Sorry that I exist…
DH is considering going out of town for work. The logistics of that needed to be discussed between DH, BM and I (cause I darn sure am not getting SD for full week visitations if DH is not here, sorry not sorry it just wouldnt work). prior to this coming up BM told DH she wanted to sit down and discuss childcare costs because daycare increased a bit. He said "ok but I have other things to discuss with you too and wife will be there with me". At first she was ok but then she said that she didnt want me around if they were going to discuss childcare (presumably because I b*tched to a "friend" about a situation a while back where DH needed to discuss with BM something that happened at daycare and she couldn't be bothered to answer the phone cause it was her birthday... and word got back to BM about my little b*tchfest but oh well). Then she says to DH "we can talk just you and I and if I need to talk to your wife in the future I will do so myself." Um no hun you will not 1) because I blocked you a long time ago because your attitude sucks and Im sick of your mind games, and 2) you can try all you want to act like I dont exist because seeing me makes you feel some type of way, but the fact is we're married and I play a part in your childs life whether you like it or not.
anyway, Its not the first time BM has been irked by the fact that Im around. Some months ago i dropped SD off at her house after a dinner visit, which I NEVER do, and the next day she texted DH "why did your wife drop [SD] off and not you??"
I really do try to give BM the benefit of the doubt and not assume that she is an awful person but she doesn't give me much to go off of. I guess she doesn't have to. But is it too much to ask for a little respect? If I have to deal with the fact that BM is in my husbands life and not going anywhere, then BM should accept that Im here and not going anywhere as well.
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These bitter BMs will never
These bitter BMs will never respect or accept that their exes moved on, so therefore they will never accept us as SMs. And nobody is saying that you have to respect BM as a BM either. Lord knows I despise our BM. If you are doing parenting things for DH and there is nothing in the CO preventing it, then BM can shove rocks.
The best thing you can do is talk with DH, just the two of you, and set a plan for what you want the arrangement to look like if he is going to be out of town. Then, DH can present that arrangement to BM. If she disagrees or needs you to make adjustments to you and DH's plan, then she can take it up with DH who can work it out with you alone. You have the right to put your own personal boundaries in place. You are not legally required to take parenting time so if BM gets mad and needs you to take SD on DH's week, she can forget it. She and DH could always go back to court or mediation to set a new schedule accommodating his work, without requiring you to take SD. The courts would more than likely make BM take that time, giving DH visitation when he is able; they aren't going to give a SM parenting time. Personally, I don't think it is ever a good idea to enter a conversation with BM even if DH is present; it only leads to more drama and allows BM to get more information on you through your interactions; your mannerisms, how to set you off, etc. The less face to face time you can have with BM, the better. You and DH need to work it out together, then let DH and BM work it out together, based on what you and DH decided. Stay away from BM.
As far as childcare costs, usually those are outlined in the CS order. Does DH not have a CS order? If he does, let BM take him back for an increase if she feels daycare costs have increased. I wouldn't be entering into an informal agreement with BM about finances outside of a CS order, no way, no how. I have learned that if you give BM an inch financially, she tries to take a mile... And if you try to put financial limits in place, she will throw a major tantrum. Everything sticks to the CO.
Never apologize for existing. You bring many things to the life
your family shares. Including your Skid.
As for BM. The benefit of the doubt... is earned. She has earned nothing but doubt, and contempt. Give her nothing more. Until she earns it with years of unquestionable behavior.
Let her live what she has earned. I was at DW's side at every lawyer appointment, at every live court hearing, and at her side during telephone hearings. The only time I was not was when their lawyer moved to exclude witnesses to keep the Spermidiot's criminal pervy statutory rapist crap out of the hearing of the SpermGrandHag, the SpermClan GGPs, and the Spermidiot's sister. I was in the witness exclusion room on our side of the hallway, and the SpermGrandHag, etc... were in the witness exclusion room across the hall.
I stood outside of the courtroom doors watching and listening, as much as I could, through the courtroom doors which had small windows in them. No one ever told me I couldn't, so I watched and listened.
