What is wrong with these people
I have been on this site multiple times to help me through multiple dilemmas. So much so that I am a little embarrassed to be back here asking for more help. I've managed to hold on to my marriage because I really wanted to, however I know I am in a no win situation and I am slowly fading away. I have an important position at my job and I notice an increasing inability to stand up and speak up about things its my job to speak up about. I connect this with the constant feeling of unimportance I feel at home and the constant knowing that at home, my mouth is to remain shut about things that are important to me. We are having a very cold snowy winter where I live so moving right not is not something I feel I can do, but as soon as the weather breaks, I'm outta here.... I hope. Money is not a problem. I'll be just fine on my own. I have a good, responsible 26 year old son of my own who lives miles and miles away from me. He is living his life, calls me often and loves me to death. He is hardworking and respectful. My life regret is that I was never able to give him much of a family. I landed us in this situation hoping for just that. I cook beatutiful meals and include my skids when he is in town so he gets the sense there is a family to come home to. I'm 56 myself and a little concerned about facing old age and retirement alone, but there has got to be another answer.
Today I have a question rather than a problem to fix. What is wrong with this picture? Why are things this way? Are these just normal things that some families do and I'm the one thats wrong?? My husband is a 62 year old man who has 2 adult children 25 boy and 23 girl. The girl does go to college and lives half at her moms house and half at her boyfriends. She has a live and only occasionally barges in on mine. The 25 son however lives full time at his moms house residing in her basement. At 25 I think he has worked 1-1.5 years out of his whole life. Living in his moms basement he does some very very part time computer work for some woman he knows. Rarely paid and when he is its cash..... no taxes, no 401 contribution, nothing being contributed to social security, no health care. I have tried to have civil conversations with my husband voicing my concern for the boy. He has no friends and does not drive. He is wasting what should be magical youthful years of his life. His 62 year old dad is his only friend. He leaves the house only when his dad comes to pick him up. They take walks together, go sledding together, plan vacations, watch movies, have political debates, smoke weed, and just hang out together usually 2-3 times a week all while I am at work...... besides my own son, I am the only adult in the family with a job. Husband retired on his dads inheritance.
It's clear that his relationship with his son far exceeds the one he has with me. It's like his son is his partner, and I am treated like a child. I tell husband that I want this arrangement changed, I'll mention the retardation that this is causing the boys life. My interest has to do with as much the skids welfare as it does mine. I'll often ask... how long will this lifestyle go on. Anything I mention, oh it throws him into a fit. He screams at me, gets 2 inches from my face and tells me to butt out..... why can't I learn to mind my own business, he screams. I take his behavior as being he knows it is all wrong, but he likes the friendship he has with the kid. They are best buds. If the kid is asked to live a normal life and actually work, husband will lose his friend. Obviously I'm not nearly as fun to be around so a replacement I would not be. Last night I was able to talk him down after setting him off and promised I would never mention the kids again. I won't. I'll do that disengage thing and explain to my son that he in fact has no family other than me. I'll plan to work on my husbands birthday, because as I learned last year, he would rather be with them. There is supposed to be a family vacation this spring. I gotta figure out a way to tell him I am not going before he sends the money for the reservation..... He's gonna be really mad about that. When they are off on their vacation this spring, I'll leave. Sad too is the kids mother uses him as a companion too, letting him void out on life so she is not alone and has someone around to shovel the driveway. What is wrong with these people? It has not always been this way. It has got progressivly worse over the last 3 years or so..... worse since my husband retired.
I do have one special place in my husbands life though and that is his sex recepticle. It's getting increasingly difficult to submit to his advances, but if I don't, I pay dearly. right now I think my main need is just keeping the peace.
What I want to hear from you friends, is whats wrong with these people?
They are sick f*cks. That's
They are sick f*cks. That's what's wrong with them.
On top of that, this man screams 2 inches from your face. That alone would be enough for me to exit stage left.
I understand you want to get your ducks in a row but dang is it really worth it? Why not go visit a lawyer today, change the locks tomorrow, and have him served that afternoon? If he gets awful serve him with an order of protection next.
You cannot get out of there fast enough. Go!!!!! Do not soul-search and try to "understand" the whole spaghetti tangle of the last however many years you've been with him. Just. Go.
Marriageplus2 - You have
Marriageplus2 - You have become their doormat, and your huzband and the BM are happy as clams to have someone to enable. Your husband has become abusive, and belittling as you have become the stronger one, earning your own money and in a good career, while he probably feels useless.
