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Help Needed with Crazy Ex-wife

wkdwytch's picture

Hi all. My fiance and I have been best friends since high school. We both married other people (twice! yikes!)and remained in touch off and on for 22 years. His second ex-wife is the problem. They got married because she went off the pill without telling him and got pregnant. They had broken up for a few weeks after she told him she went off the pill (two weeks previously) but before she told him she was pregnant. I had wanted to pursue a relationship with him, until I learned she got pregnant. At that point, I backed away, giving him space to decide what he wanted to do. I never told him of my feelings until we decided to get together last year.

Anyway, he decided to "do the right thing", got back together with her and married her. After they got back together, but before getting marries, she found out that him and I had met up with my sons and his son from his first marriage while they had been broken up, before she told him she was pregnant. She proceeded to smack him in the head with a frying pan, giving him a black eye. On several other occasions, she abused him but he stayed for the sake of their unborn child. She had the baby, a beautiful little girl, and then moved out 2 months later. Then she decided she wanted to try again and, once again for the sake of his daughter, he gave it another shot. That lasted a couple of months until finally she left for good. Almost a year after she moved out, I decided to send a facebook "hello" to him and found out that she had left him (saw his status said single or would not have sent the message. I am not a homewrecker!)

He had been trying to get her to agree to custody/visitation/child support and she kept refusing to compromise. She would only let him see his daughter in her home, because she couldn't bear to be without her daughter. I advised that he should file court papers to settle this because he should not have to sit in her house to see his daughter. His daughter was also not developing a relationship with his son or the extended family (grandparents, aunts/uncles, cousins.)

Finally the court case is settled and he has tried to get her to sign the divorce papers. This had been on hold because his lawyer told him to get the custody issue settled and then file the divorce papers; the lawyer said it would be easier if the judge had only the custody/visitation/child support to deal with. So now she won't sign the divorce papers.

Our issues? Well, the child has never slept on her own, the mother must, due to her own insecurities and neurosis, must sleep with this now 3 year old cuddled in her arms. She does not reprimand the child for misbehaviors and instead calls him so he can do it over the phone. She does not work and refuses to go back to work EVER (her own words to me) because he is the man and the man should pay for everything.We have very few behavioral issues when she is with us and have gotten her from the first overnight to sleep in her own bed. At her mother's house, she tortures the cat (we have one too and ours is fine, no torture going on); her mother says she is fresh, though I am not sure what that is supposed to mean, since we don't have that problem either. If we find her doing something we don't want her to do, we stop her, correct her, and sometimes she will get a time out, depending on what the misbehavior is.

Other issues? This woman taught her then 2 1/2 year old daughter how to make herself vomit. Why? So she can say the visits were traumatizing. The child would only vomit on our visitation days. When asked why she was forcing herself to do this (she would gag herself or shove her hand down her throat) she said mommy told her to so she didn't have to go to daddy's house. We took her to the doctor to make sure nothing was medically wrong. The mom showed up also and the doctor even agreed that the mother was encouraging this.

Now, I pick up our daughter (don't like the step word) every other Friday for the visitation (I get out of work first and it's written into the paperwork.) Now, when I get there, she's in hysterics (after months of beign perfectly fine) and I spend 15-20 minutes trying to get out of the house. It had been ordered that pick-ups/dropp-offs would be curbside but the mother broke her foor and can't figure out how to use her crutches(idiot!)So, my dear fiance tells the mother that he thinks we need to all go to family therapy. The woman cannot co-parent, does not take our advice, and says she knows best because she is the mother. She has never been around kids before and he and I have 3 boys between us, 15, 13, and 12. She is now refusing to go to counseling, then said she'd go if I wasn't there. The counselor won't see us without us all there, since he and I live together and take care of all the kids as a family. He has shared physical custody of his son (from the first marriage) so we have him every other day. My kids don't have an in-the-picture bio dad so they are with us 24/7.

Any advice on how to handle this? She won't sign the damn papers and still calls herself his wife, though she never did a "wifely" thing for him. She has thanked me for "babysitting" her daughter until he gets home and refuses to see us as a family. He told her he'd take her to court if she refused to go to counseling but frnakly, I am tired of going to court. The problem I see with caving on my appearance at counseling is her looking at them as the family when they have been living apart for 2 years now. HELP!!!

Comments

DaizyDuke's picture

Wow! This woman is certifiable!

