I can't keep going with all this stress
It's not enough that we have court with BM in less than 3 weeks. My ex just won't quit.
I responded very politely in my last email to him, I did not include his wife in my reply even though while trying to communicate with my children's father, she takes over.
Last night with DD13 was all "my dad said that if I move with him, he is going to stay home to home school me"... "my dad said that if I stay home with him we are going to look at travel ball" --- My blood was BOILING. It was so hard to not scream in a restaurant that she is being played. You can't just switch to homeschool- I would never allow it. You have never been allowed to play travel ball (the sport you wanted to quit last week, remember) because of the visitation schedule we have with your father. Your dad wants to stay home, not work and not pay CS and as long as he gets to you there, he gets to do that.
Just now, this asshat texts me asking if I responded to his wife's email. I said yes, I responded to YOU yesterday. He asked me to resend it, so I did, to him. Then he says "Got it, I'll forward to (his wife's name) now to coordinate the schedule".
I am going to have a freaking anxiety attack with all of this stress. I decided to respond with "I would prefer that all communications regarding our children remain between the actual parents at this time".
I can't wait until this counselor meeting today. Sorry, I feel like you are all going to be overwhelmed by blogs from me the next few weeks. Feel free to tell me to shut up and deal with it.
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Comments
You need to lawyer up. I know
You need to lawyer up. I know you don't want to but you need to get ahead of the ball.
And keep posting!!!! We want to support you so these two don't win.
Ugh I am so sorry for you!
I really feel bad how it is coming from all directions, the stress of SS and his BM, your other SS that lives at your home, and now your ex DH trying to manipulate your DD into living with him so he gets what he wants.
Can I ask how long your ex DH and SM have been together? To me it sounded like they have been together quite a while from what you had posted, but the way their behavior has been makes it sound like they are newly together. I guess the new baby is what is changing all this with them?
You have been more than considerate and flexible, but don't sit quietly on this one just to keep things amicable. I agree with Gimlet, I think it is time to talk to a lawyer. I do not think he is going to give up on trying to get CS reduced and is going to just look for another angle to make this happen until he gets what he wants.
I said it yesterday and I will say it today too as it is still true, your ex DH is acting like a child throwing a temper tantrum and is now basically trying to ignore you by pushing the matters off to his wife to handle. Whether that is by his want or SM's want it doesn't matter, it is unacceptable and it is clear they cannot handle this without having a lawyer or court involved.
I think they have been
I think they have been together for about 7 years.
I agree that this is a temper fit on their part and it is time for an attorney. I really have not wanted to go there, just because we have done so well the last 10 years without one. I was hoping this was a minor flare up but I think it is going to turn into something big.
I'm guessing it is about the new baby coming
and their short sighted wants for the new baby. They WANT XH to stay home with new baby, they WANT to stop paying as much CS, and they WANT other factors to not keep them from what they want. It would be one thing if XH got laid off and needed a month or two reduction of CS, STILL NOT your problem whatsoever, but my point is that it is not as though something unseen came up and is kindly asking you to be flexible. It is not your responsibility to make up for his end to accomplish what your XH wants or for your kids to receive less so he gets the nice stay at home dad gig.
I do agree with you and everyone else, unfortunately it doesn't seem like it is going to be something minor you can sort our amongst yourselves. Perhaps it will not need to go to court, but you need to at least bark and show your teeth that you are serious with the help of a lawyer.
I think you need to sit down
I think you need to sit down with your daughter and explain reality versus the fantasy her dad is telling her. I also think you need to listen to her if AFTER you talk to her and she spends more time with her dad that she decides she wants to still live with him.
My brother wanted DESPERATELY to live with my dad in spite of my mom being a good parent (at the time). It had nothing to do with her and everything to do with his preference in living situation. With my mom, he lived with two very loud, squabbling sisters. With dad, there would be quiet, and my brother wanted the quiet.
I know right now that this is your ex and his wife trying to PAS your daughter. You combat that with truth. But, if she has solid reasons why she may want to live with her dad, you should consider letting her go LATER. Not sure when her birthday is, but you could tell her that she can decide at 14, but what she decides at 14 is where she stays until 18.
As for your ex, I'd give him one warning after you talk to DD that if he doesn't stop filling DD's head with promises he can't commit to that you'll be following the CO to the letter and seeking a readjustment to CS. Tell him that if he really wants DD to live with him, then he and you alone can schedule a time to chat about it together, either with or without a mediator. But using DD as a vehicle for communication and using her to "persuade" you stops NOW.
If he TRULY wanted what was best for DD, then he would be talking WITH YOU about it, not giving DD false hope. Having just gone through this with DH and ET, there is a right way and a wrong way to approach an actual custody switch. Going through the child isn't the way to do it. Talking to a child and asking their preferences, talking about reality versus fantasy, and setting realistic expectations for the long haul is right. What your XH is doing is wrong. IF his intentions are pure (BIG if that I wouldn't bet money on), then you're giving him the opportunity to address it with YOU, the parent. If they aren't, you'll have to address it via the courts.