I would say, you know what you need to do, and analyzing them isn't going to help you at this point. While you are waiting for the "right time" and strategizing, please please please work on yourself - loving yourself, and doing for YOU. Plan for your retirement, sock money away like crazy, work out, or do something athletic, church groups, anything to make YOU stronger. I am doing the same, in case things do not work out with my SO. Hes got 2 children and one has become a huge problem. The future for us has become uncertain and I am trying to regain the me I used to like. so my take on things is that:
1. They are all co-dependant.
2. They are using you to wipe the poop off the bottom of their shoes (that should make you mad)
3. Whats wrong with THEM? You should be looking at YOU? Why would you put up with your spouse screaming at you like that? Walk away. Forever.
Fruit, smoking weed with DD
Fruit, smoking weed with DD has proven to be very bonding. The only thing better is snuggling naked with her.
Regardless of whether or not
Regardless of whether or not she should say anything about her adult SS, she does have a right to a voice in her own home. From the sound of things, anytime she does something that is against what her DH wants, he gets irate. She is even concerned about cancelling her vacation.
She feels as if she has no say in her own home and it is spilling over into her feelings about herself and her job.
She shouldn't spend the rest of her life being a doormat.
I had an extremely verbally abusive XH and know exactly how it feels to have someone screaming at you 2 inches from your face, for hours.
She needs to get out. He will not change, he is happy the way it is. She needs to leave him.
You're mostly right. I was
You're mostly right. I was hoping to hear someone say this to me. Let me explain a little further and see if you still agree with what you said. My husband is here in the evenings (8pm) when I get home from work. The kid leaves seconds before I arrive home. my husband sometimes fixes me dinner and pours me a glass of wine. We sit and talk or watch a movie before bed. Before my father in law passed away (and my husband inherited all his money), my husband would spend a stressful hour or 2 every day after his work to see his father in the nursing home. I understood that perfectly... no problem. My husband used to always say " when dad dies, WE are taking a vacation". Dad died and husband spent 6 months planning and elaborate vacation.... for him and the skids and they have been together ever since. We go on small trips now and then, but husband refuses to fly so that leaves us little to choose from.
Last year, husbands birthday, I took the day off work and wanted to take him to a nice dinner. He wanted to spend his birthday with the skids. I was invited to lunch with them. So I took the 4 of us out to lunch instead of my husband and I out to a nice dinner. His birthday is coming up again. This year I'll just stay at work.
I AM jealous. He runs around and plays like a 12 year old. Games and sledding. Sledding sounds fun, sure, but I'm not going to risk my livlihood by hurting my back or breaking my leg at the age of 56, since really I am all I have. I can hike, bike, and camp as good as the 3 of them. Sometimes he and I go, but it just seems he would rather go with them. I refuse to sit around smoking weed with him. He still smokes, but I think it must be more fun to smoke with someone... maybe... I don't know. Bottom line is his best friends are in their 20's and I'm 56. I can't compete with the youth they make him feel. I am as jealous of them as I would be if he was seeing a younger, prettier woman, because frankly, he might as well be. They are his little mini wives. It has nothing to do with the time or money he spends on them. It has to do what they give to his soul.... i guess this is why "I care". I don't have what he wants and it concern me. It concerns me very very much. So when I have mentioned it, asked for it to change, told him why it hurts me, it is a threat to him. It's like I am asking him to give up everything he loves when I suggest it might be better that his 25 year old son is out working and forging his own path in life. He fights to hold on to what he has so hard that he ends up in my face screaming at me to butt out.
The only thing he can't do with his little mini wives is what he uses me for.... 2 things. Every other Friday I bring home a paycheck that pays the mortgage, keeping a roof over "the 3 musketeers club house" and sex. He wants to top his wonderful life off with a passionate sex life. Can you imagine how turned off I am? But I better muster the excitement and desire, because if I don't he stomps and pouts around the house refusing to speak to me at all. Any words from him tear into my wounds even further and I usually end up in tears. His only words to me then are to remind me how old and washed up I am, that menopause is making me useless to him... but not in those words exactly. He says something like "you just don't think about it or you just don't think that way"..... referring to me as just a fridged old woman wouldn't you say? Which I'm not. I like sex, I just don't like him because of the material he has used to build the foundation of our marriage. There is never rape, as some have read into my first letter.
