Dating during divorce - Do issues magically disappear after divorce??
(Sorry, I'm not sure what all of the acronyms are yet so I'm spelling a lot out.)
I moved to Hawaii to be wtih my BF 8 months ago, we've been together for a year. The entire time he's been dealing with a nasty divorce, mostly due to custody of his son, who just turned 4. To sum up their situation, she got pregnant after they dated for 3 months, and after she had baby they got married and were married for a little over a year. They've been separated since Sept 2016. They had no property together and no shared assets, so they were only fighting over custody.
She's really tourmented him by accusing him of domestic violence, emotional abuse, being an unfit parent, and would threaten leaving the country and taking their son. So I understand him being on edge about making the best decisions to keep the time he has with him... but he's been constantly emotionally withdrawn and obsessed with the divorce. Both of them send constant passive aggressive messages to each other if there's even a hair out of place on the kid's head. He's always thinking of ways to outsmart her or the legal system to getting what he wants, and it's obvious she's doing the same thing. He's been hardly present with me and constantly talks about it. I understand that it's a big deal in his life and am here to listen, but I feel like there's a line that is never drawn and I get overwhelmed. Whenever I feel overwhelmed, I resent that I left my whole life, a job a liked, my family, friends, home, to come be with him in Hawaii. We fight all the time about the BM and his divorce and I'm sad all the time about it. He and I have both been in counseling for it but it has barely helped.
His son really likes me and we get along, (asks for me all the time, is super excited to see me, listens to me well, talks about me to his mom) but I don't know if that will always be the case. I still haven't met the BM because I'm trying to stay out of their issues as much as possible and I don't want her to be worse towards him. Plus based on the things he's told me, I'm scared to meet her. At the same time, he also keeps me "hidden" from her. Whenever one parent has their son, the other parent skypes with the kid for 5 minutes at 6pm every other night. (Which is so annoying because I don't like her being able to have a lense into our space) He always tries to make sure I'm not around or avoids putting the camera on me if I am. He also won't mention me in messaging to her in general.
They finally just met up in person last week and hashed out the last of their issues in just two hours and are finalizing the divorce (they went on record in front of the judge, but haven't officially signed the paperwork.) He's trying to tell me that all of the drama and issues we've had about his divorce will be completely over and now we can totally focus on looking ahead. But I feel like just because they sign these documents it doesn't mean everything will be sunshine and rainbows. She's always going to be the mom of his son and I'm sure there will be back and forth coming up.
I'm honestly so turned off by him having this person constantly in his life it's hard to handle. When I think about having a child with him, I resent that he's going to compare everything with his ex and won't love ours as much as his first. But that might not even happen because I recently had a pregnancy scare, and he basically said he doesn't want any more kids, ever, and implied I should feel fulfilled because of the experience I'm getting with helping raise his son.
My questions to you all are:
1. Do things magically get better after divorce papers are signed?
2. Is this resentment temporary or is it a major sign I'm just not able to handle his circumstances?
3. Any other thoughts or comments that might be helpful.
Nope, things don't magically
Nope, things don't magically get better after the divorce, especially with a high conflict person.
The resentment will remain because, again, she is not going to turn into a different person after the divorce is final.
If you really want a child someday and he has made it clear that he doesn't and thinks his kid should be enough for you (gag), this is not the guy or the situation for you.
I have been with my husband for 21 years (22 in Sept), since my SD was 5. BM's bullshit and drama did not stop until my SD got married when she was 18. At that point, my DH basically told BM to eff off and he hasn't spoken to her since.
Sorry but he’s going to be
Sorry but he’s going to be obsessed about his ex and his divorce for a few years. He has no business starting a new relationship until he’s over his divorce.
I hear that.
I've asked him multiple times if he was over his ex, and not in a way that meant he still wanted to be with her. But I asked if he still had emotions going on that made it to where he can't enjoy being happy in the moment. He's insisting he's over it and does not want to break up at all. My main justification for being ok with being with him was that they were together for such a short time. However, it looks like that doesn't always apply.
