Mini wife SD 17 driving me nuts
Hi,
I need input in my situation, actually I need to know if I'm just plain crazy or if I have something to complain about. This will be a bit longer because there is a back story.
I dated my BF 4 years from age 18-22, and we were each other's great love. After 4 years and no hint from him that things would progress further and a dismal family life with my narc mom, I decided to move to the US because an opportunity presented itself. I lived there for 30 years, was married for 20 and have 2 daughters, ages 20 and 26. When Facebook came about, my BF looked me up and we started talking again. Often months would go by before we talked. As I was going through my divorce, and he had been divorced a year, we talked more often. Long story short- the old feelings blossomed and we are back together. I moved back to my country and both of my daughters were supportive. They are very independent and confident young women who get shit done.
My BF has 2 kids from his marriage, SS 20 and SD 17. I met them when I visited before my move back and they were nice and welcoming to me. They had heard of me many times before because I was very much a part of their family when we dated previously, and he always talked about me. He told me he hadn't married his wife back then had it not been for her being pregnant with their son.
I naively had no concern about his kids due to their age, and I expected them to be very much like my girls- living their own lives. Not so, SS is spoiled with money by both parents and pretty lazy. Luckily he will start an apprenticeship in a month and he will be ok. He also told me numerous times that he's happy his dad is with me, and that his parents actually never were a match. He is always very nice to me.
SD on the other hand is a piece of work. She was at first cold towards me and didn't want her dad to have anyone in his life and literally told her brother "that's my daddy". She is nice to me and likes me, but when they are together I could just puke. She always walks beside him, holds his hand, or he walks arm in arm with her while I walk behind them like a puppy. When we put to eat he asks her if she wants anything else and ignores me. When she's over - she lives with BM- they cuddle on the couch and he rubs her feet. One time she was at our place when he got home from work and he profusely greeted her, hugs and kisses, asked HER whats for dinner and ignored me. He also drives her everywhere even though she has a free bus ticket through school, when she calls he jumps. She also talks in a baby voice when she talks to him, yells dadddyyyy like a toddler, and uses baby words like wow wow for dog. He doesn't admonish this.
At the beginning of the relationship I drove her a lot because she said the bus wasn't going that way. It's a one hour drive round trip to get her from her internship through school, and her brother had to get her a lot too. My BF works shifts so he wasn't always available. I did this for a while and then I got resentful. My SS showed me the bus schedule and there actually is an easy connection. So I told BF I wasn't driving her anymore and she could take the bus. I haven't driven her since then, but BF is not consistent with making her take the bus and either gets her himself or arranges for someone else to get her. He spoils her to no end with stuff, favors, and not helping her be independent. She couldn't even order an ice cream at the ice cream parlor she was so anxious and he'd always done it for her. I insisted she do it herself or we would just be in this store forever. She did it and was actually proud of herself at fucking 17! I should note that she slept in bed with her mom until age 13, and my BF slept on the couch. BM basically cock blocked him with his own child (they rarely had sex, maybe once or twice a month and only on her terms).
I had a big blow up about his SD a week ago, not my finest moment but it had to be said. I mentioned the mini wife behavior he allows, the love fest between them and how I'm ignored, and that I want to be a priority with his kids, and for sure as hell not after his kids. I also said had I known that I was last on his list I would have stayed in the US. There were other issues like him working 60 plus hours a week due to side jobs for money he blows up his kids ass that they should be earning themselves. As a result of this blow up, he quit one job and pulled back significantly on another. He said no more often than yes to his kids since then. What's left is the mini wife behavior.
My kids are coming to visit and we Plan on spending 3 days in Berlin. SD was invited if she brings a friend. The friend can't make it after all, and I don't want her coming without one because she will be glued to my BF. She even rides piggy back on his back in public sometimes. It hasn't happened since I told him it looks perverted. I told him my girls would only be here for 2 weeks and I want him to pay attention to them. I know this will be impossible in Berlin if she doesn't bring a friend, and I will be angry and sad the whole time watching that shit show. I don't think either one of them is aware of their behavior, and I'm the first serious relationship hes had since his divorce. I've lived with him for a year now.