I wish I didn't have to leave. My husband is not that bad of a guy. It's just these skids took over my place while I've been away at work. I imagine it is their underhanded way to get their daddy back. The one that chose to leave them 13 years ago. They have him back and they keep his ego so fed and fulfilled. I'm sure they can't imagine him needing anything or anyone else. They have him where they want him and they're willing to sacrifice their own existance to keep him. I'll leave because I have been pushed out. I can't compete with two youthful mini wives that fulfill his life. It's been made perfectly clear to me that my happiness is not a matter for discussion.
Thank you Cleavergirl99 for your input and helping me see things from a different perspective. I am going to think about stuffing my feelings, jealousy, and resentment away. And if he could stop reminding me how much better they are than me, perhaps I could forget they even exist and be happy with the husband I have??
My advice is, do not divulge
My advice is, do not divulge your plans in any way to your DH or other family. The less said, the less danger or risk to you. Nver mind about the holiday reservation. That can be wasted. You can "fall ill" just before you are due to go away, and he and his enmeshed son can buzz off by themselves.
Look, when I told my ex things were over, he turned violent. And this was a man I had never seen be violent. Be careful.
Spend the cold winter getting your plan B in order. Where will you move to? Can you rent the place in advance and slowly move things to prepare? You will save yourself a LOT of grief if you retain control and the power of surprise. Just move when you have a plan fully in place. In fact, it will lift your spirits to start scheduling now.
You won't want him to know your location. Think of how much less stressed you'll be when you are free of his control. You can then focus on seeing your own son and pursuing your work and your own normal life. 56 is not old, I am 58 and still enjoying a busy career. You will have plenty of chances for better companionship. Your son is an adult and likely would be glad to be rid of the crazy baggage of his step"family".
^^^^100 percent agreement!
^^^^100 percent agreement!
DO NOT inform your husband in advance of any plans you make. Let the vacation planning go right ahead; it will give you time to cover all your bases.
There is absolutely no need for you to stay in this situation. It doesn't matter what may or may not have prompted your DH's behavior - it is completely unacceptable.
So what if he's feeling inferior because he's now retired? So what if he loves his son to death and likes spending time with him? None of that is a reason to use you as a whipping post, exclude you, make his ADULT son his foremost companion and it certainly doesn't give him license to shout in your face. And then expect great sex.
Making SECRET plans about a future without all this will be very liberating. It will allow you to get through the planning process and get a solid foundation, without a so-called "husband" blocking your way.
While you are certainly young enough to start over and have a wonderful fulfilling life, you are also at an age where you don't want to waste any more time in a relationship that is not meeting your needs. Go. Just go.
^^^^^THIS^^^^^^
^^^^^THIS^^^^^^
Thanks. Any plans I have, I
Thanks. Any plans I have, I will keep to myself. Most people are shocked to learn I am 56 (or will be in 3 weeks)... .lets not push it huh? People tell me I look and act much younger. That makes me feel good, but damn with everything I have been through I feel worn and haggered. I know my life would be much healthier on my own. I eat not as good as I should and I drink way more than I should to combat the stress. With the stress of this relationship gone, I can see myself getting healthy and fit.
I worry about my son. I dragged us into this situation 11 years ago. He's all on his own now with a life of his own, but I think maybe he finds some comfort in knowing his mom is not alone. I don't let on to him how bad it is, but he does know the skids are my husbands crown jewels. Maybe he would be happy to know I was getting out. I plan on having a face to face talk with him at some point.
Thank you. Honestly, I have
Thank you. Honestly, I have never been a really happy person deep inside. I can feel happy, have happy times, happy memories, happy experiences, but deep down I'm just kinda blah. People usually don't see that side of me. I am typically well liked and appreciated for my good sense of humor. it's not the snow. I have lived in the snow my whole life. Just this year it has been extreme with cold and snow.
I appreciate some of you reminding me how my husbands relationship with his son is his own. I responded to Clevergirl99 the ins and outs of that. I am thinking about smothering my feelings on the subject to see if that would make a difference.... but I don't know. Read what I wrote to clevergirl.