Someone can be over the ex
Someone can be over the ex but not be over the divorce. They might be continuing to live the divorce and not moving forward with a new family.
You're about my daughter's
You're about my daughter's age, and this is what I would tell her. He is not emotionally available to you because all his energy is going into his divorce. High conflict, high drama, and he's contributing to that atmostphere too. He might say he's doing all this things for his son, but it seems obvious that it is also to hurt his ex. He's churning with negativity and can see nothing else, and that includes you.
Until he IS available,meaning he has put the old relationship aside, go live your own life. You moved in with him way too quickly and are losing yourself to the black hole of his divorce.
I appreciate your thoughts.
I appreciate your thoughts. Yes, I've identified what you said about his energy being towards his divorce and brought it up to him. I also said we shouldn't be together until everything is settled. He said he absolutely does not want to break up, that he and his son would be devastated. I love him a lot but I really do feel like I'm losing myself. Also, I made sure to move in to my own apartment, so fortunately we do not live together. Although, we spend the majority of our time together.
It is unlikely to get better.
It is unlikely to get better. And if you want children, you're with the wrong man.
As soon as he said that, I
As soon as he said that, I said well that's really great to know because that's a relationship dealbreaker. Then he said he doesn't know for sure about kids with me, he might change his mind later.
Not acceptable.
Not acceptable.
Easy for him to say AFTER you
Easy for him to say AFTER you tell him it's a dealbreaker for you. It enables him to string you along. You should trust what he told you initially.
I agree with Merry, your BF
I agree with Merry, your BF is just not DONE with BM, yet.
"he basically said he doesn't
Welcome to the horrors of step life.
In case you missed it, that was your cue to leave this relationship
This guy is still emotionally involved with his wife/ex wife and you are the third wheel.
Given the circumstances here, I would bet money on this being a rebound relationship destined to fail.
Apologies for being so blunt but the writing is already on the wall.
Ugh. I've felt that this was
Ugh. I've felt that this was the case in the back of my mind, and it sucks hearing it.
Dump this loser and go on
Dump this loser and go on with your life. I don't care how much you love him. Many of us have loved the wrong man with all of our heart. But that doesn't mean you have to stay with him. You can STOP loving someone. Not easy and not quick but definitely possible.
Bad news.
They definitely don’t go away, but I get the thinking that “maybe they will get better after divorce, or after another custody battle 2yrs down the road when someone decides they don’t like the current arrangement, after SK turns 18.....” you get the point. There is ALWAYS something, after the divorce. Especially when They have that relationship of constantly being after each other for something. It doesn’t go away, and just wait until that kid can really talk and tell BM things about you. You will forever be wondering what fresh hell awaits.
I started dating my SO when he was separated for a year, and they couldn’t agree on anything about the divorce. The divorce dragged out for almost 2 more years, and it was exactly like you have said- constant texts, bickering, petty bullshit, accusations. It caused many arguments because i wanted him to block her, but he always took the bait when she text or called. I told my SO that it had to stop. Eventually, after me all but forcing him, he blocked her and had it put in the divorce agreement that they would only communicate through the Our Family Wizard app. That has helped. He has gotten better about not engaging with her now that things are settled.
That being said, it’s still a lot of nonsense, accusations, arguments with him and I about her. Sometimes because he doesn’t defend me to her when she tells outlandish lies. I wouldn’t recommend it to anyone!!!
Also, you want kids, and he has given you a “maybe I will change my mind sometime” answer. Well maybe A record label will hear me singing on my Snapchats and tell me I am going to be the next Celine Dione, but I’m not going to Put all my eggs in that basket. What if you stay with him and he doesn’t change his mind??
You have several things in front of you I don’t see you getting past- wanting kids and the resentment. I think you know the answer, it’s just hard to make the decision to end things.
