How old should a child be before you explain to them about mommy's "problem" ?
Our BM has a drinking problem. She NEVER has any money for necessities which means we HAVE to pay for this stuff. We have 50/50 custody and BM gets $800 a month CS. She also works (when she's not hungover). The skids will be sent to our house and tell us they have no lunch money, or no money for halloween costumes, or no money for school pictures, etc............it is never ending. BM lives in a house her dad owns and although she is supposed to pay rent, we know she doesn't.
FH is thinking about sitting the skids down and telling them some of the reasons that mommy doesn't have any money. And he also wants to explain to them what his CS is SUPPOSED to pay for. He is prepared to tell them that he will no longer give any money towards the things that CS is to pay for. That means that the next time they don't have any lunch money, their mommy will just have to come up with it. Our theory is that the BM DOES have money (it's obvious because she is in a bar every day.), but she will not choose to use it wisely because she doesn't have to because she KNOWS we will provide. This, we feel, is enabling her to continue being a neglectful parent and we are no longer willing to do this and this is the way we will explain things to the children.
My thoughts are that I don't know if the skids are old enough to hear this, much less understand it. They are 8 and 10. I don't want to be accused of "turning" the skids against their mother, or bad-mouthing her. I'm not sure if this is the right thing to do and FH is planning on telling the skids after Christmas. We're not sure of any other way to "force" BM to either get help or wake up/grow up and start taking responsibility for her life and the lives of the skids.
Any thoughts on this ladies or similar situations? Advice greatly needed.
Feeling a little sad about this whole thing. This is a situation where my love for the skids way outweighs the hatred I feel for the BM.
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I really don't think you
I really don't think you should say anything. I think this is something that they should see for themselves. As much as it frustrates you, it really is a delicate topic. I would just wait until they start asking questions.
Well you can mention it but
Well you can mention it but it depends on what you say and how you say it. But maybe wait until they come to you with questions then you can tell them that BM is very ill and she just has some problems she has to deal with. Mention that it has nothing to do with the kids and it is not the kids fault and that their BM loves them very much. As they get older they will see and learn for themselves what their mother is.
" Faith is a bird that feels dawn breaking and sings while it's still dark"-R.Tagore
I am a believer that
I am a believer that alcoholism is a disease. My father was an alcoholic and now my brother is one also. BM's father is an alcoholic and I believe this can be hereditary (?). We would never make BM out to look like she literally chooses to spend irresponsibly, but that she has an illness that she needs help with.
**my stepdaughters did not grow in my tummy, they grew in my heart**
I'm not certain how it can
I'm not certain how it can be a disease. Is it not a choice to start drinking? Did anyone force them to start? It's about abuse. People know abusing subtances is wrong.
I know tons of people who grew up in alcoholic homes and never once touched the stuff. I think people need to stop using "disease" as a crutch and start taking responsibility for their own choices they made.
I'm sorry I may get tons of shit for this...but I don't believe alcoholism or drug abuse is a disease. AIDS, CANCER, MS...those are diseases and no one had a choice.
" Faith is a bird that feels dawn breaking and sings while it's still dark"-R.Tagore
We can both be bashed for
We can both be bashed for not believing its a disease LOL I'm on the mindset that its more environmental and EVERYONE can become an alcoholic if you drink enough--It's just like any other addictive drug out there.
Some people have addictive personalities and can be prone to addtiction more than others. Not sure if this one is hereditary but I still feel that their are enviromental factors that play in.
Like most children, I choose
Like most children, I choose to believe my father had a disease instead of choosing to be gone for days at a time and making my childhood sometimes miserable. The adult in me may know better, but I'm not ready to admit yet and since my father has passed away - all was forgiven a long time ago. My brother, the alcoholic, had a heart attack, died, was shocked back to life by paramedics, and he is still drinking, drugging, smoking etc........... Sometimes, I feel like YES it is a choice and sometimes I just don't know. My brother now drinks just to maintain. He has a good job, a wonderful wife, and wonderful children, but he won't/can't stop drinking excessively.
