In short, BM requested one of DH's weekends (Oct 4) back in July to take the skids to her family reunion out of state. I use the word "request" losely because she basically told him she was taking them, but I digress. DH replied at that time that he would consider it for a switch of comparable days. She blew it off. My initial post about this yesterday is here: http://steptalk.org/node/166609
So DH replied to her last night and basically said that he would still accept a switch of days to accomodate the trip, but without a reasonable compromise, he would not allow BM to have that weekend.
She flipped, as expected. She replied almost instantly (which leads me to believe she had a draft reply all ready to go):
"Thanks I just wanted to clarify that you were not allowing the girls to see their extended family at a family reunion that you have known about for several months. Obviously it's not your opinion that the girls should have contact with their aunts and uncles and cousins from my side of the family. I guess I will just have try and schedule something during the holiday break seeing as you are not willing to allow a short weekend visit with their family. Thanks again for always putting our daughters first."
This pretty much cements the suspicion that she's trying to build a case to make DH look bad in court for her recent filing.
He replied, very simply: "My offer to switch days still stands."
She replied:
"It was you who proposed a switch of comparative time that would satisfy you in order for the girls to attend. I have been all ears since your suggestion. I figured since you were requesting time in exchange that you would have suggested the weekend or days that suited you. Nothing ever came from you. That is why sent the email to verify. I really don't think 2 days is a lot to ask for our daughters to see their cousins (who are also school age) or their aunts and uncles, and great grand parents. It seems you have made up your mind so I guess this discussion is over. I just wanted to clarify that again you were unwilling to allow the girls to see family that they are not able to see every weekend. That 2 days of your was to much to ask."
DH is done replying. I think he's made it very clear, without all the dramatics, that he's willing to switch days so the girls can go. I don't think he needed to necessarily ask for specific days, as they are BM's days to give. I think making the offer was enough, right?
I think I would send one final email back and cc his attorney:
I am not refusing your request, I am waiting to hear from you which weekend/ block of time you are willing to trade for the requested time. If I do not hear from you on a proposed block of time, that we can agree on, By (insert date/time she needs to have the request to you) I will presume you have elected not to have the girls attend the family reunion.
Be sure he keeps all of the correspondence to show that he absolutely did make a reasonable effort to resolve the conflict & she refused to work with him.
He's not denying the switch. She hasn't offered any dates to switch for. She emailed him in July telling him she was taking the girls for that Oct weekend. It's his time. He replied and said, "that's my weekend. please let me know which two days you'd like to switch"
She replied to THAT with "when we do this change order I'm getting every other weekend so that wil be my weekend anyway"
No change order ever happened. She never brought it up again.
She still hasn't provided available dates, despite being asked and offered the switch AGAIN yesterday.
He asked her, very explicitly on several occasions which days she would like to switch. I don't see why he needed to propose specific dates .. the dates don't really matter to him. It's her time she needs to give up to switch, so she should have the opportunity to offer dates that work for her.
Proposing dates to this woman would only open another avenue for her to argue .. because that's ALL it ever is with her. No win.
That BM will always play the martyr and victim. SMDH.
Your DH is more than willing to switch dates, she just doesn't want to give up her time, she just wants DH to look like the bad guy. Piece of work!
DH needs to respond to her email with....."You seem to have a comprehension problem, no where in any email correspondence did I state that you could not take the girls on this trip to your family reunion. I stated that I'd be more than accommodating but to let me know the make up dates. Looking at the calendar the next time that can we switched is during Christmas break. As it seems that I have to be the one to state the obvious, I will take these 2 days (XX/XX/XXXX-XX/XX/XXXX)" If she comes back with anything other than ok, sounds good, she is not willing to work with DH, not he with her.
She needs a good ol slap upside the head. IF one is going to play head games, one doesn't put down in writing all the disdain and lack of cooperation. BM thinks she is slick, she is acting a fool!