Other than SD everything else is good. His loving, attentive and caring when SD is not around. He's great when SS is around. SD has no BF and only a few friends. She's very focused on her dad and not spreading her wings like normal 17 year olds.
I know this was long, sorry... I don't know what to do because I just had this blowup 2 weeks ago and he has done 80% of what we agreed to IN WRITING. Any advice would be appreciated.
Thank you.
Go to Berlin with your kids
Go to Berlin with your kids on your own. Don't invite trouble into those two short weeks. Take your bf only if he comes on his own and leaves his daughter with her mother.
How exactly should I approach
How exactly should I approach that subject in a way that is not out of anger? How do you see the situation as a whole?
Have you been clear about the
Have you been clear about the mini-wife behaviour? I mean, have you spelled it out for him? Is he aware that he's treating his daughter more like a wife than his child? If not, then you have to start from there. Do it somewhere public (restaurant? Cafe?) to avoid things getting out of hand and voices getting raised. Tell him that his ignoring you when his daughter is there is not acceptable, that he should be cuddling with you and rubbing your feet and not hers. Tell him that they behave like lovers in public and in private. Tell him that you're going to start calling him out about it as from now every time it happens. Tell him that there's an expression for what they're doing - it's "emotional incest". Tell him that it's time to remember who he is having sex with ... and therefore, who is his partner.
Or you could just tell him that you want to spend quality time alone with your own children seeing as they won't be there for very long. He can hardly object to that, can he?
Yes, I've spelled out the
Yes, I've spelled out the mininwife behavior in my blow up. His sister agrees with me, but she also said that he is not doing any of this consciously or with any malice. She said his ex never confronted him about anything, not even anything related to disagreements about childbearing issues. Frankly, because he worked so much with the approval of his ex, he admitted that he never was really there for the kids and let the ex make all decisions. He even said to me "I wasn't there for them growing up, and the least I can do now is give them money and drive them around". When I confronted him he didn't really understand what the problem was. When we went bowling yesterday and he celebrated her good shots like she won the Olympics, I completely ignored their love fest and talked to his son and gf. After a while he noticed my behavior and started paying attention to me. SD did not try to get in the middle of it to her credit. She shows similar behavior with her brother. She totally monopolizes his gf, to me it seems so they can't interact. When SS drove SD and gf home, SD sat in the front and his gf in the back. It struck me as inappropriate, SD should have been in the back.
I told my daughter about my dilemma regarding Berln, and she advised to just let it be, if she comes along she comes. My daughter said if she notices mini wife behavior she will call her out and confront my bf. I already prepared my bf that my girls will be scrutinizing him to see if he takes care of me and makes me happy, and that both are outspoken and will say something to him if they see something wrong. Part of me wants that to happen so he hears from someone else how fucked up this is.
I think he really struggles with giving each of us appropriate attention for our role, and I think he is so clueless that he just won't do anything. After the friend couldn't make it, he was going to ask SD if she could take someone else over dinner yesterday. I whispered to him at dinner to ask her, and he said to hold off. I wonder if he thought about what i said about my kids being the center of attention for 2 short weeks, and he wants to let the issue die by not even mentioning it to her again. She hasn't mentioned it either, and he already said that he doesn't think she even wants to come along without a friend because she would feel out of place.
Welcome to the site!
I agree with Winterglow about the mini wife behaviour. Also, I would not take SD to Berlin, just say no, you and your BF need to focus on your own kids, you don't see them that often. I found in my own situation that the mini wife behaviour was allowed by DH because he was afraid to confront it for fear they would not want to see him any more. You can't live your life in fear like that, and in fact I think stopping that behaviour rarely means that the relationship between father and daughter ends. That's just the father's fear talking. You need to let him know that it bothers you so much that you have been thinking that you may have made a mistake in leaving the USA.