Your DF needs to STOP caving into her ridiculous demands. As had been said a million times here, HE is partly responsible for creating this monster. Instead of putting his foot down, he has been cowering to her demands and whims. The counselor is correct in that YOU SHOULD be involved in any counseling sessions. Do not back down on this!

She has the power right now...the power to stop him from marrying you by refusing a divorce, the power to manipulate her daughter into not seeing her father, the power to dictate who, what, where, when, why. This power needs to be taken from her immeditely!

wkdwytch's picture

He has stopped cow-towing to her now. The problem is she is still refusing to go to counseling so now we are going to probably have to go to court to enforce.

As for the divorce, she's being an idiot. NY has just instituted not fault divorce. The filing spouse has to swear under oath the marriage has been damaged beyond repair for at least 6 months. Since they have a signed custody/CS agreement, have been living apart for 2 years, and he has a fiance, she has no leg to stand on. So again, off to court (a different court) to get the divorce. I feel like we spend more time in court than at work!

Thanks for your post

aggravated1's picture

I agree, concur, and otherwise completely identify with what SM said.
Smile

hismineandours's picture

I also concur. You are not even married to this man. You are his live in girlfriend. She is his wife(whether eitehr of you like it or not) and the mother of his child. Obviously she doesnt want to coparent with you and she doesnt have to.
I can't even believe the counselor would insist on the live in girlfriend being present during a coparenting session. You are offending the woman by stepping on her toes. You want things to get better? Step back. Let your boyfriend handle his wife and his daughter.

wkdwytch's picture

The courts don't consider him a married man. In fact, the judge during their court proceeding told her that, since she had left him (at that time) 2 years ago, she had no legal standing on the issue of him having a girlfriend. They have been living apart for just about 3 years now, since she left when the child was not even 3 months old.

As for the counseling, he specifically told her before making the appointment that it was to deal with the issues regarding their daughter, her forced vomitting and the BM lack of parenting with him. The counselor cut the appointment short when he found out that we live together and I wasn't there. The BM said she didn't want me there and, when asked why, said it was because she was the mother and she said so. The counselor told her that was not appropriate and that I should be involved because we live together. He also asked why she refused to sign the divorce papers and she said she just didn't want to. No reason, just don't want to. Sound like a child to you? I thought so.

Those who judge me need to read the words that have been typed here. He and I have been friends for 22+ years and had gotten together with my sons and his son time and again for years. She knew we were friends when they started dating and knew we would remain friends regardless. To reiterate, I never said anything to him about wanting to be in a relationship until they had been broken up for almost 2 years. That is not the definition of a homewrecker or mistress. I got involved with a man who was separated from his wife, a wife who was being difficult is signing any papers.

DaizyDuke's picture

huh? she is his fiance... they got together a year after (ex) wife moved out? why is she the bad guy here and being told to eat crap and like it???

wkdwytch's picture

She is legally the wife because she is refusing to sign the papers. She walked out on him because he told her they needed her to go back to work and she didn't want to. Now she wants to remain his wife but not live with him. That is just ridiculous.

As for the co-parenting, here in NY, the court makes each parent go to a court mandated parenting class where they tell the parents they have to co-parent. I didn't say she wasn't co-parenting with me; I said she wasn't co-parenting. Period. The lawyers, law guardian, and counselor all agree she is the one not cooperating with him.

As for my kids, the reason their father is not aroound is because he married woman 4 years after we divorced who didn't want kids and made him move to FL. My kids felt he abandoned them and refuse any contact with him, now that they are teenagers.

Don't assume you know everything when you try to read between the lines and make me the bad guy. I would have immensely grateful had my kids stepmother accepted them and treated them as her own. Instead she took their dad away from them, thousands of miles away.

aggravated1's picture

How did she "make him" move to Florida? Was she holding a gun to his head? Please tell me you don't hold his new wife accountable for a GROWN MAN moving away.

I hate this crap. Blame your stupid ex husband for moving, for God's sake. All of the blame you are putting on his new wife, is probably the same kind of blame your BM is putting on you.

wkdwytch's picture

Oh, no, I don't mean to imply she held a gun to his head. I only mean that she insisted they move and he went along with it. I agree wholeheartedly that it is all on his shoulders. What I place blame on her for is making him choose between him and his kids. It was his choice that was poor. In my opinion, she should have walked away the moment she found out he had kids if she didn't want to deal with kids. Maybe my choice of words was poor in explaining my situation.

wkdwytch's picture

He is taking the lead with his daughter. I was looking for advice on how to help him further.