The one thing I'm always thankful for when seeing these communications is that she DOES put all this ridiculousness in emails. It makes it pretty easy to print out and show a judge
She doesn't have any weekend time to offer before the trip occurs. She will only have Christmas break time to offer. If DH agrees to the switch, he'll likely lose the 2 days completely. Not the end of the world, but something BM prides herself on doing.
I think he's going to reply explicitly asking for her dates. The dates don't matter to him, and in the off chance he picks time that matters to her, it will only create more blow up.
At this point, there's no winning. She's only reacting this way because she thinks it will look good in court. She doesn't even have extended family in SC (where this reunion is happening).
He sent the response in almost this exact format (thanks just.his.wife!):
I am not refusing your request, I am waiting to hear from you which weekend/ block of time you are willing to trade for the requested time. If I do not hear from you on a proposed block of time, that we can agree on, By (insert date/time she needs to have the request to you) I will presume you have elected not to have the girls attend the family reunion.
We'll see what she says. I guess she wasn't expecting it, because we didn't get the immediate pre-drafted hate mail response.
I am just throwing this out there because this is that kind of tiff we get into with Donkeykong all the time.
Anytime we agree on a temporary change to custody, it sets a precedent. That is how Donkeykong has been able to effectively "steal" custody time away from us at Easter, Halloween, the summer break, etc. In his mind, he is not stealing anything because we have agreed to the change once thinking it is temporary but the following year the *asshole will say "As was agreed upon last year..."
Wait! what? We never agreed to anything!
For this reason, this is why DW always ends her emails to Donkeykong with the phrase "FOR THIS INSTANCE ONLY!".
Yes, I can see BM trying to do something like this.
Once they reach an agreement on the days-switch, it will be very clearly drafted to provide BM no wiggle room. Not that it matters .. she pretty much does whatever she wants anyway.
She's pregnant? Ugh good grief...on the bright side, a new baby daddy may make her take some focus off of your husband. Odds are, this guy won't be around long anyway.
Why do these women love to complicate their lives?
Seriously doubt it. She's trashed the change order and filed in the courts directly already. SD5 came home last weekend telling us that once the baby is born she needs to spend more time at mommy's house so the baby doesn't forget her.
Yup, she's definitely preggo. We've known about it for a while; skids told us a few weeks ago. I don't think I made a post about it .. doesn't really matter to us, and so far, hasn't caused any specific issues.
Nope, she has a boyfriend that she told the girls she married before they planned to have a baby (yeah, right .. all that happened and her attitude towards more children magically changed in the 3 months since she moved back here full time).
She hasn't changed her last name, so I'm not sure if she's actually remarried or not. Doesn't really matter to us either way .. I wouldn't be surprised if it's true though .. married military folks get more benefits than single ones.
It's pretty sick. I mean, how do you even respond to that without indirectly PAS'ing the kids? DH just tells her that brothers and sisters never forget each other, even when they don't see each other for a long time. He uses his sister who lives out on the west coast as an example; he only sees her every few years, but they still love each other very much.
As if spending two weekend days away will make a kid completely forget about a family member.
Just have him ask her.....do you forget about mommy when you come with us? No. Exactly, and your little sibling won't forget about you either.
Do you forget your sister when you are at school all day? Of coarse not, family doesn't ever forget about each other.
You didn't forget about me when you were in Texas right? And we were apart for months. The baby won't forget about you when you come here for two days.
It's just so messed up that a parent would even plant that seed in their kids' head! This is the only time she's made a comment like that and she seemed satisfied with the answer; so hopefully it doesn't pop up again.
This woman (if you can call her that) really knows no limits ..
My mistake. I guess I was just thinking of a conversation she had with DH telling him how since they divorced she gets so much less money .. which justified why he should be paying more child support.
I can't say I'm surprised that it was a bold-faced lie. Wouldn't be her first one.