OH GAWD
Your SD sounds exactly like my ex SD.
Do not do Berlin with this mini wife. Your trip will be ruined.
IDK if your BF will pull through deleting this mini wife crap. Its an enmeshment hard to break. Your resentment may never either. Not being negative, well yes I am LOL, but BTDT with a mini wife.
Even if your BF is pulling back from the mini wife behavior her poutiness may swing him right back to her. Its a powerful sick dynamic. She loves what she is getting from daddio, daddio feels like her knight in shining armor, YOU are the evil jealous SM. That can very well be the result.
OR NOT. Your BF may want to change this behavior. He may want to fix your relationship.
Time and boundaries will tell.
Blessings lady
I think he really struggles
I think he really struggles with giving each of us appropriate attention for our role
It's really not rocket science, he treats the daughter like a daughter and the GF like a GF. He can celebrate her good bowling shots, without ignoring you.
It goes something like this: "Oh, good frame, Daughter. High five!" He then turns his attention back to you, gives you a kiss, or whatever.
Parenting out of guilt, because he feels like he wasn't there when she was young, never works. One parents like a parent, no matter what the past circumstances. Can't really make up for what was done back then, but he can hurt her growth by trying. Not to mention, what it's doing to his relationship with you.
She shows similar behavior with her brother. She totally monopolizes his gf, to me it seems so they can't interact.
Out in the real world, she will not be the center of everybody's attention. It's best that she learns that, now.
Also, why do your kids (adults) have to be the center of his attention for 2 weeks?
They should be the center of his attention
for 2 weeks because he has never met them, I want him to get to know them and my girls to get to know him. Visits will be about twice a year unless Covid causes travel restrictions. I think that is not too much to ask, especially since I also took my time to get to know his kids. My kids are a part of my life, and he doesn't know that part yet.
Parenting out of guilt,
I agree with this statement in that your bf can't make up for lost time. He needs to parent her like the parent of a young lady her age not like a little child. It's better he do this and risk losing her than to cripple her development. My ex is the only man I know who doesn't parent his adult kids and it definitely showed. His adult kids behaved more like teenagers than young adults, and their dependency was like nothing I could have never imagined. If I were you I would require bf to fix these issues within a reasonable amount of time, otherwise I would end the relationship. Best of luck to you.
There is no need for SD to go
There is no need for SD to go to Berlin.
None whatsoever. She can go to BM.
Your bf needs to stop fawning over his daughter (ugh) and step up and be your partner! That includes going to Berlin with you to meet and spend time with YoUR daughters.
And I agree with the above is poster who said she felt nauseous reading your story. Sickening.
Good lawd - I'm feeling
Good lawd - I'm feeling nauseated over those foot rubs too - please God tell me it's not still happening?? Such a huge turn off!
I'm with others saying don't take her to Berlin.
Hope you guys have a great time and your DH gets to know your daughters - they sound mature and well-grounded (it may even get him to see that his daughter needs to be more independent).
Idk, your "great love" has a
Idk, your "great love" has a pretty big flaw and that makes him sound less than great. The patterns he has with his daughter will be very hard to break, because he created them. He wants them, or at least probably did until very recently. Unless he truly sees that it's an unhealthy enmeshment and wants to change, he will likely just do things behind your back and be resentful of you for making him change.
I think you should tell him how you feel in very clear terms, and sit back and see what happens. After 3 years of trying to change my SO, that's what i'm doing (not with mini wife stuff but with other things.) I nagged, cried, tried to control the situation....it just made me crazy. I tell myself every day to sit back and see what he *really* wants to do, how he really wants to be. It takes stepping back mentally and compartmentalizing my feelings. Acting. But i can't be the boundary police for a grown adult. Neither should you.