The problem with counseling is the therapist told us he finds it useless to not have her there and me there as well. Per the counselor, since we live together, I should be involved in the counseling.

What some of the responses fail to see is I have been in the position of someone else being in my kids lives. I have been divorced for 11 years and my ex had a few girlfriends and then married. I know how it feels to have another woman in your kids lives and the only ones I didn't like were the ones who treated my kids like they were outsiders. I enjoyed those few times my kids liked their BF "friend" and would have been grateful had their BF's wife accepted them as her own. Instead she moved him away and now I'm lucky if he pays his CS. He stopped calling, sending birthday/Christmas cards (forget about presents) and then wondered why they wouldn't talk to him when he did finally try calling.

As for backing off, that won't happen. he and I have been, at the very least, best friends for 22+ years and I would be around, regardless of my role. As for stealing him away, I didn't even know they broke up until more than a year after it happened, since I didn't keep in touch when she told him she was pregnant. I gave them room to try to be a family and found out via Facebook that they weren't. She can't fault anyone but herself for him moving on, since she walked out, all because he told her they needed her to go back to work since they were struggling financially. So, instead of begin a family, she walks away, goes to live with her mother, and still wants to call herself a wife. beyond ridiculous.

skylarksms's picture

Wkdwytch - OK - I was in a similar situation whereas the BM blames me for the demise of her relationship with H (even though they were broken up and he was living in his own place when I met him). And was absolutely FURIOUS that he DARED to marry me (she had the skids to "force" him to marry her but he still refused).

I don't know your situation for sure, but I was also the one who told H that fathers had rights too and BM could NOT force him to go to her place as the only way he could see his kids. Therefor, I became Satan. }:)

Yes, you being involved is making the whole situation more difficult. But whose fault is that? Yours, his or BMs? If she didn't want him to leave - try not hitting him upside the head with a skillet! (or screwing around with guy after guy after guy, in my case). I do not condone affairs but I also know that sometimes you can get involved with a man who is not as out of a relationship as he makes you think (not that that is necessarily YOUR case).

Unfortunately, I think that the divorce AND custody/support issues should have been taken care of all at the same time. I'm sure that, like us, you and your DF will be dragged back into court again and again.

Make sure to DOCUMENT all craziness and have communication flow via email or something in writing so you can document everything...especially any way in which the BM is refusing to follow the visitation order.

Hopefully, once this particular drama is finished, things will smooth over.

But, just so you know. Our BM never got over her vindictiveness. And they were never even married!!

wkdwytch's picture

Oh God! Maybe now I don't feel so bad! LOL.

As to the divorce situation, I agree with you that it should have been settled at the same time but the lawyer said no, it would complicate matters in the custody. At the time, she had also told her attorney that she would sign any divorce papers he wanted becuase she wanted to be out of the marriage. Now that custody/CS was settled, she renegs. I don't see this being anyone's fault but bad attorney advice and the fault of the BM for being a liar (about wanting to sign papers.)

It seems like everyone here wants to paint me as the bad guy when all I am trying to do is make my home harmonious, rather the acrimonious. I know (as a step-kid) that not getting along and always feeling like the "red-headed stepchild" is not comfortable. That's the reason we don't use step in our house, not because I am trying to take over someone else's child. We treat all kids equally, regardless of parentage and that's how I feel it should be done (and fiance agrees with me.)

I think some misunderstanding is that people think I am the one running the show and telling her what to do. That is far from the case. Oftentimes, I have to calm him down because I think he is getting out of line over something. When I say she fails to take advice, it's on silly things. For example, the child has eczema (pretty bad) on her arms, legs, and buttocks. Well, my kids have ezcema and we always used Aveeno oatmeal lotion on them. When we've tried it on her, it calms the eczema down. We told the BM this and she adamantly refuses to use it because she thinks we are wrong. It doesn't matter that the doctor told her what to use or that the stuff she is using isn't working. All that matters is she does the exazct opposite of what we suggest. This has nothing to do with how slighted she may feel, but to her insistance that, as the BM, she knows better than anyone else.

skylarksms's picture

Wkdwytch - I don't even think it is that she knows everything because she is the BM. If she is like our BM, it is just to be as difficult as possible - even if it is at the expense of her own child.