BM replied with some long email about how she never told him what days were available because she had no idea what days would work for him on his time. That she was waiting on him to tell her what days he wanted (even though he asked her for days and she never replied; and didn't ask him for days).
Anyway .. he replied with 2 days that fall during winter break (12/23 & 12/27), but not Christmas day, since it's hers this year.
She replied offering him 7 days over winter break instead :?
I have no idea what's she up to .. but I'm assuming she's expecting a new custody arrangement to be in place before then so she won't have to live up to her side of the agreement.
I'm sure she'll ask for days in Spring Break. With any luck, we'll have a new custody order in place by then so it won't be an issue he'll have to argue with her.
She's been arguing all along that she doesn't get enough down time with the skids, so I can't imagine giving away most of her holiday break time with them really helps her argument.
DH is planning to accept all the days she's giving away. The documentation of the whole thing clearly shows him only asking for 2 days, and even identifying which two days he wants. Not sure how she can flip that on him because she handed over more time than he requested, ya know?
The 7 days she gave us aren't continuous. It's 4 days before Christmas and 3 days after. I'm sure she's trying to make herself look good or something, but how does this help her case if she's claiming she doesn't get enough weekend/vacation time? She's literally GIVING DH more than 3x what he asked for in exchange.
In short, BM requested one of
In short, BM requested one of DH's weekends (Oct 4) back in July to take the skids to her family reunion out of state. I use the word "request" losely because she basically told him she was taking them, but I digress. DH replied at that time that he would consider it for a switch of comparable days. She blew it off. My initial post about this yesterday is here: http://steptalk.org/node/166609
So DH replied to her last night and basically said that he would still accept a switch of days to accomodate the trip, but without a reasonable compromise, he would not allow BM to have that weekend.
She flipped, as expected. She replied almost instantly (which leads me to believe she had a draft reply all ready to go):
"Thanks I just wanted to clarify that you were not allowing the girls to see their extended family at a family reunion that you have known about for several months. Obviously it's not your opinion that the girls should have contact with their aunts and uncles and cousins from my side of the family. I guess I will just have try and schedule something during the holiday break seeing as you are not willing to allow a short weekend visit with their family. Thanks again for always putting our daughters first."
This pretty much cements the suspicion that she's trying to build a case to make DH look bad in court for her recent filing.
He replied, very simply: "My offer to switch days still stands."
She replied:
"It was you who proposed a switch of comparative time that would satisfy you in order for the girls to attend. I have been all ears since your suggestion. I figured since you were requesting time in exchange that you would have suggested the weekend or days that suited you. Nothing ever came from you. That is why sent the email to verify. I really don't think 2 days is a lot to ask for our daughters to see their cousins (who are also school age) or their aunts and uncles, and great grand parents. It seems you have made up your mind so I guess this discussion is over. I just wanted to clarify that again you were unwilling to allow the girls to see family that they are not able to see every weekend. That 2 days of your was to much to ask."
DH is done replying. I think he's made it very clear, without all the dramatics, that he's willing to switch days so the girls can go. I don't think he needed to necessarily ask for specific days, as they are BM's days to give. I think making the offer was enough, right?
It sounds like she isn't even
It sounds like she isn't even really reading your DH's emails she is just bent and determined on trying to make your DH sound like the bad guy.
I think I would send one
I think I would send one final email back and cc his attorney:
I am not refusing your request, I am waiting to hear from you which weekend/ block of time you are willing to trade for the requested time. If I do not hear from you on a proposed block of time, that we can agree on, By (insert date/time she needs to have the request to you) I will presume you have elected not to have the girls attend the family reunion.
Thank you.
This^^^. Be sure he keeps all
This^^^.
Be sure he keeps all of the correspondence to show that he absolutely did make a reasonable effort to resolve the conflict & she refused to work with him.
This is good. I shared this
This is good. I shared this with him and I think this is the format he's going to start with.
He's not denying the switch.
