Family therapy did not go so well last night
Long story as short as possible, SD refused to speak at the Family Based therapy appointment last night and was sullen and withdrawn and when she wasn't staring at the floor, she was sharing lots of looks with BM and then glaring at BF. After BF talked a little about how he wasn't happy that BM hadn't informed him of SD's anxiety attacks and resulting 2 days out of school the other week, one of the therapists asked if SD wanted to talk now. SD and BM had another spate of looks and the therapist asked if SD should maybe express her own thoughts and not look to her mom for hers. (Good call!) BM was silent. So was SD.
BM then said that SD had asked her not to tell BF about the anxiety attack and she respected SD's wishes. BF asked that such issues as mental health and school be things BM and BF tell each other as parents no matter what. Granted, SD wanted to tell her dad in person what she was feeling and why but that was separate from her health and schooling, which should come from BM.
After some reluctance from BM and a long justification of why she didn't tell BF then nor should she at all, the therapists got BM to say "alright" when they laid out that going forward, SD's school attendance, anxiety attacks and mental and physical health would be areas that both BM and BF would share with each other as parents. BM ended by saying "as long as BF does too" which he had been saying all along but again he reiterated "of course."
BM then shared a few long looks with SD and after a lot of false starts said she didn't want to talk about this next thing because SD had asked her not to but... long muddled pause, SD's head down and BM huffing and puffing. BF said that if this was about the birthday then he was planning to talk about it. Then BM said "well the thing about this is the fallout after they dropped SD off and all night and for the past 2 days". One of the therapists stopped BM to ask what she meant by fallout because she wasn't making any sense. BM said she couldn't say exactly because SD had said she didn't want to discuss it and didn't want BM to discuss it but it was bad. (She just wanted to point out that BF had done something terribly wrong and caused awful havoc in their home - when SHE was the one perpetuating the awful situation.)
The therapist said that if SD didn't want to talk today that was ok but she asked them all what they thought was important about communicating. BF said "that we do it, first off." The therapist then described various kinds of communication: passive - not speaking, withdrawing, looks and sighs etc. The problem with that type of communication is that people don't get their needs addressed. Another type is loud, barking orders, demanding; this seems to get what you want but isn't really communicating. What we must aim for is assertive expression mixed with empathy.
BF agreed and said a fear of his was that saying "I don't want to talk now, leave me alone" *may* be ok in the short term but it enables the non-communicator to avoid facing up to important issues. (A typical BM tactic.) It can also be used to control a situation: if it's ok to say "I don't feel comfortable or want to talk about this issue" then an individual can stall indefinitley and sabotage real communication. BF said that SD's birthday was still a few weeks away but we shouldn't postpone discussion indefinitely. BM huffed a bit. SD was still withdrawn and shared more looks with BM. One of the therapists ended the session saying maybe we could discuss this at the next session and that perhaps SD could find a time to discuss this with BF later.
After the session, SD asked BM to leave so she could talk to BF alone. She said she was still upset about asking him if she could have a birthday meal and a movie with just her mom and dad. BF explained that he and her mom were not comfortable around each other. That's something they just have to work on. He also said that this fantasy of Mom & Dad & SD was not a good thing to perpetuate. He was going to go on to explain that everyone needs to accept Dad & Caitlin & SD & little sisters as family and continue INcluding not EXcluding us but SD had tears rolling down her face and ran from the reception area. She stood with her face on BM's car roof, crying uncontrollably. He held her and told her he loved her. She didn't repond. BM opened the car door for her and whispered something in her ear. SD got in and sat staring ahead and not looking at him. Then she brusqely handed him back the book he'd brought her to read and still would not look at him. He told her he loved her. No reply. He asked if she wanted to see him tomorrow for their weekly dinner. She mumbled yes. He closed the car door and they pulled out.
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Oh how awful...