Our BM actually TOLD my H that if he ever left, she'd make the rest of his life a living hell. We've been together for 11 years, married for 9 and about a month ago he kind of murmured, "I can't believe she actually did it." I said did what? And then he told me what her vindictive huge mouth said to him.

Sometime I get mad at H for bringing this creature into my life. But I can't stay mad for long. He WARNED me that the mother of his kids was kind of psycho. Stupid me, I thought she'd get over it.

She got pregnant last year and got married a few months later (finally!!!!) and besides wanting more CS (now that she has ANOTHER mouth to feed), she is leaving us alone more now. She's got her next victim in her sights - AND she'll get alimony with this guy too!

wkdwytch's picture

Funny thing is, she left him. His job kept closing due to weather and he was having difficulty finding a replacement or second job. he asked her to call her old job (that she quit the day after they got married) and see if she could go back to work. She refused, they argued, she left. She is making his life hell and she's the one who lied (to get pregnant) and then walked out when asked to help with finances.

I haven't even told the best of the stories. She tried to get supervised visitation because "he was a boy, the child is a girl" so she thought overnights were inappropriate. She also didn't want overnights because he has a son and she thought it was inappropriate to have different sex siblings in the same house overnight. When the judge told her she was out of line, she then tried to say she wanted her daughter's visitation different than his son's, basically interrupting that relationship.

She even admitted that she wasn't going to tell him about the pregnancy so she could raise the child on her own and not have to share her. She admitted to him that she does not sleep, even one wink, when the child sleeps at our house. Does this sound like a normal person to you? I can see being nervous for the child the first time, or first few times. I can see missing your child the first time, or few times, she doesn't sleep there. But we have been getting overnights for almost 9 months now and she still says she doesn't sleep all weekend when the child is with us. Yes, I was nervous the first few times my kids slept at the BF's house after the divorce but not to the point where I made myself crazy.

I wonder about your situation. How can she justify more CS because she has another baby, with another man who she is now married to? Curiosity gets the best of me...did this go to court? What's the outcome?

skylarksms's picture

Well, with my H and BM, their relationship was so on again/off again with BOTH of them breaking it off numerous times. I told my H, "No WONDER she is so psycho. You were her yo-yo. She'd throw you out for a while and then wind you back in again."

In fact, the last time that he was over at her house "visiting" his kids (i.e., free babysitting so BM could have her night out on the town), he told BM he met me and wasn't going to come over to her house anymore. As he was riding his bike away, BM said, "You'll be back. You always are." And laughed at him.

As far as BM's justification. There are MANY things that no sane person would find justification for that she does anyway. It was a laugh on her because CSE said that my H's income hadn't changed enough to warrant going to court over it. BM was VERY upset. Especially since I got a great deal on a little sports car recently - which I'm sure she is assuming H bought or something. I don't know. My head hurts if I try to think her crazy thoughts too much.

Sounds like yours has head issues of her OWN!

wkdwytch's picture

Oh completely, she does.

I'm glas to hear the court didn't fall for your BM's stupidity. My BM tried to get more $ of of my fiance when she was told we were moving in together. She thought she should get the benefit of my income, especially becuase I get CS from my ex. Judge laughed her out of the building and told her that I could hit the lottery and she would not benefit in any way. My bank account, even when married, has no impact on her CS. She just wants $$$$!

barbararod1224's picture

i see there are alot of thoose out there!! being that I am an ex wife, I have never given my ex a problem with our child. what is wrong with all these women that can't go on with there lives. If you have a bad unfit father for your children, I would understand. But i see more and more fathers that want to be part of there childrens live and the ex just make it impossible. My husband is great with my kids as I am with his. His ex wife is just from hell!! I wonder myself if things get better through out time.

wkdwytch's picture

Yeah, I never gave my ex a problem with anything either. In fact, before he moved to FL, if I had a special event on my weekend (say a wedding) and couldn't take the kids, I offered to have him watch them so he could get extra time. He always refused the extra time. That never made sense to me.

wkdwytch's picture

We live in NY and, until recently, you had to show cause for divorce, meaning place blame on someone. The lawyer, because of this and because the legislature had a no-fault law pending, said wait it out and just do the no fault. The lawyers are reason #1 why this was taking so long. Previous to the lawyers getting involved, he was trying to wrok out amicable visitation and CS but she kept refusing to cooperate so they ended up in court, where the lawyers got involved. Now that the nofault law is in place, he filed, served the papers and she won't sign, now forcing a hearing for him to tell the judge the marriage has been irretrevable damaged for at 6 months. (HELLOOO!!!)