During telephone hearings, that they requested I not be a part of, we had it on speaker and muted. I listened to the entire thing, and would pull docs out of our files, point out facts for DW to present, and I would point out lies, etc... that DW would then call them on after unmuting the phone. Interestingly, SpermGrandHag could squawk her screechy harpy voice and DW had to repeatedly point out that she was not a party to the case any more than I was and needed to be kept quiet. I did not egg on the Judge but I also made sure that DW kept baring the SpermGrandHag's ass when she would violate the Judges stipulation that the only participants were to be DW and the Spermidiot. Most pathetically, they had SS and his three younger half sibs in the room during the telephone hearing. I broke the Judges stipulation to point out that our son and his younger half sibs were in the room and that was inappropriate. The Judge ended that, but was likely more frustrated that I pointed it out than she was as the kids being in the room while SpermGrandHag was screeching at my DW and DW was calmly disecting the Spermidiot and SpermGrandHags lies, failure to comply with the Judges stipulations, and failure to provide the subpoen'd informaton required by the courts.
The most frustrating this was that we would go in with every stitch of requested information plus tons of additional stuff. They brought nearly none of the court mandated information.
I have considered going to law school to make fighting the toxic half of blended family opposition situations representing the quality side... pro bono. Just as a retirement hobby.
I probably won't. But dragging the toxic through hell by the scuffs of their necks does have an appeal for me.
Seems pretty straightforward
Seems pretty straightforward to me. Your SD is only there when your husband is. If he isn't there, neither is she. She stays with her mother. Let me remind you of the purpose of visitation - it's so that the child can spend time with their bio parent NOT to give BM a break. In other words, they can decide what they want for SD's summer but YOU are not going to be their babysitter. You are not this child's parent and have no responsibility towards her. You will not be available to make up for her parents inability to plan.
I agree your DH needs to
I agree your DH needs to discuss his trip with his EX.. since he won't be able to take visitation when he is out of town.
BUT.. you do not need to .. nor are you entitled to be present and part of their conversations regarding their child.
I understand the child is in your home.. but your husband is the one that deals with his EX.. .
Now, of course, your DH should not be writing checks that you are expected to cash. So, he can't agree to changes that will require you to do something.. he needs to either agree with you in advance.. or he needs to go back and have that conversation before agreeing to a change with his EX.
And.. don't gossip or kvetch about his EX to people. Clearly someone who heard it.. is NOT your friend and went running to BM and stirred the pot. You can come to an anon site like this.. and complain.. but you did nothing but bring yourself drama when you complained to someone that went running to BM... and that maybe even includes your SO.. he may repeat things too.. and the child.. You may be the better person.. so act like it and don't stoop to running her name down. it won't solve anything.. and makes you look bad.
The bottom line is that she had a child with your SO.. so they are the ones that deal with that.. and they don't need you sitting at the table WITH them. BUT.. your SO is your partner.. and should be protecting your interests.. and should not be obligating you to things without your permission.. so you have to trust him to do that.
If you don't want to help him with his child.. that is your choice... and BM has nothing to say about it.. it is between you and your SO.
I hate to say it, but BM is
I hate to say it, but BM is right. A meeting with BM is not your place. As a stepmom, I wouldn't want to deal with BM. Take your get out of jail free card & use it often. As a BM, you didn't help create DS & I didn't pick you. It's bad enough I have to deal with exH.
Tell DH that you are not willing to take his visitation time. Come up with a visitation schedule that works for your family. The rest is up to DH to handle.
i do agree with you. There
i do agree with you. There are other things that needed to be discussed besides that, plus DH asked me to be there for a multitude of reasons so I said yes. other than this one very rare instance I do not talk to BM at all. But i also have no interest in not showing up to things just because BM doesn't want me there. I didn't force my way into a conversation that had absolutely nothing to do with me. if it were a different situation I probably would have said no im not coming (like i've done 100s of times before)
I disagree that BM is
I disagree that BM is entitled to "alone time" with OP's husband, even if it's requested in the name of discussing the child. There are BMs that would use this as an excuse to mess with their exes, requesting unnecessary meetings, possibly for the purpose of causing problems for their ex's marriage. How could having your spouse present hurt things if logistics and strategy are the only things being discussed?
