For those dealing with parental alienation

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For those of you out there dealing with PAS, there is an awesome DVD that SS13's psychologist had him watch with both parents (separately). It's called "Welcome Back Pluto" and it lays it ALL out there in a way that kids can understand. It doesn't sugar coat things. HIGHLY recommended!

what is parental alienation??

When one parent tries to turn

When one parent tries to turn the child against the other parent. There are so many ways to do this, and some are very subtle. Our BM uses subtle and very NOT subtle...calling DH names, complaining about him, being downright nasty...It would take me a year to write everything she does. She does not want the kids with DH and does whatever she can to stop it. Unfortunately, SD is 19 and the damage is done. Hopefully as she gets older, she'll see the truth about BM. SS is 13 and we're trying to undo the damage that has already been done while he's still spending time here by CO.

The alienation has set in

The alienation has set in with my DH's kids. Is it something that is more beneficial to kids who are in the process of fighting alienation, or is it something that helps the kids cope with the alienation after they have already fallen into it?

I think it's good for any

I think it's good for any point in the alienation process. It helps them understand right/wrong behaviors...in essence, it shows them the "truth". If nothing else, it plants seeds so when the alienating parent does something, the kid will recognize it. I believe it's especially important if the alienation is going on now, or if it just started so the child can recognize it. The alienating parent will probably continue, but the child will know it's wrong...at least that's the goal. It really helps them see the alienatED parent differently.

I think it's good for any

My SS turned 18 a month ago

My SS turned 18 a month ago and hasn't spoke with his father in approx. a year thanks to BM's successful campaign of alientation. DH was the bad guy for always drug testing him and trying to hold him accountable for his addiction, and laying boundaries.

You indicated beneficial at any stage of the process - is it geared more toward little kids? I know we are probably a lost cause at this point - but can't help to think there has to be a way.......

Our psychologist just worked

Our psychologist just worked with a family with a 17 year old boy, and the father (the one who was doing the alienation) actually apologized to the mother. It's made to be understood by younger kids, but I would give it a try if you can get SS to watch it. Don't give up. Your SS is still young, and at 18 they "know it all". Therapists have repeatedly told my DH.."Just keep loving them and NEVER give up". There is a part in the DVD that gives parents tips on dealing with it too. You could watch it yourselves first...maybe it will give you hope back.

I have a friend whose ex totally alienated his kids. His daughter actually said, "I hate you, you are not my father". Ouch. But as his daughter got older, maybe mid 20s, got married and started having kids, she started realizing what actually went on. They now have a relationship back! NEVER give up hope...NEVER give up!! If you watch the DVD, let me know what you think.

Is this considered

Is this considered alientation:
The BM of one of my boyfriends kids doesn't include my boyfriend in on any of his childs school performance, extracurricular affairs, etc. And it's not uncommon for her to have big plans for her son when it's my boyfriends weekend to see him. And when my boyfriend tells her NO, she simple does whatever she wants anyway and never returns any of his calls or texts. He'll try to then get him the next weekend (her weekend) and again, she won't return his calls or texts. And she won't tell him where she lives. He went 3 weeks without talking or seeing his son because of this crap. He tries to call him, but she won't pick up the phone and he is too young for a cellphone of his own.

My boyfriend and his son aren't very close because of this crap, however, my boyfriend wants like hell to be a good father and wants to be close to him. He is taking BM back to court for 50/50....

the kid is 6. I hope their relationship can be salvaged. And I wonder if this video will do them any good. I know the BM won't want to watch it...

Sounds a lot like what our BM

Sounds a lot like what our BM did right after their divorce, SS was 9 at the time. I'm a firm believer that all of that stuff really tears at those kids and they feel a certain loyalty to the parent they live with and are around the most.

Nip it in the bud if you can at all. Encourage him to keep trying and fight. We haven't spoken to my SS in a year and it tears at my DH every day. He turned 18 this past month and from what we hear is back to dealing drugs again. He was arrested at 16 for dealing and using, we've known he's still an addict, and that's part of the issues we have. Dad is made out to be the bad guy because he wants to test him and put him in rehab and BM is the fun, loving mom because it's not big deal.

But, I firmly believe the way BM handled things with him and her "hate dad campaign - my stuff and my family are more important" - really put things into a downward spiral (especially his drug use). Imagine being a kid, torn so much by loving both of your parents......you could see where some of them start using drugs to forget about it all....

And shame on the people doing this to their own children...more worried about fulfilling their own needs for revenge and hate than raising a child surrounded by love and respect regardless of the life situation.

"And shame on the people

"And shame on the people doing this to their own children...more worried about fulfilling their own needs for revenge and hate than raising a child surrounded by love and respect regardless of the life situation".

AMEN!!! I love the way you put this. I'm so sorry about your situation. Drugs and addiction complicate things so much. His thoughts might not be clear enough to see the truth. Unfortunately, with addiction, many times the addict has to suffer severe consequences before they straighten up, if they do. I hope it doesn't take anything too terrible. Unfortunately, he's equating love with the "fun" parent. Someday I hope he realizes that love IS setting boundries and rules. I just don't get it...how can that BM think doing and selling drugs is not that bad?????

