Why is DH always "surprised"?
We are in the home stretch with SSs. It seems as if both will graduate in June and we will be done with CS. BM has been pushing both of them to go to "school". One wants to go into a trade and DH (who works in a trade) could get him into a paid apprenticeship program, but BM is pushing him to consider "trade school", which would require tuition and would not provide paid on-the-job learning and would lead to him earning a lower rung credential. The other SS insists he is going to college and is telling everyone now that he is going to "flight school". This is coming from a kid who has never expressed any interest (at least to us) about anything to do with airplanes and is so anxious that he never wants to go alone outside at the family cabin because he's afraid of seeing a bear or a rattle snake. He also has taken remedial English and math throughout much of his high school career and is only taking one academic class this year (a math class, where his grade is an "adjusted" C), so he's not exactly prepared for any type of post secondary education.
BM has basically been repeatedly messaging DH (via text, even though they are supposed to only communicate via OFW) saying, "I really need you to send me an email detailing what you plan to contribute for the boys' schooling. Time is off the essence." Mind you, she has not told DH what she plans to contribute (SSs have told him that her parents are going to "pay for everything" for them) and has not shared anything about any plans she has discussed with the children, but is insisting DH send her an email. I've told him not to respond, because it seems like a trap from her to pin him down on something. For further context, BM makes at least three times what DH does and her job is providing "financial valuations" to divorce attorneys and business attorneys as part of litigation, so she knows the system. She also didn't provide full income information at the last mediation where she demanded more money, but DH's lawyer just gave up and said, "you can ask for a modification in a year."
Despite all this, I mentioned today that DH should be prepared to get a letter from a lawyer demanding he contribute for "school" and DH's response was, "really? you think she'll ask me for money?" He acted suprised that I even raised the possibility.
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Gads. Is he obligated to
Gads. Is he obligated to contribute college funds? I can't help but wonder if BM is pushing for trade school over a paid apprenticeship because she thinks she'll get money.
Their CO says that BM can
Their CO says that BM can "request additional support" after skids graduate HS, which is why I assume she is pushing both to enroll in school.
In our state, Skids can get an order that he pay for college costs, but DH would pay the college directly, so BM would not be able to skim off the top for herself.
I agree with you, he should
I agree with you, he should not respond, definitely not put anything in writing.
If your DH can get SS into a paid apprenticeship but BM convinces him to do the other, that would be on her.
The other SS doesn't seem like college material, so not sure I would waste any money on that, even if BM convinces him to give it a shot.
I don't know why your DH be surprised that BM wants money.
"If your DH can get SS into a
"If your DH can get SS into a paid apprenticeship but BM convinces him to do the other, that would be on her."
If both are for the same trade, that's a no-brainer.
Exactly
My SGD's hisband got into his trade via his stepdad. Now making very excellent $. I agree, a no-brainer.
Yes, both are in the same
Yes, both are in the same trade, but the apprenticeship offers a much higher credential than trade school and would set him up to earn at least twice as much as the trade school credential. He would also start getting paid hours immediately, so it's a total no-brainer.
What does the court order
What does the court order state regarding higher education?
If your husband is required to contribute, i would suggest to ask an itemized list of expenses related to tuition/schooling as well as proof of college acceptance/enrollment
I wouldnt give an amount I am willing to contribute unless I see the estimated expenses first. Also the payments would be made directly to the institutions in charge
Plus consequences for
Plus consequences for dropping out, not attending, being kicked out.. and go to great lengths in the details.
Yes, I agree with all of
Yes, I agree with all of these. If he's required to pay there would be an agreement with language about taking on a full academic courseload, maintaining good academic standing, sharing all information with DH. And he would only pay the college or other learning institution directly, nothing would go through BM.
And obtaining his diploma
And obtaining his diploma within a pre-defined time frame.
This can be easily addressed.
This can be easily addressed.
Reply to texts and calls from B with a text that says "All communication COd via OFW".
That is it. No OFW, no recognized communication from BM.
Do not reply at all regarding a request from BM regarding DW's contribution to post HS education/training. Not one word.
That one SS is trade interested is great. The other one... is far more likely than not a lost cause. Delusions of grandeur can be prevalent in underperformers.
And yes.... if she can get away with it, BM will go after DH for money even after HS and the SSs age out from under the CO.
Even if BM does not try that manipulation, is is far better to be prepared than not.
I just told DH to ignore all
I just told DH to ignore all text communication. I think BM has actually stopped paying for OFW (she sent DH a text asking him a question about the holiday schedule and all that info is in the agreement and on OFW). DH had started texting her to confirm she'd received CS and I told him to stop. He pays her electronically and has a record on his end that the payment has gone through, so he doesn't need to confirm with her that it's been received. He's just opening the door for texting.
And as I pointed out to DH, she will try to wring him dry for every penny she can get. We had planned to move and DH wanted to start getting ready to put our house on the market. I told him we had to wait until closer to graduation, because I'm not interested in any of that being used against us.