I don't think the meeting
I don't think the meeting needs to be in person necessarily.. but OP has "talked smack" aboutBM.. if the tables were turned.. we wouldn't want to have BM near us if they did that to us. SM's presence just increases the chance that things will go off the rails and people won't behave civilly.
If OP is worried her DH will cheat on her.. then she clearly has a DH problem. Maybe is is ok if OP makes her DH set a boundary that the discussion happens on neutral public ground.. not at someone's home in private?
I actually don't see anything positive that could come about by OP being there since she has a high conflict relationship with the EX. It will only give more chance for drama..
Her DH should be able to be trusted to have a meeting with boundaries and be respecful of OP's wishes.
I actually think the discussion could be had via phone call.. but if in person.. meeting at starbucks.. mcdonalds should be fine.
Exactly. Why do they need to
Exactly. Why do they need to be physically present in the same room at all? It already reeks of boundary-stomping.
Her DH could certainly just
Her DH could certainly just get the ball rolling with an email.
BM... I know we need to resolve a few things.. on my end, I will be gone August X through August Y... I won't be taking my custody time as a result during that time, The CO doesn't require makeup time, but would you be willing to allow an extra couple of days for my next visitation? You also mentioned that daycare costs had risen.. if you could send me that information so I could review, that would be great. Per the CO, we split those costs 50/50.
(of course.. whatever the CO says should be the driving force)
And with an email, there is
And with an email, there is documentation of what was agreed to. So many BMs who are needy, attention-sucking, relationship-sabotaging people. So many guys who just want to keep everyone happy and say "Welp, i guess i have to go to her house or take her to dinner or have her over on a week day while my wife is at work, after all, kids come first!"
you sure are assuming a lot..
you sure are assuming a lot... The convo actually already happened and it went fine. I agree that most of the time, DH and BM can discuss things about their child and Im often disengaged. but in this instance DH needed us all to be on the same page for various reasons I wont get into here. did I HAVE to be there? probably not. But if it makes It easier for DH to have a conversation about things that will affect both of us by having both of us be there... why shouldnt I have a seat at the table? I dont insert myself too much into other matters, nor do I ask a lot of my DH... and I barely interact with BM as it is. I think its fair that BM put her feelings aside just one time to have me present at just one very rare meeting. And no it has nothing to do with thinking DH will cheat on me.
This isn't your bio child..
This isn't your bio child.. you have had issues with BM due to you talking poorly behind her back.. that is why you shouldn't be "at the table".. you should be consulted by your DH if something pertains to you.. and maybe having email exchange.. or a phone conversation where you can be a "silent" participant (no interraction with BM but could signal your DH yes or no agreement).
I think that your presence could potentially create more of an inflammatory situation and make BM less agreeable.. so it actually could work counter to your goals..
And.. she doesn't "answer to you".. you aren't a parent to her child.. he is.. she does not have to agree to discuss anything with you present.. that is her choice tbh.. so you may think she needs to suck it up.. but if she won't.. there is not much recourse.
If the meeting did happen and you were there.. hope it went as well you hoped.
you still are assuming a lot
you still are assuming a lot about my situation and putting a lot of "should be" on me and DH's shoulders but not a lot on BM... that being said yes the meeting happened and yes it went fine in my opinion, despite BM's defensiveness and pushback.
I Would Not Attend
What I would do is be very clear that I am NOT going to be a backup plan for DH or BM when it comes to their kids. Then let him and BM figure out a visitation plan. And that does NOT have to be in person...phone call would suffice. With the BM situation you have, research disengagement on this site and pick strategies that work for you in "blocking" BMs tactics against you.
I'll repeat what someone said....be VERY careful about who you vent to in regards to BM. It only brings more drama to your life.
oh yes i know that now. That
oh yes i know that now. That "friend" was never a friend to me and i had to learn that.