You ask how do I bring up my concerns to my husband. I talk calmly about what his son is doing, where he is going, how he and his exwife are not preparing him for an adult life. I say the kid is 25 he should be out in clubs, working, getting and education, having fun with friends his age, having girlfriends. I express my concern for the kids life in the long run. I say maybe if the kid did 25 year old things and we did adult things with friends our age, maybe we would be happier. I know my approach is attacking even though I am speaking calmly, but I don't know how else to say it. He responds by screaming at me 2 inches from my face. Communication is not an option here. He wants to do what he wants to do and he wants me to keep my feelings and opinions to myself... period. counciling won't help we have tried and tried. Even trie IMAGO method. We spent 700.00 for a 2 day class. We left feeling so fixed, so happy and hopeful. The moment we got home IMAGO went out the window. The very first time I asked to use it, he said "ooooo do we have to IMAGO everything"? Counciling won't help. We have been together and I have been separate. What he needs is some counciling on his own, but in his eyes he is too perfect to need help. I'm the problem.
To answer your questions:
I don't know if I can stay, probably not.
I'm not okay with having to keep my mouth shut and feeling unvalidated.
I can see disengaging building further resentment
He does not care to understand or appreciate my needs. I can come home from a long 13 hour shift at work and be physically and mentally exhausted, but sex is still expected. He does not have any appreciation for any of my needs....not one. It's just always about him.
When I'm not at work, he will often tell son "not today, wifes home" but more often then not he sends out a text to the skids telling them what days I'm at worK. "Fri, sat, sun shindig possible" the text will read. they call their get togethers shindigs.
I think often about how I want to spend my later years, and right this isn't it. My plan actually is to land where ever my son lands after school to start his family. I gave so many years to being away from my own family to be near his and this is the thanks I get. I refuse to spend my grandma years away from grandchildren too. Frankly I can't see husban being happy to leave his little niche.
Thanks for your insite! appreciated
"He is living his life, calls
"He is living his life, calls me often and loves me to death. He is hardworking and respectful. My life regret is that I was never able to give him much of a family." You gave your son YOU and that is more important than introducing him to people and telling him they are his family now. I'll bet if you asked him he would be more concerned about your happiness.
Your DH has helped to create an atmosphere in your marriage where you do not feel worthy of the same attention he is giving to his son. If he does not spend the same quality time with you that he does with his son, if you do not go on vacations - just the two of you, if he spends time with his son, leaving you alone for extended periods of time, then he has an unhealthy enmeshed relationship with his son. He is not cherishing you as a wife.
Maybe trying counselling - just you, would be of a great benefit to you right now. With your job and accomplishments you should be feeling good about yourself. If you show your DH that you respect yourself he will start respecting you or you will gain enough self-respect to do what is good for you.
This is soul searching and
This is soul searching and should be done.
I have had some great
I have had some great counciling. I left with my councilor saying "how old do you want to be before you are happy"? I run those words through my head every day. I don't see what counciling can do for me anymore. I have all the answers I need.
I'm not happy, and my life is passing me by quickly now.
This marriage is not about my happiness, it's about his. Never ever will I voice my concern about those skids ever again. It gets me know where but screamed at.
I know that my financial independence is huge. I'm lucky to have that. I am by no means rich, but I have a good secure job and some retirement saved and very little dept. Fear is probably what stops me. I keep thinking though that maybe there might be something outhere for me. I might just not end up alone. Though....... Never will I be a married women ever again.... Never!!
You may live another 40 years
You may live another 40 years or so. Do you want to live like this for another 40 years? Get out as fast as you can. I agree do not tell him your plans. Let him plan the vacation and waste your ticket- who cares? Just take care of YOU.
Thank you
Thank you
The problem with "these
The problem with "these people", they don't have a life. My DH and SD are the same way. They are missing so much by not "live and let live". I love the diversity of my friends and family.
I was wondering the same
I was wondering the same thing. Does he literally force himself on you? Using the word "submit" implies that he does. How do you pay - is he physically abusive? A married woman can be raped by her husband.
I pay dearly by him stomping
I pay dearly by him stomping and pouting though the house. He refuses to speak to me, but if he does he just belittles me about being a cold, sexless, fridged, menopausal old woman. Which usually leaves me in tears. I'm not any of those things. I'm just turned off by him and the material he has used to build the foundation of our marriage.... but you know I can't say that to him. Thanks for letting me say it here.
No. No. No. NO. Your husband
No. No. No. NO.
Your husband IS that bad. (from one of your other posts where you said "he isn't that bad.) Yes. Yes, he is.
Get out of there and let him use his fabulous seduction technique on all the single women out there. I'm sure they'll be lining up.
When you are treated like this you get weaker every day. The longer you stay, the harder it will be to leave.
Being alone would BE BETTER THAN THIS. Try it. Really.