**my stepdaughters did not grow in my tummy, they grew in my heart**
How do you pay 800CS but
How do you pay 800CS but have 50 / 50...unless your husband makes an obscene amount of money. But aside from that, i agree with giana, you should let them see for themselves.
Personally, if i knew bm was an alcoholic, i would take full custody. Especially when u write here that your dh give 800 bucks and she doesn't provide for them. I understand you paying for things they need, you can't say no...but i would seriously consider taking them on full time. That 800 bucks can be rerouted to them instead of her drinking habit.
I am not sure where
I am not sure where RustyHalo is but in our state, CS is paid regardless of the custody split. We have 50/50 (court ordered, but we actually have SD 75% of the time) and we still pay an obscene amount of child support. THe calculation in our state is not needs based, it is set up so that these precious little bundles of entitlement (not all of them, but most) can enjoy the same lifestyle in both homes, so if one party makes more $ than the other (regardless of how much more), that person will pay child support. Wouldn't want these kids to learn that working hard reaps better rewards, so if mommy sits on her ass and doesn't want to earn any $, and daddy works his ass off, daddy will pay mommy enough money so they both look successful. That way it feeds into the divorced parents guilt parenting of letting the children believe that you can have what you want without actually earning it.
"God is great, beer is good, and people are crazy" and you can't change crazy!!
Soverysad, you hit it right
Soverysad, you hit it right on the head! I couldn't have said it better myself. In our state (NY) CS is the exact same way (we have 50/50 custody also) - and that is exactly how the skids turn out. BM sits on her ass & underemploys herself, all the while pampering herself with the CS $$ that she receives because BF makes much more money than her. I didn't realize that CS $$ was supposed to pay for her tattooes, monthly haircolor changes, weekly shopping sprees...she even took a cruise with her girlfriends for 1 of their birthdays!! Meanwhile, SHE HAS NEVER, EVER ONCE, IN SIX YEARS, EVER TAKEN THE SKIDS ON A VACATION WITH HER!! Silly me, I thought CS $$ was supposed to be spent..well...ON.THE.CHILDREN!!!! For their clothes, food, school stuff, etc... We just had a MAJOR snowstorm with TWO FEET of snow and do you know what skid was wearing when we picked him up from BM's? NO WINTER COAT, NO WINTER BOOTS, NO GLOVES, NOTHING!! I feel sick to my stomach for her & what kind of person (nevermind mother) she is. I also agree 100% that "the apple doesn't fall far from the tree"...the skids continue to feel entitled & don't appreciate anything because that's exactly what BM teaches them, not only with her words, but more importantly with her actions. The skids never learn the value of a dollar because of the divorced parents guilt parenting to the point where everything the skids want, they just put their hand out and POOF!! it appears...
That's the agreement they
That's the agreement they came up with during their dissolusion (sp?). Because BM wanted to go to school for two years to "better" herself. So, FH agreed to pay that amount to help support her through this. Well, BM finished school in May and has been working ever since, but the reality is that although she told FH that she was going to nursing school, she only went to become a surgical tech, which is an entry level position that doesn't pay very well. And she didn't get a job in that field, she works in a Dr's office taking blood pressure, pulses, and info from patients, along with answering the phone. So, FH is stuck with still helping her out. Their custody schedule is as follows: We have them every Tuesday and Thursday and every other weekend. She has them every Monday and Wednesday and every other weekend. We are supposed to drop the skids every Sunday night at 6:00, so she actually has them every Sunday night, but the reality is that she will usually call and ask us to keep them on our Sundays, and that happens more often than not.
**my stepdaughters did not grow in my tummy, they grew in my heart**
Whoa!! If you have 50/50
Whoa!! If you have 50/50 custody why is there CS being paid? If you both share the responsability of raising the children then both parents should pay the way of the children when they are in their care. As for the other question, how old are they and is she ever drunk or drinking around them? My Ex has a Pot and drinking problem and my children are very aware of it the oldest is 9 and the yougest is 5. I make sure that they know that their BF loves them always but sometimes he does things that he shouldn't do but that doesn't mean that Dad doesn't love them, Dad he needs to fix these things himself and he will when he is ready(he won't ever be ready) This is something you need to look at for the safety of the children, they may not need to know yet(or they may already know)untill something changes.