BM did you a big favor
The way l look at it, If you are not good enough to discuss SD. Then you can't ever watch her, take her anywhere or buy her anything. DH is going away for the week, SD will NOT come over. No DH no SD
I absolutely believe that
I absolutely believe that whether a SP watches a skid is up to an agreement between them and their SO.. and it's not an obligation that they must automatically take on.
However, I do NOT feel that a SP is automatically entitled to a seat at (virtually or in person) at the table when the bio parents are discussing their child. The SP should be able to relay their thoughts and position to their SO.. and their SO is the one that advocates for and on behalf of their spouse...
So.. just because a SP is not AT the meeting.. doesn't mean their boundaries or preferences aren't being considered.. because their partner should be advocating on their behalf. If their SO is a bonehead and agrees to things the SP is not ok with.. the SP is free to decline to do any of it..
But, why does a BM have more
But, why does a BM have more entitlement to a man's time than his own wife? Alone-time meetings are a BM WANT, not a skid need. Ideally, a man would have the sense and confidence to navigate these things, but many men are so beaten down and brainwashed by the "kids come first" mentality that they allow their exes to lead them around by guilt. Some women will absolutely use this "access to their exes" as a way to exert control, either as a type of revenge for the guy moving on or as a way to keep the man primarily bonded to them through the kids so the BM will have primary access to his resources. It doesn't even have to be about getting the guy back or cheating.
I don't think this is a time
I don't think this is a time for EX vs SO.. apparently there are issues that need to be resolved regarding the child.. the bio parents are the ones that need to do that.. it's the "needs of the child" that are apparently driving the need for the meeting.
I don't believe that the meeting needs to necessarily be in person.. the issues could even potentially be resolved with a string of emails.. but OP is not entitled to be present at the meeting (in person or on the phone)..
And.. her DH already has made this comittment to his child by bringing them into this world.. that they will take some of his time and resources.. so the meeting is for the child's benefit.. not BM really in the end..
but.. a boundary I might have as his spouse is that the meeting be over the phone maybe?
you make a good point. BM was
you make a good point. BM was the one who insisted the meeting be in person. I have no problem with that. But when DH told her that I also was going to be there then she started to push back and get weird. I understand her reasoning. But ultimately im coming along to discuss logistics. BM might feel "entitled" to one-on-one in person discussions with her co parent but its not a god-given right. she can suck it up just this once (and she did).
How many stories have we read
How many stories have we read where the DH makes commitments for SM? Throws SM under the bus? Generally bulldozes right over her in the name of keeping BM happy?
OP, if your man cannot or refuses to defend you and protect you and your marriage, then go, if only to defend your NO. If you have faith in your man he can handle BM without getting you involved, then stay home.
the issue was more nuanced
the issue was more nuanced than that but i appreciate your thoughts
They just hate that we exist
Almost 8yrs later and Crazy still hates my mere existence. I am of the same thought process as you- BM does not get to dictate my home and things that affect me, or demand an in-person meeting with DH just because that's what she wants. Your DH can decide to do that, and why would in-person be needed at all? If the pandemic has taught us anything, it's that we can do most things virtually. She seems to want to insert dominance. I don't play that. DH and I have had issues lately because he has folded when Crazy makes demands that we do things her way- when I refuse, DH is upset with me for rocking the boat and not putting the kids first. UM, no, I'm not giving in to HER demands, because this is NOT the way him and I would do things otherwise. Anyway, hoping no matter what you are considered in this and your DH has your back. And I hope he didn't even respond to her when she asked why you dropped SD off that day instead of him, because that is not her business and not necessary communication.
We should relish that our mate's X hates that we exist.
We are our mate's present and future. Their X, just as any X that we may have, has nothing but their past.
We should flaunt that, scrub their snotty noses in it, and enjoy their gnasing of teeth over it. as we highlight our living well, loving well, and lording all of that over them.
Living well is the best revenge. We should enjoy living our best lives. Let them wallow in their festering cesspool lives.