With my husband i always said it straight and never
Sugarcoated anything.
i told his it's disgusting watching his 2 miniwives (sd22 & sd13) waking side by side with him with me expected to walk behind, being at family weddings with them dressed as goth black depressed people because i was there and glued to him whilst my then toddlers were independent walking around etc.
my absolute worst experience was sd almost about to turn 23 banged on our bedroom door at 7am screaming daddies name demanding he open the car so she could get a special type of sugar for her aunt who didn't need it and could have waited for hubby to leave our room. Our 2 little kids were sleeping in our bedroom at hubbys childhood home and we were having sex.
that ended things for me and never again will i deal with that
I told my daughter about my
Your daughter sounds awesome. If SD must come along it will be nice to have another female there showing SD how to behave. Please remember that your boyfriend is the one who conditioned his daughter to be this way to fill HIS needs, and to fill that missing female in his life. No child wants to grow up being the replacement spouse, he has done her a great disservice by not allowing her to be a kid.
Do your daughters know anyone SD's age that will take her on, show her around, and hang out? Are there things she can be signed up for to get her out of your hair? Yes it would be best just not to take her, but that'll be a hard sell with your boyfriend.
My daughters dont know
anyone here in Germany SDs age because they live in the US. My older daughter suggested just now to do a girl date with SD and my girls so they can show her age appropriate behavior and encourage her to mature. They actually feel for her in a way, but they are also a bit envious since their own dad was very hands off and they wished they'd had a dad who cared as much as my bf. I know my bf is teachable, he's proven that in the past. I think the 2 years he was single they focused on each other, especially as BM resumed her affair and hardly pays attention to either of her kids as she's busy with him.
I keep a diary
and I noticed from my entries that SDs behavior was not anything I really noticed before until about 2-3 months ago. His sister and I had been pushing BF to foster his kids independence more by not giving them money and rides, and he has followed our advice and agreed that we were right. I no longer drive SD, and SS confirmed that SD has been taking the bus unless BM drives her around. SS refused to drive her also.
SD has been over our place a total of maybe 6 times by herself over the last year. The mini wife behavior has been where it's at now for the past 3-4 weeks. BF does not initiate get togethers with her, he responds when she requests rides. In fact, I suggested he spend quality time with both kids instead of using rides and money to show he cares. Both kids like this, and SS brings his GF. The foot rub happened once in March according to my diary entry.
I'm not ready to give up on the relationship yet, because in every other aspect he is great. I came into his bachelor life and he made many changes to accommodate me, as he should, but nevertheless it needs to be acknowledged. Having the support of his family is important because he made changes in the past, albeit slowly, and his sister would be the first to tell me if I waste my time with him.
SD is planning on getting her own apartment when she's 18, and she told me that in confidence because she said her dad doesn't think she can do anything on her own (which is kinda true, but kudos to her for wanting independence). I'm kind of her confidante when it comes to things she wants to do that further her independence, but she doesn't want to deal with her dads pushback. I told him, in front of her, that his keeping her small is stunting her growth, that she's a woman, that she has a right to her own life, and when she has her first boyfriend I will probably know before him. He has a hard time accepting that she's no longer a little girl, and I think she is also struggling with that transition because neither of her parents are encouraging her to spread her wings.
Im not planning on tolerating this dynamic forever, but I'm willing to give it more time because he has made every change in the past that I requested. He made those because they were important to me, and because I had certain expectations of a relationship, especially after a failed marriage. His failed because his wife had a 2 year affair, and he admitted that he didn't pay enough attention to her, not that's an excuse for her cheating but it made her vulnerable. I made very clear that I want a life partner and not a roommate, and in that respect he has stepped up. I'm still hopeful he can regarding the issue with his daughter, especially if I help her to become more mature, amd meeting my girls will help with that when both see the huge difference.
I feel for you! Been there!