She has been passed out on
She has been passed out on the couch a time or two when we have dropped the skids off, but she will always say she is sick with a fever and explain it away. See above response regarding CS.
**my stepdaughters did not grow in my tummy, they grew in my heart**
You may be right. I just
You may be right. I just want my life to be better, that's all. I don't want to "enable" anybody. I have a very large issue with this.
My father had a drinking problem and although I was never "told" by my mom or anybody else, I can look back on certain memories and I can see it. And my mom ENABLED my father in that condition. My father quit drinking when we were old enough and some of us displayed the same characteristics of alcoholism.
**my stepdaughters did not grow in my tummy, they grew in my heart**
ya, i really dont think you
ya, i really dont think you should go there. 8 and 10 is very young to spring that on. unless they are asking questions specifically related to it, i wouldnt say a word. that is something that needs to be dealt with between adults and or the courts.
"if you don't have anything nice to say, then shut the fuck up."
I would put them in
I would put them in counseling. Trust me when I say the kids already know. I would also get a lawyer and try to get full custody.
"If I turn into another, Dig me up from under what is covering the better part of me" -Incubus
I would not put the children
I would not put the children in the middle of the situation. Ages 8 and 10 are still pretty young. I would however maybe put them in counseling and/or be there to talk with them whenever they feel like they need to talk.
My solution would be to get an attorney and start documenting each time she is "episodes". It may be more helpful for the kids not to be around her until she gets her "issue" resolved.
********She doesn't have to love me or even like me - it doesn't change a dang thing..... So get over it and move on BM!************
i think this could go both
i think this could go both ways, so please be careful.
First the positive way:
SKIDS will understand completely and BM will be forced to financially support her children and all is good and well in the world.
Negative outcome:
Skids dont understand why you wont pay, skids then tell BM, BM accuses you of turning the kids on her plus not helping out with them, and all hell breaks loose.
I think the child should be
I think the child should be a teenager that way they can read information for themselves and come up with their conclusions, you dont want to seem like you are pushing them to think a certain way and sharing certain things with the kids to early may cause that.....
There was a time when my XH
There was a time when my XH was drinking heavily. He was very depressed with things apparently. My kids noticed this so I brought it up to him. I asked him, "Is everything alright? The kids and I are worried about you. If it would help I can take them for a couple weeks so you can sort things". He said he was fine and he didn't need to sort things but it put him on notice. He shaped up rather quickly.
Is there a possibility that your DH can talk to BM about her drinking? Not in an accusing way but in a concerned way--afterall you are concerned about the kids, right? If that's not possible is there someone who can? I read your profile and it mentions you guys have lots of mutual friends. Maybe somebody can get through to her. If not so be it. All attempts to discuss this with her should be documented by the way. If you believe there is a real danger then you need to talk to a professional about what to do.
your DH needs to keep in mind that kids are feircely loyal to their parents whether the parents are unfit or not. If you talk to them be very careful what you say or could backfire. My opinion goes along with the above posters. Your skids will figure it out as they get older. When they start asking questions you answer accordingly.
You can not force someone
You can not force someone else to do what she should and putting an 8 and 10 year old in the position that they don't get lunch money because there Mom will not do for them and them now 'knowing' why does not fill their bellies. They are helpless to the situation and if she has not stepped up to the plate before for them she will not now (imo). I have a hard time believing they do not know what is going on. Sitting them down and rubbing the salt in the wounds by telling them you will go without now because she is a lousy Mom will not help, they can not change what kind of parents they were given. We have gone through this with some things with our situation so I do get what you are saying and if we come down hard it will be on the bm (threats of court, court action if things don't shape up). However the kids will not go without what they need while bd/me try to teach a lesson and wait around for bm to learn it. That is NOT fair to the kids. You sound like you really care about these kids and your line about loving them more then you hate the bm is key. Do what is right for kids caught in this crossfire and good kharma will follow you.