But I think the extreme emotion just confirms that you need to stick to your guns on this one...she is wanting the fantasy of mommy and daddy together and I just don't see how it can be healthy. And now you have an additional worry, that if your DH or the therapists agree to do this for her birthday, they will reinforce with the daughter that if you get upset enough and cry enough you can get your way. I think he just needs to be firm and say no, it's not going to happen. No more negotiating. Either birthdays are with all of you together, or you have two separate parties at the separate households. I know it has to be so hard. And it's never easy to see your child in pain, but in this case, if she gets them together for her birthday, she will probably want it for other occasions. Not a good precendent IMHO.
And it gets even worse
BM wrote BF this email a few moments ago. At least she's keeping him up to speed, but damn! This is just too sad. I hate being so helpless!
-----Original Message-----
From: BM
Sent: Wednesday, May 23, 2007 11:54 AM
To: BF
Subject: SD
BF,
After speaking with you in the waiting room after our family based meeting SD was as you know very distraught. She was unable to go to swimming last night. This morning she is still very agitated and heart-sick. So far she is unable to go to school. I am hoping that she will be able to go in for at least part of the day.
I have asked if she wants to speak with you but she does not want to speak with you. PLEASE RESPECT SD'S WISHES.
At this time SD is feeling unable to have dinner with you this evening. If later in the day she is feeling better I will inform you that she will be able to have dinner with you. If you do not hear from me later today consider dinner cancelled.
SD has been told that I am e-mailing you and she wants you to know that the above is what she wants!
BM
(Notice how she subtly blames him for all this and acts like she's not behind it at all, like it's entirely SD's idea?) Here's BF's response:
-----Original Message-----
From: BF
Sent: Wednesday, May 23, 2007 12:14 PM
To: BM
Cc: SD's psychiatrist
Subject: RE: SD : very agitated and heart-sick - unable to go to school - unable to go to swimming last night
Importance: High
BM,
Firstly, thank you for keeping me in the loop. Although this news is hard for me to hear it’s good that I DO know and I am grateful.
I will respect SD's wishes: she doesn’t want to talk with me and may not want to see me tonight. I understand. Please tell SD that I love her and feel sad for her – this is hard for us all.
Please tell SD that I’ll be in town at the office until late tonight. If she wants to meet me or call me tell her to call - anytime. And tell her - again – that I love her. You can never hear that too often.
Have you called the psychiatrist or the family based therapists? It may help SD to have someone else to talk this over with – you and I are part of this so perhaps a professional outside of you and I might be able to give good counsel. If you haven’t, I strongly recommend that you contact one of them. I’m going to CC the psychiatrist on this in case she feels she can help. I’m concerned for SD, as are you. Let’s enlist all the help we can. If you don’t want to call the family based therapists, I’ll do it.
Thanks again for keeping in touch. Let me know how things go today. I’m thinking of SD, and you – this isn’t easy for any of us.
I agree with Rae
I would just justify in her mind that when she cries and pouts that everthing will work out the way she wants it. I don't know if this has been answered before but does BM want this? Is she still hung up on your DH?
Our greatest glory is not in never falling but in rising every time we fall.
Confucius
RE: does BM want this?
You betcha. This is all BM's orchestration. They were separated about a year and a half when I came into the picture. Before he and I got together, BM actively excluded him from everything in SD's life. Then once I entered his life, she was suddenly inviting him to do things as "a family unit" and saying it was SD's idea and he needed to respect her wishes and many times he's allowed himself to be manipulated into doing whatever they say, just to be able to see his daughter, against our better judgement. Well now, with the help of a team of mental health professionals, we're trying to put a stop to all this insanity. BM is putting up a good fight and using that poor little girl as her pawn. I feel so bad for SD - no one deserves this kind of mental anguish, let alone an 11-year-old little girl.
That was a GREAT response from DH!
I'm really impressed. And hopefully SD will get some help on this. Her emotions have gone WAY over the top on this issue, and it's turning into emotional blackmail toward your DH with help from her mother.