I so appreciate your
I so appreciate your perspective. Your story sounds so similar to mine. When I met him they were alreaday court ordered to only use the My Family Wizarding app, but it's still insufferable. The sound that went off was the same as his texts.... so to me it wasn't any different. They would message each other at all hours of the night until one evening, after 5 consecutive messages from her at 1am on a school night, I asked him to establish reasonable messaging hours from 7am to 10pm, unless it was a true emergency. After that, she would message at 9:59pm.
The sound that went off was the same as his texts....
Then turn the sound off and relax. He doesn't HAVE to read every.single.message the second it comes in. By keeping the sound on, he's maintaining a level of stress that it quite unnecessary.
My BF has the sound off
It makes it less annoying, I guess. Before, he immediately had to respond when she text. Like obsessively so, even though I am positive there were no lingering feelings. So I couldn't understand. That part has gotten better. But as I mentioned, there is no lack of other issues....
It never ends
My partner has been divorced for about four/ five years. He has had another long term relationship between his ex-wife and me. He is still recovering from the trauma of the marriage and the divorce (not the gf in between). Just this past weekend it kicked off in a major way with the ex-wife about his kids.
I'm ok with this because I also have a crazy ex - so in a way it's almost better he has a crazy ex because he can understand where I'm coming from. And my partner is a great stepdad to my kid as I try to be a great stepmom to his kids. However, right now my ex isn't being too crazy, but I shudder to think what it will be like when they both kick off at the same time. Plus, we have less than a year until we have one teen and less than two years until we have two. I would be lying if I said I'd never wished our crazy exes would just simply disappear. I would be lying if I said I'd never wished we'd met 20 years ago - both to have all that time together but also so we didn't have all those complications. I think he would have been great to parent bio children with.
But that isn't the case, so for me, it's totally worth it. Completely, totally, 100% worth it. We are a team. Personally, I would rather NOT be with someone who didn't have kids because at my age there will be no more children and I'd rather have someone who knows how it works. For you, not so much. And if you want your own kids and he's 'not sure' - it will create conflict.
You're about to be at a new
You're about to be at a new place whent he divorce is finished. Hang in there and find out how things might be different. Divorce can be all encompassing, apparently. See how BF changes without it hanging over his head.
Very smart move staying in your own place. Don't change that anytime soon so you can see how BF is in the long run. Get better birth control -- you don't want to be the next woman he tangles with on custody! Don't worry about feeling like the second family now -- you should not be having kids at this point, so be very careful.
I don't say scrap this relationship! The kid loves you and that's amazing to most of us! Yea, it might change, but it might not. You need to give this three-way relationship plenty of dating time before committing, but in spite of what you wrote, I think it has potential.
If this isn't quite the end of the divorce (if it drags on until it's signed and done), tell your BF to stop pulling shit to get one over on BM. It's unhealthy for his kid, BM and him. But most importantly to you, it shows you who he really is and it's not sexy! Divorces are specific to the people in them, but tell him you don't like what you're seeing and it gives you pause. Tell him to play fair and trust in the system because what you're seeing is worrisome. It takes a lot of character for you to admit he's not playing fair (many women defend "their man" in divorces and we all know it takes two to wreck a marriage and spoil a divorce) so don't saddle yourself with him until you know this back biting was specific to these people.
The constant preoccupation about the divorce...I can see how it happens. But you deserve a break from his drama. Next time you're out for a hike on that gorgeous island, flat out tell him it's going to be a healthy hike to clear your heads from all the negativity and you don't want to hear any divorce talk. When it comes up, call him on it. Ditto on the romantic dinner, the day out with his kid, etc. You can say it sweetly and tell him it's for him, you and his son. People have to choose to be happy, and it might be hard for him right now, but you understand that and you'll help him make the right choice by setting a limit to the negativity the divorce is causing. If he can't do this, if he can't give in to you setting this limit, there's your red flag to consider when you think about a future with him.
Whatever you do, don't get stuck by moving in with him, marrying him now, or getting pregnant now. You will forever be tied to this person who you don't really know yet.