Who cares about him, his mini-wives, and his Tokeville Shindig Slaphappy life? Who cares?!
Your life is about YOU. I will repeat my earlier advice: See a lawyer tomorrow, change the locks, serve him. Never speak to him again.
There is nothing attractive about this man. He's mean. He's disgusting. He's irresponsible. He's selfish/narcissistic. And he's destroying you. You have everything to gain and nothing to lose by getting rid of him. Your son will be happy for you. Do it NOW.
you are probably right... he
you are probably right... he is that bad. I have spoken to a lawyer. I don't want this house. I would be the one to leave. What state do you live in that a woman can tell a man to leave and change the locks never to speak to him again. Where I come from, he can stay as long as he needs to or until a judge tells him to get out... which from what I am told, isnt fast. much easier for me to bide my time and leave when the snow melts. I've had it. I'm not going to sit here powerless to some basement dweller dictating my life. Thanks.... I wish you and I lived near each other!
I'm with Chief Grownup - you
I'm with Chief Grownup - you need to leave. Start making plans now so you can do it in the Spring. In the meantime I'd stay as far away from him as possible.
People change the locks on
People change the locks on each other and throw each other out all the time. But you should certainly follow the advice of your lawyer. Which I am so glad to hear you have acquired one! That is so empowering and that is exactly what you need, your power back. This man has been eroding your sense of personhood for a long time.
One of our other members got her ducks in a row and finally left her good for nothing h. Within a couple months the man had married his mistress -- BUT our member soon found a new boyfriend who is legions above her ex in every way. She's very happy.
She was methodical about leaving. But she was not in the physical and psychic danger you are in, either.
Follow your lawyer's advice but please do it as quickly as possibly and yes I agree with others, don't tell him. He's had his chance. Telling him will only lead to more drama and possible financial and physical danger.
Aww! Thanks for the kind words! Now gird up your woman power and make us proud! Every day do something to further your plan and then make your break! We are all cheering for you!
what your husband has is a
what your husband has is a mini wife. mini wifes can be men like your ss.
you have to decide just how much the relationship is worth and then act on that decision.
i know how you feel.
Yes, I have Katie Lee
Yes, I have Katie Lee Douglas's book. Going to reread it. Yes his son is his little 25 year old mini wive. Everything they do together should be things he shares with me, but because he has already done them with the ss, the real wife and marriage suffers. Why he can't see that I will never understand.
Be happy that the adult skids
Be happy that the adult skids are not living in your home...... that's the only positive in this
Now simply start doing your own thing with your kid, let DH be with his new child wife.... then work on an exit plan, you do not need to be second fiddle to this man and his boy wife.... if DH really loves you and not only using you as a maid and bed warmer he will pick up on this and start hanging out with you....
Now the golden rule is you no longer talk about him and his boy wife, you keep quiet, you do not inform him about your plans you just do your own thing...... if DH never picks up on it you simply file for divorce, that's the consequence for not treating your wife like a wife but rather like a maid and sex object
Well I can plan a few visits
Well I can plan a few visits with my own son. husband usually expects to be invited to these visits however. It will hit him hard if I tell him to stay home.... which might be a good thing. I would never carry on the kind of relationship with my son as he does with his. I am proud that my son has found a life of his own. he is 26, works full time, lives in another/bigger city, has a charming girlfriend, and they are both college students in the medical field. They do the kinds of things healthy 20 somethings do.... in my opinion.
I am going to start doing my own thing though. It's a little tough cuz I feel like I'm having to pull myself up by the boot straps, but I know I must. I have promised myself that I will never mention these kids again. Boy wife..... I like that. Thats the term I'll use in my head. It sounds so degrading toward him. I mean, what 25 year old man wants to be called a boy wife
I am usually pretty cautious
I am usually pretty cautious about dumping a marriage. This really sounds like a run far, run fast situation...
Agree with other posters-keep your plans to yourself. Let them go on vacation and use that time to figure out what to do. Plan carefully. If you have never seen the movie "Sleeping With The Enemy" it might be a good idea to watch it. I had to do something similar long ago, as have a couple of my friends.
Think about where you might like to live. Imagine the life you might like to have. Then figure out what steps you need to take. Have a lawyer in your plans, the paperwork ready, and your plans in place. The first year might be rough. But not as rough as what you describe you are living now.
We all should have the expectation that we are treated with respect, put first in our DH's life. The abuse you are describing is unacceptable.
Very best wishes, and hopes for your future peace and happiness.