I agree with you 100%, but
I agree with you 100%, but recently things have gotten a bit out of control. The skids have been kept home from school on her days because of "no money" and the very next day on our days we will put money in their account (we can do this from home on the computer) and we will see her car at the bar. We have considered taking her back to court and I do have a journal with tons of stuff, but honestly, my FH is waiting for the BM to hang herself (another DUI, for instance) because taking the BM back to court and seeking full custody will also put the skids in an awkward situation and it will be mean daddy and wicked step mommy against poor, defenseless mommy. We're kinda stuck.
**my stepdaughters did not grow in my tummy, they grew in my heart**
I have said the same thing
I have said the same thing to FH regarding letting BM hang herself. I fear that she may have the skids in the car with her and get pulled over, or heaven forbid have an accident. This frightens me because she will sometimes go to the bar before she picks the skids up from school, but she always drinks from a travel coffee mug and so we never know if she's really drinking alcohol or what? I don't think I could live with myself if something happened to one or both of the skids while we sat and watched and waited.
**my stepdaughters did not grow in my tummy, they grew in my heart**
We never get close enough to
We never get close enough to smell it. But, she just looks very bad lately. Like she hasn't slept in weeks. I'm not sure if it's just alcohol, or if there could be other stuff involved. She's hanging out with a different type of crowd right now. I'm not sure what all they could be into. One of the guys she hangs with is literally homeless and goes to her house to take showers when the girls aren't there and he stays in a motel behind one of the bars they frequent. We've seen BM's car at the motel on our weekends before. This is a new development on her part and things seem to be escalating. For instance, last night she sent us a text asking: "are you bringing the kids home tonight?" We ALWAYS bring the skids home on Sundays unless she calls us and asks us not to. I thought that was a weird text. We were minutes from her home, so we didn't respond, but when we got there, the skids had a hard time getting the screen door to open and they were yanking on it and yanking on it and it was pretty loud, and finally FH went and pulled real hard and it opened, the skids went in and then poked their heads back out to say bye and FH asked if mommy was awake and they said yes. We're not sure if she was or not, but she sure didn't hear the commotion at the door.
**my stepdaughters did not grow in my tummy, they grew in my heart**
Also, we would never let the
Also, we would never let the kids go without. They generally pack their lunches from our house. But, BM never has anything for them to pack and this is what we prefer. Plus, because she knows we WILL provide, she doesn't have to buy stuff for them to pack or provide lunch money, thus leaving tons of money to spend in the bar. This whole situation has escalated in the past several weeks. The problem is becoming more pronounced and SD10 is showing some symptoms of something being wrong, but she doesn't seem able to explain things to us. It breaks my heart.
**my stepdaughters did not grow in my tummy, they grew in my heart**
Rusty.... Would you consider
Rusty.... Would you consider having the skids full time? That way you don't have to pay any child support and you can use that money to go toward what it should be for...not mom in the bar.
But more importantly - would you consider having the skids full time because having them live with their mom who obviously is okay being drunk around them ( as per one of your posts).... I just don't think it's a healthy situation for them.
Personally, I am pretty sure those kids already know their mom is an alcoholic. I think you should be able to open up some kind of dialogue with them,... but having it be because you don't want to pay any more would be one of the smaller reasons to do so... in my opinion.
You and your husband are already supporting those children. You are definitely supporting them financially, and it sounds like emotionally. That poor 10 year old is really starting to get it. Please help those kids before they are affected for life, growing up further with an alcoholic.
God Bless and Best wishes to you!
Just spoke to FH about this
Just spoke to FH about this and we are going to consult a professional.
**my stepdaughters did not grow in my tummy, they grew in my heart**
The kids already know . . .
The kids already know . . . my dad was alcoholic and it is pretty hard to keep a secret when you live with them.
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"The movies are the only business where you can go out front and applaud yourself." -
Will Rogers
Rustyhalo- If the drinking
Rustyhalo-
If the drinking is interfering with her ability to provide for her children then the children should be taken away from her. I'm afraid that by witholding money for necessities like lunch money you are really just punishing the child for the sins of the mother.
C_G