Caitlyn, she is
wanting her parents back together. And by him telling her what he did just proves it by her actions. her crying and stuff. Trust me just went thru this with the 16 yr. old SD.. And she was angry when we all started talking because of a big blow up at our house and my husband told her this is not about all the things she was blaming me for he told her point blank its because you will not let her in. Only for the fun things, shopping me paying for things all that.. then she sat there really angry and he went on and said that "he and her mother were over and if in her mind she was angry thinking that they would ever get back together she was wrong' as soon as he started on that conversation she was balling hard. She is over that now. but it had to be said. Going to her mom's and seeing family photos of her mom and dad together and all of them together is not reality anymore and in my opinion it sends false messages to the child. Yes her mom had pics of them all over.. Sickening in my opinion.
So what this BM is trying to do is totally ruin her and her dad's relationship with her manipulation. I wish that I knew her because I would be telling her straight up what the hell she is doing to her daughter. Hate to say it but if the BM continues on you and SD will have problems in the future.. Just wait.. And its not fun.. IT helps that you are a very mature understanding person.. I send many hugs your way. I think the therapist need to keep BM out of them for awhile and work on building a foundation for just her and your BF.. So mom cannot give looks or manipulate her anymore..
Happy
" make sure you tell the people you love most EVERYDAY.. Its important not only for them to know but for you to tell.. Life is to short to be miserable..
He's had many years of practice
Bless him, he's handling this really well. He fully expected this, because this is how it always pans out, but it's still so heartbreaking for him. Thank god for these therapists, I feel like they're our only hope of SD coming out of this alive.
What saddens me the most is that SD is learning such lovely traits from BM as intense emotional blackmail and throwing fits to get her way and living in a fantasy world and fiercely trying to get everyone else to perpetuate the fantasy rather than accept the reality. Is this how she's going to behave her whole life? Because that's how BM still leads her life, at the ripe old age of 53. It's not something she grew out of as she matured. It just scares me. She's such a lovely kid, what if she turns into mini-BM?!?!?
Actually, what saddens me even more is that BM creates this madness for her in the first place. SD doesn't deserve this! Argh!!!
What I don't get
What I don't get is how SD can have such a wonderful relationship with her dad, me and her baby sisters, yet all that can be destroyed by her mental-case mother. How is that bleeping possible? SD LOVES us. She loves coming to our house. She genuinely loves being in each other's lives. Then she goes home to BM and something like this just completely destroys her because BM is working on her 24/7 to meet her own agenda. She literally takes on BM's feelings as her own. I just don't see any solution in sight. I'm so sad.
The Key
I think you are right Caitlin...you've hit the nail on the head...she's taking on the BM's feelings as her own. I'm witnessing this with my own DH's almost grown sons...over the last 8 months the BM has involved her son's in every aspect of her misery and drama, including copying them on emails she sends to my DH. The BM is in denial and is just horrible...and has finally succeeded...the boys no longer talk to their dad. She did this by involving them in everything...showing them old photos...showing them their marriage vows and certificate...in every email to DH telling him that his "family" is always there for him...using every opportunity she can find to make it that since my DH is no longer with her, he rejected his family (especially his kids.) She's made it like they were a package deal, and now that he doesn't want her, he cannot have any relationship with the kids...and she's succeeded. They live with her, and have to witness her misery every single day...and believe me, she's off the deep end. And she's dragged them with her. It's unbelievably sad! They hurt for her I know. I cannot imagine witnessing my mother crying and sobbing and getting angry and going off day after day. I would hate the person doing this to her, and that's what's happening with the boys and it doesn't matter how unreasonable it is, or how long their parents have been apart. It's her perceptions they've taken as fact.
I also had this birthday situation not too long ago, the BM and both sons were coming to our town for a sports tournament that happened to occur on the oldest son's birthday. DH told boys he would be a part of activities...with me. BM went off the deep end, boys went off the deep end, and I finally told DH to go without me. I wanted him to have some semblance of a relationship with his boys no matter what. Boy was that a mistake! They were all miserable during the tournament and subsequent dinner and things have gone completely downhill from there. Because I think in all of their minds, they thought if they could be together as a family, things would change with DH coming to his senses and leaving me. Of course he isn't, so he shattered them supposedly, and now there is no communication at all. The BM is delusional, and has passed it to the kids. It's beyond sad. And there doesn't seem to be anything we can do. Hang in there Caitlin.
Oh Rae, not you too?!