BM had caught SS at 13 with

BM had caught SS at 13 with drugs and regularly. My DH wasn't notified until he was arrested at 16. Felony for using AND selling on school grounds. At that point she had no choice but to tell him because he would be getting contacted by the courts as he had joint custody. When DH asked her why she didn't call sooner to get help from those side so it didn't get to this point - she said "I didn't think you cared, you know, now that you have a new son with your new wife". And that is the exact verbiage SS used everytime after that when he and DH got into it.

BM has older son by different guy who has similar drug issues. At one point she admitted in court that she was having older son SELL the drugs to help with court costs. They slapped her wrist.

Hope she's happy. Both are addicts and stand zero chance of being productive members of society. But oh well, at least she was able to piss off their fathers. Neither boy have anything to do with their fathers. Both my DH and the other guy have gone for a beer. Each kid told their dads off when they started testing them regularly and trying to get them in rehab. Mom convinced them that the dads didn't have a right to do that because she was custodial. And of course as an addict you are going to do whatever it takes to keep yourself in a position of using. Hence, telling the tester off.

That is why I warn people about PAS and what it could lead to for the kids. Having stuff planned on the fathers weekend, undermining him doesn't seem too drastic but when you put yourself in the kids shoes and all those LITTLE things can add up to something pretty major like our situation. The first sign of PAS -take action for the well being of the kids. Otherwise it seems to spin out of control pretty quick. Makes you wonder how many kids end their relationships with a parent based on what other parent did. Very sad.

It definitely will take something drastic for SS to see; unfortunately we are really feeling lately that sooner or later he will overdose. Everytime he gets caught she and her attorney get a new diagnosis from a shrink and add meds (latest is lithium, Seroquel xlr and wellbutrin according to his grandma). Keeps him out of jail and on his black tar heroine and acid.

Sorry for the length - we just live everyday waiting for that call and I dont vent much anymore because it does my DH no good.

Wow, I'm just sitting here

Wow, I'm just sitting here shaking my head. I could never conceive a child, but people like that BM pop them out and don't deserve them. I don't even have words to describe how I feel about people like her. Well, I have words, but I'm a Christian and don't want to use them. I'm just so sorry you have to live that. Sadly, without any treatment, it's very possible you will get that call.

I agree, if you even suspect PAS, jump on it. It's taken my DH over 4 years to get the courts to do ANYTHING at all besides slap BM on the wrist. It is yet to be seen if they will do anything this time, but at least we have a parenting time coordinator (I'm still not sure he's that effective) and psychologist in place. So far I like the psychologist, and he's the one having everybody watch the DVD.

I really pray that your SS can get turned around. It doesn't look possible now, but anything is possible.

It sure sounds like

It sure sounds like alienation to me. She's keeping the kids away from him during his parenting time. She's undermining his authority by ignoring when he says no, she's teaching her child that they can do whatever they want, regardless of the rules. Our BM also plans things on DH's parenting time. It makes me so mad...it makes it impossible for us to plan anything. We just had to postpone vacation because of it (well, that was one of the reasons). SD19 was the other reason, but I won't get into that now.

I can tell you what therapists have told my DH...do not give up. Do not stop fighting for the child. Years from now, the child will remember. If he stops fighting, the child will ask why didn't you fight harder. My DH wants to be able to look them in the eye and say I never stopped fighting.

You might consider seeing a therapist to guide you in how to counteract the damage the BM is doing. Definitely watch the DVD and decide if you want to show it to SS. Your SS is pretty young, so hopefully you can nip it in the bud. If a therapist is involved, BM might straighten up a little. Good luck!

I never really thought she

I never really thought she was using PAS until I read all these comments. Of course its been 14yrs. But here are the things I remembered:

She walked in and started talking to DH and then said yeah lauhged and said But you love me more right- to SD

She would call SD (8 at the time) and tell her she was going to see a movie that Sd wanted to see and SD would ask her to wait and she said No I've already got plans with so and so ( a girl her age) and you are at your dads.

She would tell skids that how we disciplined was wrong and if it happened again to tell her and she would do something about it.

She would repeatedly tell DH that the kids didn't like coming to. Our house. Though we didn't see those signs for several years.

She Would have the kids call the day of or day before an activity (like choir performance) this went on for several years until she Figured out that we were going around her to get the info.

She told SD that the backpacxk I bought her fell apart because I bought cheap stuff for her- hello it was MUDD

She made sure that the SK included step in front of sibling or Half. While both my kids refer to SK as brother and sister.

SD quit talking to us and hid in her room when she came here and would say BM says I have to come until. I am 18 then I never have to come again. Now- we released her of her obligation 3 month before 18.......She didn't come here for almost 6 month. When she got to dorm. We noticed a different attitude. DH also started treating her as an adult. He would call SD and say got an email from Bm you need money YOU call me- I owe nothing more to your mom.

I guess this is signs of PAS????? SS noW barely talks when he is here.

Oh yeah, PAS big time. I

Oh yeah, PAS big time. I think there's a misconception that it's only PAS if the other parent is blatantly name calling, trashing, etc. PAS can be very subtle. Get that DVD...you'll probably recognize tons of stuff that BM does. Also consider getting a therapist involved if you don't have one. This can be very tricky to deal with. Somebody needs to reign BM in, and it probably won't be you. Get courts and therapist to do it.