I had this argument with Chef
Quite a while ago bc the CO was so ambiguous and based on a MOU that had holes so large you could drive a semi through them. He would argue that his kids aren't smart enough to get into secondary education.
I would counter that today you don't have to be smart to get into secondary education and you can have bad grades as well because the colleges are just looking for your money. Many times no real education takes place. In fact most of the colleges today love it when the kids are perma students and can continue paying while flunking out. Cash cow.
Fortunately Chef's ferals hated going into a classroom so in that way I lucked out.
This right here. My mom would
This right here. My mom would always say to me "just wait until they get in", because BM's demands about college money started when Skids were in middle school.
I can see both of them just staying in school forever, just so BM could continue to collect money.
This same BM demanded her former stepson start paying rent the moment he turned 18 and I think skids might already have to buy their own groceries, but in all "official" documents, BM would be paying for every penny for her precious darlings.
A paid Union apprenticeship is so much better than any trade
A paid Union apprenticeship is so much better than any trade school. Your SS would be foolish to consider anything else, especially if he can get in as a legacy.
So true!
So true!
Past organizations I have led offerered paid helper
progression programs. The open shop version of a Union traids apprenticeship. Often facilated through the NCCER that offers a portable certification that the tradesperson can take with them to future employers.
For a kid not capable or willing to pursue college studies, I advise a trades progression program. Union or non union, it does not matter.
I have advised any number of my Craft employees to pursue college studies as they worked well compensated trade positions. I did an analysis for grad school on optimizing career long income. I used my organizaton as the data set for that analysis. Starting a trades iniated career optimizes early career income that initiates them increases while a full time non working university student generally earns nothing. By the 4th year the trades employee is making $60K+per year not including OT.
Working on completing a degree opens transition opportunities to higher compensation professional positions for the later half of a career.
If pursued in parallel, trade certifications and degrees can add $hundreds thousands of additional ncome to career earnings and avoid excessive physical wear due to pursuing OT to maintain highest incomes in a pure trades career in the final 20+ years of a career.
DH could get Skid into either
DH could get Skid into either a union or a non-union apprenticeship for this trade. Both of which would be better preparation (they would result in a higher credential and also offer paid hours in year 1) than the trade school BM is pushing.
It would be ridiculous for Skid to follow what BM is telling him to do. DH has reminded him that he will assist and also set up a meeting for Skid with the local intake coordinator for the apprenticeship program.
"BM is pushing him to
"BM is pushing him to consider "trade school", which would require tuition and would not provide paid on-the-job learning and would lead to him earning a lower rung credential"
So ask SS what would be the point in sitting in a classroom to obtain an inferior qualification that would put him on the absolute bottom rung of the ladder in the working world because he'd be starting with no realwork experience and that would cost money to boot. The other option would give him that experience and he'd get paid as well! He'd need to be beyone PAS'd to go for the first one.
Of course, your husband could simply refuse to pay for the first option and insist SS go for the second citing the kids future as reasoning.
DH has talked to SS and told
DH has talked to SS and told him that the apprenticeship is a better option. And DH works in this trade, so his word should mean more than BM's (who always complained that DH was beneath her because he was in a trade).
I do think I will have DH make the argument that he facilitated a better alternative and therefore will not contribute to trade school costs.
BM is losing control
She also is losing money , wheb CS ends. She will do anything not to lose CS money. By getting it in other ways. If you only communicate by "OFW". Why is he reading these texts, he giving her a opening. To get into your life. I feel that it's a parents duty to help there kids get started. A union program is great because there's a job after it, school. Who knows what's after that.
Time to run the family finances numbers, seeing how much money is available, were you putting off thing until CS ended. I am not saying you should pay for all of it. Or even equal to CS. But every little bit helps.
BM's dirty little secret (and
BM's dirty little secret (and DH's error) is that when they were married DH received an inheritance from his grandmother. He put that money into an account to cover college costs for Skids, but then BM "needed it" to cover business expenses, so DH allowed her to liquidate the account and use that money. When they divorced. BM convinced DH that he had no claim to any of her business assets, because she was a "solo practitioner" (even though she had established an LLC), so he just gave up any claim to anything.
Has your SO confirmed what
Has your SO confirmed what the trade kid wants to do.. will he do the apprenticeship program? If the kid won't buy into DH's plan.. it's tough to say where it could end up.
For the kid that wants to go to college.. does he realize flight school is a different thing..lol?
I don't know what your SO's plans have been to support if any his kid's education after HS.
He could respond to her that he will talk to each kid about his plans before he decides about any contributions if any.
He could simply say he was not planning on contributing.. that it's up to the kids to make their way too..lol.
Skid actually reached out to
Skid actually reached out to DH and told him he was interested in DH's trade and asked him about it.