It's not that the divorce won't happen...it's just that now he has to take another day off from work to have a hearing to have the judge tell her she will be a divorced woman. My opinion is, if the judge is going to make it happen anyway, why not just sign the papers so no one has to go to court? Make life easy for once!

wkdwytch's picture

Actually, he didn't agree to a huge amount. When they ended up going to the hearing for CS, the magistrate sided with him in his points and she got slightly less than what she was asking for. She had also been asking for spousal support and the magistrate laughed at her, especially since they had broken up twice during the short marraige, the last time when they had been married less than six months when she left for good.

As for supporting him, I do no such thing. He works some overtime to account for the child support, which the magistrate told her she would not be entitled to any portion of since OT is not guaranteed income. The only thing I do is make sure all the bills get paid on time. I am in finance so I handle all monetary transactions.Basically, he deposits money and I write the checks. In no way do I support him; in facat, he had to support me for a while when I lost my job and my ex wasn't paying his CS on time.

wkdwytch's picture

I know all these things, since I have an ex-husband which I have two children with but thanks for pointing them out; some people don't know these things. As I said in a previous reply to someone else, he is taking care of business and money is not an issue. The magistrate told her that she does not qualify for more CS because she is choosing to stay home and even ordered that they split the "extra's" (co-pays for example) 60/40. Where she will get the 40%? Probably the CS he pays but the point is, she is not getting a free ride. She is actually getting slightly less than the "normal" percentage of his pay because he has a child with his first wife that he shares custody of (no CS paid there) and so has expenses for another child.

He does not exhibit a single one of the points you mentioned so I'm all good. From the first night we had overnights, we got the child to sleep in her own bed. We did take turns sitting with her for a bit, in the rocking chair while she laid in bed, when she went to bed or woke up in the middle of the night. However, now we can walk her into her room, read one more story (maybe, depending on other circumstances) and walk out of the room with a kiss and hug. As to being permissive or the kids being "hyperactive", we don't have any of these issues. At our house, she is basically a well-behaved child. Of course, like all kids, she does do things that we tell her should not but she is only learning boundaries at our house so we have to re-teach her every time she comes over. Example: At her mother's house, she has a cat which she likes to pick up, squeeze until it vomits, and swings it around by the tail. Her mother does nothing but say "Stop that now and sit down." The first time she came to our house and saw my cat, she tried to pick her up and squeeze her; the cat hissed, arched her back, and took off. We gave her a hort time out, sat her down and explained why she was not to that again and we haven't had a problem. Now, if the cat doesn't like being touched at any given time, she will hiss and the child walks away.

The major problem is the mother's refusal to take any advice. She complains the child acts out at her house and she does not know what to do. The problem as we see it, is the BM is too permissive and "begs" the child to behave or calls him to have him reprimand the child. After the first time, I told him to stop, as this makes him the bad guy and gives the BM a reason to keep calling him for things that should be under her control. The behaviors she complains about don't happen at our house because she (the child) knows we mean business and we don't cowtow to her. He tried to give her advice on how to handle misbehaviors but she doesn't listen. Due to this and other concerns he has, he told her that he was going to seek out counseling and insisted that she come. They (she?) need to learn co-parenting skills so that behaviors are considered unacceptable in both homes and are dealt with similarly. I had my ADHD son in counseling when he was younger and the therapist said this only works when both parents participate. The counselor my SO picked said the same thing and that I should be involved also, as I am going to be her (step)mother and we live together. She does not want to go to counseling at all and specifically said she forbids me to participate, despite the counselor saying we all must participate or he won't see us.

He does not prescribe to the "one big happy family" when it comes to his ex. We (him, my kids, his kids, and myself) are the big happy family. The BM has gotten pissed off because his family included me in the holiday celebrations over the past year and she was excluded. She still thinks she is part of the famliy despite his insistance to her that she is not (I have heard him say this to her, on the phone and in person.) She thinks because they have a child together that they are a forever family. So, this is my frustration.