I've been in a similar situation for about 10 (yes 10) years. Without serious (professional) intervention I fear they won't change that behaviour. I am so sorry. Same here- and she phones him multiple times every day (she is 30+ and has a man and a child) and texts constantly. I want to say...does she call/text her man this much? It's like she is trying to take HER mother's place (that's what the mother did when she was wife) with all those ridiculous calls... she is rude and obnoxioius around me and fortunately she is an only. I highly encourage you to have him seek help for this creepy behaviour. You have an obnoxious brat and a guilty man on your hands. Ugh. I do know your pain.
Update
I talked to him about Berlin and the reasons why I do t want her to come. I described the behavior, the Baby talk, and how he reinforces that behavior with his actions. He said he really wasn't aware that it so over the top, and he acknowledged that her development got arrested at age 12-13 (that's when the divorce occurred and his ex got the kids), and I explained that through his behavior with her he stunted her growth, and that he elevated her to the level of his partner. At first he was a bit defensive, but then he said that he wasn't aware, and what now? I told him he needs to block her childish behavior and redirect it in a healthy way, and when she exhibits the wanted behavior he needs to reinforce it through praise and attention. I also told him that from now on I will call out their love fest when it occurs, even in public, so that both are aware. He said he would like for me to do that, because he said he doesn't notice it. He said he sees her as his little girl, and I said that routine gets old after they are 5. I asked him why he didn't treat his son that way, and he said because he's a man. I pointed out the blatant misogyny in this in that he expects his son to be mature and independent, while he views his daughter as a princess and a perpetual damsel in distress. I said she is just as capable as her brother , amd when I'm alone with her she acts her age and is a pleasure to be around. He was shocked about the ramifications his actions had on SD and me, and that it impacted my joy over seeing my kids. He agreed that even if he started today and changed the patterns they wouldn't be eliminated to the point she could come with us to Berlin without a friend. He agreed that she needs to stay home, and he said he was sorry he let this go on. I'm hopeful because in the past he made every change I asked him to make (stuff like working so much and reserving 2 weekends a month only for me). I was pleased by his reaction and insight.
Insight
Well, it sounds like you did your homework, took advice and communicated clearly and effectively. And MOST importantly your partner is acting like a true partner, and listening not just hearing what you are telling him.
This is the wind in your sails - that your partner is a PARTNER and is willing to do the work and make the changes and sees that it is both in HIs best interest and HER best interest.
My DH wants his kids to be independent, and SD22 actually left on her own twice, but unfortunately it didnt stick. Shes currently livign with BM Toxic Troll, and no drivers license (critical in our area) and not working and no college. TT also doesnt work and milks the system for her living.
Im hoping SD15 Backstabber/Munchkin will break free of the genetic legacy she has.
Good job!
sounds to me like
you're doing great. You communicated to your partner and he is listening and working on things. Hopefully things continue going in this encouraging direction. Time will tell. In the meantime, enjoy the time with your kids! I hope it's a wonderful visit.
Thank you everyone
for your feedback. I'm hopeful too that things will change, albeit slowly. SD texted him again asking for a ride again but he couldn't because of work. He asked if I would get her and I told him that I won't and not to ask again. He said "she will probably ask you next. Are you gonna say no?" "Yes, I will say no". He said "without explanation?" Me "correct, without explanation, I'm a grown ass woman and I don't have to explain myself to her and neither do you." He " what if she asks?" Me " I will tell her there's a bus she can take, and that generally I will neither sacrifice my time or my money for laziness in other people and that includes her. That's nothing personal, and I did the same with my kids." I could tell he had no idea how to do this, and I felt I was giving him a word track for future use. Fine with me, whatever works.
I know I have a long road ahead of me, but he is open to my feedback and has insight. It's gonna take a bit to break the patterns. His sister said that in the year I've been here I caused so many positive changes in my BFs life and his kids because I insisted shit gets done. So there's hope for more.