I'm not sure if the kid is looking at flight school or an aviation program at a college. He has not told DH anything. DH asked him what he wants to do and he always acts like it's a state secret. We were at a family event though and someone asked him what he planned to do and he said, "I'm going to flight school" and listed a town where one of the local colleges is.
DH had set money aside for college costs for skids, from an inheritance he received from his grandmother, but then BM "needed it" to cover unpaid taxes for her business, so DH said it was okay to liquidate it (they were married at the time). I think BM claimed she would pay it back and even told DH in the beginning that instead of paying child support, he should pay back that account (none of that was in writing, so BM would have used that against him if he did that). DH had nothing but debt when they divorced and his trade was hit hard by the 2008 recession, so he's only recently been able to get back to where he was when he was married to BM. I always reminded him that if he wanted to pay something for college, he would need to start saving, but I would not be covering college costs and he would not be paying less for our joint costs to cover college, but he did not listen. BM has not seemed to put anything away, even though she earns and income that would put her close to the 1% of earners.
My current thinking is that DH would agree to some small amount that we would contribute and that would be it. We currently have lots of our own expenses and DH has had health issues that have disrupted his working this year. I'm not going bankrupt to cover "education" expenses for two kids who are not serious about postsecondary education.
Why is DH always "surprised"?
Why is DH always "surprised"?
Short-term memory loss could be another option...
I think that is definitely
I think that is definitely part of it. He always seems to forget that no matter how many times he "helps" BM or agrees to what she wants or lets her violate the agreement without complaining, it will never win him even a second of consideration from her. He will always just be "out to get her" or "being mean" or any other number of crybaby responses.
I have since learned (after
I have since learned (after asking DH) that the reason second SS is considering "flight school" is because his grandfather suggested it to him and said, "if you can't be a pilot, you can always be a mechanic." This kid has never expressed interest in flying (and he's afraid of his own shadow, so honestly can't see this being a real interest) and has never expressed any interest in fixing anything in any way. Any time DH is doing any sort of repairs or working on anything, he tries to get SSs to help. This SS wouldn't even help DH with yard work. It's almost as if he (and BM and grandfather) don't seem to realize that in order to actually work in these fields you need to have some sort of interest in them.
Certified air frame, avionics
Certified air frame, avionics, or aviation engine mechanics can make a very good living. As for delusions of grandeur, I had them myself as a young man/late teen. My GM was hell bent on me being a Doctor, so... I entered University on an honors Pre-Med program. That lasted one semester. I was not focused nor was I interested in Pre-Med. That one semester of Honors Pre-Med started my 11 year undergrad career. I was in class, at least part time, every semester for 11yrs. 11yrs, 7 different majors, and 7 different collegres or universities. When I finished y BS which are usually around 120 semester hours of class, I had nearly 250 semester hours of credit. I changed majors so often that each semester I only got a few hours that ultimately applied to the one BS I did complete. After my Masters, my total semester hour count is onver 300. Almost enough for 3 different Bachelor's degrees.
I found my way, my was is a passion for adventure and journeying. I have had a very fun career, studied broadly enough to know a bit about a lot of stuff and deeply enough to know a lot about a bit of stuff.
I hope these kids can find their path without to much pain.
I hope that for everyone.
My dad started off his career
My dad started off his career as an airline mechanic, so I have respect for the profession. But my father loved figuring out how things worked, especially vehicles of any sort, even as a young child and "apprenticed" himself off to a neighbor who owned a local service station and mechanic shop around age 10 or 11. He would basically do anything asked of him in return for getting a chance to learn more about engines. This SKid has never expressed any interest in anything like that and has struggled in science and math classes. He may eventually find his way, but I don't see anything that requires any degree of precision in his near future.
He has recently talked about joining the Air Force (even that will be a stretch for him academically and he has not taken the placement test), but that might give him some direction because they force you to move in a direction once you've joined. Otherwise, he'll just flounder about. He's again changed his classes senior year (as he's done every year since the third grade), likely due to a teacher being "too mean" (i.e. asking him to do something that feels difficult or giving him the grade he deserved (likely a D or maybe a low C)).
The USAF needs any number of
The USAF needs any number of jobs filled. They can always use base security personnel.
My DW's HS BFF's youngest took the ASVAB and scored in the bottom 2% and the USAF still accepted him. He is in the USAF Security Forces and his job is pretty much as a gate guard. He is stationed in the UK so even in that AFCS some interesting duty stations are possible.
My SS's former SO is in the USAF Security Forces and just extended for an additional multiple years in Germany.
For extremely sharp young people, there are some top tier jobs in the USAF with extensive technical training and huge private sector cross over career translation upon retirement or departure from active duty. My Skid is in one of those. He is approaching his 13th service anniversary and intends to do at least 20yrs to qualify for full retirment before he is 40.
My SS is not sharp in the
My SS is not sharp in the slightest...he lacks common sense and is also lazy as all get out when it comes to school. In addition, if he finds something to be "too hard" he uses any excuse he can to get out of it. He wouldn't last 5 minutes in the Air Force.