He's not denying the switch. She hasn't offered any dates to switch for. She emailed him in July telling him she was taking the girls for that Oct weekend. It's his time. He replied and said, "that's my weekend. please let me know which two days you'd like to switch"
She replied to THAT with "when we do this change order I'm getting every other weekend so that wil be my weekend anyway"
No change order ever happened. She never brought it up again.
She still hasn't provided available dates, despite being asked and offered the switch AGAIN yesterday.
He asked her, very explicitly
He asked her, very explicitly on several occasions which days she would like to switch. I don't see why he needed to propose specific dates .. the dates don't really matter to him. It's her time she needs to give up to switch, so she should have the opportunity to offer dates that work for her.
Proposing dates to this woman would only open another avenue for her to argue .. because that's ALL it ever is with her. No win.
That BM will always play the
That BM will always play the martyr and victim. SMDH.
Your DH is more than willing to switch dates, she just doesn't want to give up her time, she just wants DH to look like the bad guy. Piece of work!
DH needs to respond to her email with....."You seem to have a comprehension problem, no where in any email correspondence did I state that you could not take the girls on this trip to your family reunion. I stated that I'd be more than accommodating but to let me know the make up dates. Looking at the calendar the next time that can we switched is during Christmas break. As it seems that I have to be the one to state the obvious, I will take these 2 days (XX/XX/XXXX-XX/XX/XXXX)" If she comes back with anything other than ok, sounds good, she is not willing to work with DH, not he with her.
She needs a good ol slap upside the head. IF one is going to play head games, one doesn't put down in writing all the disdain and lack of cooperation. BM thinks she is slick, she is acting a fool!
The one thing I'm always
The one thing I'm always thankful for when seeing these communications is that she DOES put all this ridiculousness in emails. It makes it pretty easy to print out and show a judge
RESPOND!!.... Dear Idiot.
RESPOND!!....
Dear Idiot. (May not really want to say that!)
We must have some miss communication issues because I NEVER said I was not willing to let them go.
How about you take this extra weekend and I will take the weekend of the blablabla?
Sound good?
Or, you may really want to
Or, you may really want to say it...but don't. LOL!
She doesn't have any weekend
She doesn't have any weekend time to offer before the trip occurs. She will only have Christmas break time to offer. If DH agrees to the switch, he'll likely lose the 2 days completely. Not the end of the world, but something BM prides herself on doing.
I think he's going to reply
I think he's going to reply explicitly asking for her dates. The dates don't matter to him, and in the off chance he picks time that matters to her, it will only create more blow up.
At this point, there's no winning. She's only reacting this way because she thinks it will look good in court. She doesn't even have extended family in SC (where this reunion is happening).
He sent the response in
He sent the response in almost this exact format (thanks just.his.wife!):
I am not refusing your request, I am waiting to hear from you which weekend/ block of time you are willing to trade for the requested time. If I do not hear from you on a proposed block of time, that we can agree on, By (insert date/time she needs to have the request to you) I will presume you have elected not to have the girls attend the family reunion.
We'll see what she says. I guess she wasn't expecting it, because we didn't get the immediate pre-drafted hate mail response.
I am just throwing this out
I am just throwing this out there because this is that kind of tiff we get into with Donkeykong all the time.
Anytime we agree on a temporary change to custody, it sets a precedent. That is how Donkeykong has been able to effectively "steal" custody time away from us at Easter, Halloween, the summer break, etc. In his mind, he is not stealing anything because we have agreed to the change once thinking it is temporary but the following year the *asshole will say "As was agreed upon last year..."
Wait! what? We never agreed to anything!
For this reason, this is why DW always ends her emails to Donkeykong with the phrase "FOR THIS INSTANCE ONLY!".
Yes, I can see BM trying to
Yes, I can see BM trying to do something like this.
Once they reach an agreement on the days-switch, it will be very clearly drafted to provide BM no wiggle room. Not that it matters .. she pretty much does whatever she wants anyway.
