from. Many divorced dads cannot even discipline their children - how can they teach them values and teach them right from wrong??? Some are reduced to leaving their children voicemail messages!
Although I feel incredibly sorry for Ireland for being the center of this tug of war, in this instance, she may have needed a good scolding from her dad!
Yes, Alec Baldwin crossed the line and used words he should not have. How many of us have done this though? My DH would never berate his son in *this* way, but he has showed his frustration to SS in other ways that I'm sure were also not the best choice.
Dads are human. Dads make mistakes. Dads hurt too. Dads try. Sometimes dads have no way to teach their children good values/morals and it IS frustrating.
My DH and I were talking about this...
And we felt the same exact way as you. I feel for both of them...
the a 'new' view of divorce... exposed... celebrity style.
Man has the intelligence to change his life,
Sometimes, he just fails to use it...
Alec Has Only Himself To Blame
Alec has always been known and proven to be abusive. I still remember seeing a picture of drool comming out of his mouth, while totally enraged at Kim outside of a restaurant. He also has not maintained a stable environment or lifestyle for a child. He has had a bevy of bimbo's coming and going. If he wanted to date so many fine, but his daughter should not be exposed to all that. A mother who is foremost concerned about her daughter would do all she could to make sure she is not a part of that lifestyle. If he wants to get therapy, and make changes in his life, then his daughter may someday want to have a relationship with him. At age 12 she has formulated her opinion on her dad based on his actions. If I recall he became enraged because he had to leave his date to call his daughter. Need I say more. This tape, showed the court that Kim was right all along.
Kim is not...
the image of perfection herself either... she too has had many mental issues as well...
Man has the intelligence to change his life,
Sometimes, he just fails to use it...
I Remember That
I remember that very same pic. I though it was terrible. I also remember seeing him in the news the day his daughter was born out of control because of the photographers. He is known to be abusive and I felt for Kim Basinger because no one should have been publically humiliated like that. Now the daughter is being verbally abused by her own father. I remember reading also that Kim Basinger had mental problems however don't you think years of verbal abuse would cause it? I know my ex fiance was very verbally abusive and it took 2 years of counseling to get my head on straight after that. It was horrible. I don't think this is a case of parental alienation. The father is abusive and has a history of it. In my opinion this is a case of a mother protecting her child.
I find myself sympathetic to Baldwin
I think that what he left on the vm was totally out of line, but for me, I'm reading much more into this b/c of my experience watching my dh being alienated from his son, and while my dh was/is the only stable home for ss, bm habitually minimizes my dh's contributions towards ss's upbring, maximizes any deficiencies he may have, even fabricates lies to ss's face about his father, and nothing will ever happen to prevent or hold her accountable for her own damage to her son. Meanwhile, she is too busy drinking her life away to even pay remote attention to her kids' rotting teeth in their mouth. She is the most unstable parent I have ever witnessed, yet my dh is the demon...so she says.
It appears to me that Baldwin has just reached the end of his rope, that he is beyond frustrated and hurt by being alienated from his own child. He didn't handle the situation appropriately, but perhaps there will be some good to come of this, and that is maybe the courts will actually take some action and get involved to really straighten out the situation.
I'm very sorry for his daughter to be caught in this tug of war, it isn't fair to her. I don't think America really knows how often children of divorce are used as pawns, and brainwashed to not appreciate the non-custodial parents. Nor does Amercia have any understanding of how mistreated father's are when they are the non-custodial parents. Hopefully this terrible incident will shed some light on this issue.
Candice
I was shocked
Frankly, I was shocked and disgusted by what I heard him say to his daughter..Issues with the ex wife or not, their was no excuse for what he said to his 11 year old daughter..On the other hand, I also feel that it has been blown out of proportion by the media.
While I
can't say that his behaviour was acceptable, I can totally understand how he feels, but I said this as soon as I heard it on the news...."kim" is responsible for this situation just as much as he is IF NOT MORE... because lets face it...where did the media get the message? She has used this message for ONLY her own benefit, and failed to consider the effect of her own child! None of us can know who these two people are just by how the media portrays them, but I am sure all of us here can understand how a custodial parent can alienate their child from their other parent and what lengths that custodial parent will go to make the other look bad.