And one more thing on whether
And one more thing on whether it gets better after divorce...
I think it does. I'm not divorced, but I've dated men in various stages of divorce and "divorce recovery." To be honest, I think they really need time to get over the trauma, especially if it's an ugly one. I think it can take years. I found the men furtherest out from divorce were the healthiest in most cases. Divorce can make them real bastards with deep hate/mistrust of women. Add to that a general culture of misogyny alive and well in the U.S. and I think it's best to give divorced men a very critical read as potential partners.
If you really like this guy, maybe consider breaking it off now and keeping in touch with him (I know it won't be easy after moving there for him, but hell, it IS Hawaii!) I did this with my now husband when we were dating. That 2-3 year gap between dating the first time and the second time really made a difference in his mood and happiness. It's like he was a different person the second time we dated. However, he had been divorced for a decade the FIRST time we dated, so you might be waiting a long time.
If you think it would help him, suggest therapy or maybe some books about recovering from divorce. If he won't read them, you read them and drop the info on him during those hikes. How he recovers from this is telling of how he can bounce back from other crises you'd experience as a couple, so it's useful information you should pay attention to. You want a strong man who can support you when you lose a job or lose a child or whatever.
Update!
I've been telling BF that because of how engrossed he is with the divorce and his ex, that I'm on my way out of the relationship. He very much wants to be together and says our future is everything to him. This is why he met with BM last week and caved about most of the things he was previously battling over. Although I'm skeptical, this was a major step in the right direction. He also sat me down yesterday and apologized for the statements he made about kids. He said he thinks I would be an amazing mother and would love to some day have one of our own. As someone mentioned, it's hard to fully trust this since it was a response to me saying I want out.
Although this is all nice and in a good direction, I still have my guard up and am keeping my apartment to see how things play out over time. Since I moved here, I've been pouring every ounce of myself in our relationship and have been heavily involved with his son. I took on a real parental role and SS and I have a great, positive connection. (I initiated the removal of the pacifier, encouraged and helped with potty training, established a schedule of play, dinner, bath, bed time, and said co-sleeping needs to gradually end.) At the end of the day, however, I got burned out and realized I need to make sure I'm happy and taking care of me. I'm pulling back more by spending time on my goals and forming other friendships.
Thank you all SO much for taking the time to give me such honest perspectives! I am really valuing this forum of amazing people and have already got a lot out of it.
P.S. Speaking of co-sleeping, that's another question I have for you all in my next post.
My questions to you all are:
My questions to you all are:
1. Do things magically get better after divorce papers are signed?
Not likely. Things only magically get better if your BF holds his X strictly to the terms of the Divorce/Custody/Visitation/Support order and prevents her from intefering in or relationship.
2. Is this resentment temporary or is it a major sign I'm just not able to handle his circumstances?
It depends on how you choose to confront these issues as you and your partner navigate the blended family process.
3. Any other thoughts or comments that might be helpful.
In my own experience... I was not ready for a serious relationship for at least 2+ yars after my divorce was over and had nearly zero interface with my XW. I met my wife of nearly 24 years 3yrs and two months after my divorce was final. We married near the 4 year anniverasary of my divorce being finalized. I dated quite a bit during and for the three years after my divorce but never anyone who was life partner material.... until I met my wife.
By the time my bride invaded my life I had no baggage to work through and I was completely capable of focusing on her and on our relationship. My XW had no presence in our world. Since I have no BKs I brought no physical baggage to our new marriage. DW had SS-25 (he was 15mos old when we started dating) so we did have the whole SpermIdiot and visitation crap to figure out and work through but since DW and I are a team... we figured it out.
My advice is to only move forward with this relationship if you are entirely confident that BF will keep his foot firmly up his XW's butt and not let her be a hinderence to the relationship that you have together. He can't tell you that he will make it happen, he has to demonstrate that he is making it happen, every, single, day.
IMHO of course.
Good luck.