She's pregnant? Ugh good
She's pregnant? Ugh good grief...on the bright side, a new baby daddy may make her take some focus off of your husband. Odds are, this guy won't be around long anyway.
Why do these women love to complicate their lives?
Seriously doubt it. She's
Seriously doubt it. She's trashed the change order and filed in the courts directly already. SD5 came home last weekend telling us that once the baby is born she needs to spend more time at mommy's house so the baby doesn't forget her.
Wait, did I miss a post? Bm
Wait, did I miss a post? Bm might be pregnant?
Yup, she's definitely preggo.
Yup, she's definitely preggo. We've known about it for a while; skids told us a few weeks ago. I don't think I made a post about it .. doesn't really matter to us, and so far, hasn't caused any specific issues.
So much for "I love you girls
So much for "I love you girls too much to ever have another baby". I dunno why I thought your bm was single...
Nope, she has a boyfriend
Nope, she has a boyfriend that she told the girls she married before they planned to have a baby (yeah, right .. all that happened and her attitude towards more children magically changed in the 3 months since she moved back here full time).
She hasn't changed her last name, so I'm not sure if she's actually remarried or not. Doesn't really matter to us either way .. I wouldn't be surprised if it's true though .. married military folks get more benefits than single ones.
It's pretty sick. I mean,
It's pretty sick. I mean, how do you even respond to that without indirectly PAS'ing the kids? DH just tells her that brothers and sisters never forget each other, even when they don't see each other for a long time. He uses his sister who lives out on the west coast as an example; he only sees her every few years, but they still love each other very much.
As if spending two weekend
As if spending two weekend days away will make a kid completely forget about a family member.
Just have him ask her.....do you forget about mommy when you come with us? No. Exactly, and your little sibling won't forget about you either.
Do you forget your sister when you are at school all day? Of coarse not, family doesn't ever forget about each other.
You didn't forget about me when you were in Texas right? And we were apart for months. The baby won't forget about you when you come here for two days.
It's just so messed up that a
It's just so messed up that a parent would even plant that seed in their kids' head! This is the only time she's made a comment like that and she seemed satisfied with the answer; so hopefully it doesn't pop up again.
This woman (if you can call her that) really knows no limits ..
My mistake. I guess I was
My mistake. I guess I was just thinking of a conversation she had with DH telling him how since they divorced she gets so much less money .. which justified why he should be paying more child support.
I can't say I'm surprised that it was a bold-faced lie. Wouldn't be her first one.
Update: BM replied with some
Update:
BM replied with some long email about how she never told him what days were available because she had no idea what days would work for him on his time. That she was waiting on him to tell her what days he wanted (even though he asked her for days and she never replied; and didn't ask him for days).
Anyway .. he replied with 2 days that fall during winter break (12/23 & 12/27), but not Christmas day, since it's hers this year.
She replied offering him 7 days over winter break instead :?
I have no idea what's she up to .. but I'm assuming she's expecting a new custody arrangement to be in place before then so she won't have to live up to her side of the agreement.
I'm sure she'll ask for days
I'm sure she'll ask for days in Spring Break. With any luck, we'll have a new custody order in place by then so it won't be an issue he'll have to argue with her.
She's been arguing all along that she doesn't get enough down time with the skids, so I can't imagine giving away most of her holiday break time with them really helps her argument.
DH is planning to accept all the days she's giving away. The documentation of the whole thing clearly shows him only asking for 2 days, and even identifying which two days he wants. Not sure how she can flip that on him because she handed over more time than he requested, ya know?
The 7 days she gave us aren't
The 7 days she gave us aren't continuous. It's 4 days before Christmas and 3 days after. I'm sure she's trying to make herself look good or something, but how does this help her case if she's claiming she doesn't get enough weekend/vacation time? She's literally GIVING DH more than 3x what he asked for in exchange.