I am going like almost everyone else
Alec isn't right and Neither is KIM. I have to say...ladies be honest, for all of u who are step-moms, on your husbands worst day ever, where he has vented to you out of anger, how would you feel if that conversation was recorded and was displayed across America to hear? Now again like everyone else is saying ALEC was wrong he was wrong all day long for leaving that message on his I am assuming child's cell phone (they never said where he left the message did they). BUT we have all been there and done that out of anger, and you all I have to say, we might have all been mad at another adult, and with them you have so many more options than you do with a child and especially one who from what we hear is not able to be with there dad. Parental Alienation is no joke, AND if KIM thinks this makes her look good, she might want to re-evaluate that. She looks malicious, vindictive, and hateful as well. The only real issue is to the judge is, "Do I give the child to the one parent who acted immaturely and said things hurtful and spiteful because he wasn't seeing his child or do I give the child to the parent who WILL make sure that the other parent has no contact with their father" That is what Kim should have been thinking about when the VOICE MAIL appeared in the press.
The poor KID....
"Be there for the joy. Be there for the tears. Be there for each other."
(Step-Mom the Movie 1998)
I totally agree!
You are so right the one you luv 2 hate! I think we all have been in bad situations, and anyone of us could have said or done things out of anger. Alec deserves forgiveness, and I totally agree that the fact the message has been linked to the media, that it is totally vindictive behavior on the custodial's part.
Alec was wrong, but hey, we have all done things out of anger. Let the man regain his composure, and begin the forgiveness process for himself, and hopefully his daughter will be able to forgive him too.
Candice
just cause I started watching
the view again this year....very big ROSIE fan, (and will likely stop watching again next year...unless they bring on that Sherry Sherpard chick LOL).......Alex Balwin will be on the view tomorrow, and will be explaining his side of things for anyone who missed that.
Nope - NO SYMPATHY
I read the text, like most people. I don't care what frustrations an adult is under regarding visitation and contact. His barrage of abuse revealed an ugly side to a person whom it appears is willing to take out adult frustrations on a child.
My DH's daughter constantly forgets to turn on the mobile we gave her. That's what kids do.
In law, "justice" has nothing to do with it. Too bad if a person feels the system is unfair, open to manipulation or abuse. Just too bad. You do not take matters into your own hands and vent that way on a child.
There is no "side", no excuse. You say something or you don't. He said it. He said it to his daughter. It's out there. It's too late to take it back and it wouldn't matter if it had been kept "private". The message still would have been heard by the only person that matters - the child.
Quite frankly, if my ex spoke to my daughter like that I too would feel an obligation to ensure that the question of his competency as a parent was in a position to be questioned.
My two cents on it
I do understand his frustration. I really feel he should not have said some of the things that he did~ calling the daughter "rude" is understandable. Calling her a "pig" is a blow to her self-image and just shouldn't have been said. No, it's not a reason to crucify him....but I really think counseling is needed for all of them, and soon!
Oh yeah
Man, if anyone taped the worst thing I've said about SS (never to him or even to DH, of course)...well, I'd probably be excommunicated from civilization as we know it. I have a temper and though I don't take it out on the kids, I have a N A S T Y mouth when I'm pissed off and I fire away in frustration to my friends that can handle the tirade of vulgarities and bitching. I have some great girlfriends who are similiar to me and when we get together, well...let's just say bitchfest doesn't come close.
No, you really don't get nuts like that in front of the kids. Have I said thigns that I regret, or done thigns, like cried or yelled at DH, in front of them? I am sorry to say that it has happened before. I have learned to curb those behaviors however, because nothing is so bad that it can't wait in order to spare a child the pain of witnessing a scary moment between his parents. BUT...seeing what DH has gone through with his ex, I do understand AB's frustration and as I understand it, Kim has a RO on him so that he cannot speak to her directly. I guess he used that voicemail as a way to get a message to Kim, and it really just went off the rails in a hurry. I agree that they all need therapy NOW, and I hope they get help.
Parental Alienation
is a two sided coin. Yes there parents that are purely vindictive because of past grudges. But the other side of the coin is its more often about mothers who try and keep the children away from poor environments. Dads who are molestors, alcholics, druggies, living unstable lifestyles, or are abusive like Alec Baldwin. Alec Baldwin's explosive temper goes way back and is well documented, Kim herself has said he has blown up on many occasions. One time he was yelling at Ireland so loud that her friends could all hear.
This may also be the best thing that has happened to Alec, because it is likely that he will be ordered into therapy so this may be his last change to turn his life around. Also, more often then not the mother is blamed for the fathers poor behavior, or the childrens negative view. You cannot control whats said in either home, and the court certainly can't. Children here it from the grandparents, the aunts, uncles, ect. about the other parent. Is that the mothers fault too, no its a sad fact of divorce. When the children become older they form their own opinions, and like Ireland they may want little to do with a father that harassed the mother and behaved horribly.