It is just unfathomable to me how these women can hurt their children like this and not only justify it to themselves, but convince themselves that it's all Dad's doing, like they're the innocent victims in all this. I don't know how long you've been with your DH and how long he's been split up with BM, but in our case she's had more than 4 years to get used to not being a "family unit" anymore and nearly 3 to get used to the idea that her ex has moved on with me - it's not like this is all a fresh open wound! I mean, Christ, SD was 7 when they split up - she's now turning 12. She's lived in two households for more than 1/3 of her life already and she really has adjusted beautifully and then WHAM! she has a complete nervous breakdown because of BM's inability to move on.
Thanks for the support and sympathy and for sharing your story. I don't know why it helps to hear about others going through the same anguish, but it does. You hang in there too. Stay strong.
dear friend
first I send you a huge cyber hug, but I am also going to come out and say this...despite mental health issues NEVER under estimate the x for what she will do with the threat of losing control(money) You know what you are hoping for, and that is the last thing this woman wants (lose money) (lose control) I think if I have it right, the visitation at your home is about to become involved in the family therapy including video. This chick knows what she is doing and that is to interfere with the normal interaction you guys would have when the camera is on. DH needs to address this with the therapists, she is using the situation to still alienate you sd against dad, and if they are too dumb to see it, perhaps someone should point it out. The birthday is an convenient target to pull strings here.....we all knew this "pregnancy" wouldn't be easy, but don't just hang in honey , ya gotta dig in tooooo!!!!!!love and light from your loony friendxoxoxoxox
you're right, loony
Let's take a look at things from BM's point of view. Her ex has moved on and has a lovely family with a new partner with whom he is extremely happy, while she is alone with no hope of ever having more children, which she always wanted. Her daughter is very happy with her new family as well, which BURNS BM UP. BM's biggest fear is that SM will "replace" her in SD's eyes, that SD will prefer to live with Daddy, SM and little sisters in a perfect little American family and she will be left to rot in her own misery because BM has NOTHING OTHER THAN SD in her life. And I mean that literally: no job, no friends, no social life, no hobbies, no interests outside of SD's activities.
So BM has a lot to lose. She defines herself as SD's mother and without her, she is nothing. And she thinks that the only way to keep her daughter is to sabotage her daughter's relationship with her dad and SM so she is desperately trying to make things such a huge horrible mess just so she can say "See what Daddy did?! He can't have custody, he's a terrible father!"
Good thing the therapists are onto her. They're our saving grace. My fiance spoke with them yesterday and they are planning an intervention because this is just spining out of control. Once I hear what's happening, I will come back here to update.
We're going crazy here!
Ok, so after that email from BM over 24 hours ago, we have received no word from her. She won't return any phone calls or emails, which is just cruel. When my fiance spoke with the therapists yesterday, they indicated that they were going to intervene, but we've heard nothing from them since. Just what is going on over there? The last time there was an episode like this, it escalated all the way to SD trying to throw herself out of a 4th-floor window screaming that she wanted to die. Will someone please tell us what is going on?!? I'm wondering if BM has refused contact with the therapists as well and that's why they're not in touch with us - because they have no news to report. I just don't understand how the father can be completely shut out like this!
I'm trying to focus on the positive here, but now I'm just worried and I can't get any work done dammit!!!
Update: Family Based therapist is on her way over here
One of the therapists met with BM and SD this evening (the other one is on vacation) and now she's on her way over here. Apparently, it's too important to discuss with us over the phone, so she's driving 45 minutes to meet with us in person. It will be well past 9pm by the time she gets here, I am very impressed that she is doing this. I am so glad she recognizes the gravity of the situation.
any update?
so what was the outcome?
Oh Caitlyn...
Please give us an update when you can... I'm not liking the sound of this based on your last post...
One thing that I'm concerned about is that because of the length of time that you all are in therapy and BM's progress resistance to it, my fear is that now, she's double folding on SD... meaning, pressing SD harder now because BM KNOWS that she's NOT getting her way with the therapy... her only recourse is to frantically work on SD while they are at home, premeditating and engineering responses to the sessions, since BM is competent enough to see and understand that blaming BF for everything isn't working in her favor despite that she may still keep trying and be in denial, obviously, so she's working another angle now... SD.
What I'm worried about is SD crumbling under the stress and strain of it all... this is a lot of pressure for a little girl and I am positive that BM will use that to her advantage. Speaking hypothetical here, but if SD were to do something detrimental to her health, mental state, etc, (since she did in the past that lead to all of this...) I am positive that BM will say that because of BF, SD did this... I'm not feeling very good about this right now. And the sad part, is that I really feel that BM will or could perpetuate, almost imply and instigate the behavior for a hard hitting response out of desperation.
Do give us an update, dear...
Man has the intelligence to change his life,
Sometimes, he just fails to use it...
CAITLIN
We're all worried about you guys! Let us know you're okay.
~ Anne ~
"Nobody can make you feel inferior without your permission."
-Eleanor Roosevelt
Caitlin
Still no update?! I hope that's not a bad sign. I hope it is good news but I'm concerned that it isn't.
You are in my thoughts.
Dawn
Wow
The therapist arrived around 9:15pm and stayed with us until 11:30pm trying to get a handle on the situation. Instead of telling us much of anything, she wanted to hear us talk because she just didn't understand what the hell was going on because SD still couldn't or wouldn't talk in their session earlier that evening. (Of course, their session was with BM hovering over her, so OF COURSE she couldn't talk.) After getting our input, the therapist is going to have an individual session with SD today to see if she will open up without BM in earshot.
What came out of our 2+ hour session is just about verbatim what StepMom said above, so please refer to her post. Given that, the therapist supports us pursuing custody in the immediate future because BM is a danger to SD. We are going to get input from SD's psychiatrist and the team at the clinic before we make our move because we want to know that they are all behind us and will unanimously recommend to the court that SD be removed from BM's care because we are up for a horrible battle and need all the allies we can rally. My fiance is meeting with the lawyer on Tuesday so we will likely file the petition then.
Oh dear god. I think it's really happening.
At 10:30 last night, a voicemail came in on my fiance's phone and we SO WISH we had listened to it then, with the therapist, but we didn't know it was SD. She didn't call, just dialed into voicemail to leave him a message but we are so glad she finally reached out and just so relieved to hear from her. She started out calm and then immediately went into fits of tears and sniffling and hushed silences. At one point, you hear BM knocking on the door, so we can only imagine that SD locked herself in the bathroom because she told us that's the only place she can be alone in their apartment. We think that BM didn't know she had gone in there to use the phone. Here is a transcript I typed up of SD's message. All the ellipses are where she is crying to hard to speak.
(calm) Hi Dad, it's - SD. - I love you (sobs) and I'm... sorry that I'm mad... I don't know if you were trying to help me, but... if you were, it really hurt... and... those emails that my mom sent you... they were true and it was just hard getting back on my feet and I'm still just not really able to think straight. So (BM: knock knock knock - Hello?) I love you... and... I guess... um... I guess I'll... talk to you soon. - Um, and I'm talking to "Ally" (a friend from school) and she's being really helpful 'cause she's sorta in the same position and - I just... we'll talk. I love you. Talk to you.
All I can say is, I am so glad to hear that SD could talk to a friend who can sympathize with her because she couldn't bring herself to talk to ANYONE for DAYS besides BM. The poor child is just crumbling under her mother's stress and pressure and the last time this happened, SD became suicidal. I'm so thankful for "Ally" because she may be what kept SD from completely losing it this time.
Oh Caitlin...
Say it isn't so... that is my worst fear with all of this. I just worry about this little girl. Please do whatever you can in your power because I really feel this little girl NEEDS stability and most of all loving support. The sad thing is that this won't be easy at all because this is all this little girl knows and she is sure to need counseling to help her interrupt what is going on. Her mother is so unstable but to her- it's her mother and it's normal to her. She certainly may be aware that there is a problem because of all the commotion around her lately. She is going through soooo much. I just can't imagine how she must feel right now. She must be soo torn inside.
Man has the intelligence to change his life,
Sometimes, he just fails to use it...