This is all hitting at a bad time, and your anxiety is through the roof. I don't have much advice on that front, but know that you're not wrong in thinking this smells fishy. Combat the fantasy with the reality, address your XH directly, and take it to court if that's necessary. You're not there yet, though, and you won't be the bad guy if it gets to that point.
I understand what you are
I understand what you are saying.
I think that if I told her she still wanted to go with her dad at the start of HS (she turns 14 in the middle of 8th grade), that we can consider it. It would allow her to get back into the real world, see her friends again. Get out of the pandemic slump, Her dad will probably have had to start work again and the baby will be in daycare and not so much a baby at that point. Terrible 2's are awesome.
If she still wants to go then, I could see letting it happen.
You are right though, all of this is PAS and need to be nipped. It may be a letter from an attorney to do so, at least that is just a few hundred bucks. Hell, my corporate attorney might even do it for free. He loves me. He is kind of a creeper that calls me "baby doll". LOL
"Your dad wants to stay home,
"Your dad wants to stay home, not work and not pay CS "
And use you for baby care.
Heck, he might even turn her into a full-blown Cinderella and get her to do all the cleaning too.
Yup, and have OP start paying
Yup, and have OP start paying him CS.
It would probably be a wash
It would probably be a wash or close to it. My BS15 said no way in hell is he going to live there.
I am going to address how to
I am going to address how to talk to her with the couselor today. I am so afraid of saying the wrong thing and making it all worse.
Also- He just responded that SM is his wife and can speak on his behalf. I have spoken to her for years and can continue to do so.
My response: Is there any reason you are unable to coordinate the care and parenting of our children yourself?
Him: No reason at all. Blah, blah, blah- you need to stop the hostility and do what's best DD. I have great relationship with my stepson's father. She is the one requesting this and you just need to respect her wishes.
Me: "You are playing stay at home dad now. I don't see what is so abusrd about coparenting with you directly. I realize in the past you had a demanding career and therefore in the best interests of our children I worked with your wife. I am not being hostile, I am just wanting to coparent with my other coparent directly. I am glad that you have a great relationship with your stepson's father. I know that his helpful with his behavioral issues and him having to be sent to his father so often. Our kids don't have those issues so I don't see why, now that you have the time, you can't just communicate with me directly?"
Him: Well it worked in the past with SM at the helm, so that just needs to continue
--- I am not responding anymore until I speak with an attorney. ---
Stick to that plan
LD has a very valid point that sometimes moving households can be beneficial for some children. They're older, they've carefully thought out their schooling options and the other parent is fully on board with co-parenting in the best interest of the child. Being sold a pipe dream by a man who can't bring himself to co-parent and hands all the decision making to his wife isn't the same thing. It just boggles the mind that he can't see the irony of wanting to be a SAHD while at the same time not wanting "dad" responsibilities.
He also raised a very good issue. He expects you to continue to respond because you've always responded in the past. The longer you play nice and respond to the wife, the longer you've set up that precedence. So stop immediately. Don't even bother with the stress of explaining that to him. Leave it to his lawyer. I wish I was a fly on the wall when he explains to his lawyer that his ex refuses to communicate to his new wife regarding parenting and custody decisions of his own kids and what rights does he have to insist on that dynamic....
Yeah, I am just not
Yeah, I am just not responding to SM anymore. I just put a call into my corporate attorney to see if he would write (as his paralegal said) one of his famous letters for me to attach to the custody agreement that we have already come up with and just not signed yet before all of this nonsense with him not wanting to pay child support started.
I hope it doesn't go to court
I hope it doesn't go to court but even an idiot can see he has a snowflake's chance of getting full custody. She's got medical issues and he's never been the custodial parent since she was born. Even now "my household is better because I can rely on my wife" doesn't hold much weight. And if the whole point of this exercise was to save money, court is NOT the way to do it. Show some teeth and they'll back down and choose the less expensive route.
Why the change? why the
Why the change? why the hostility?
You have held yourself out as wanting to be a stay at home parent.. and want to avoid financial responsibility for your children. If you want to be a stay at home parent.. surely you could manage to actually act in the parental capacity and deal with these issues directly? And the hostility? You don't think your attempts to undermine my authority with my children.. go behind my back to bribe with unrealistic expectations.. all designed to reduce your financial burden so you can stay home and play daddy daycare to your new baby? and you wonder why our parenting dynamic has changed? YOU changed it by trying to shirk your responsibilities... I know you may have gotten used to me giving in and agreeing to less than I was entitled to.. but your unrealistic expecations and requests.. have made that relationship impossible to maintain with you.. you are the one that wanted this change in our relationship... keeping your wife in the loop is no longer anything that I will be interested in doing. we can get our lawyers to do all the communication if you want to keep pressing this? is that your preference?
What a d*ck! I do NOT like
What a d*ck! I do NOT like the way he speaks to you. Don't put up with his bullsh*t JMTB. I'm glad you are going to send the letter.
I am just wanting to
Funny how this usually drops off when a new spouse is introduced. I went through this with exH with his second wife who would respond to me pretending to be him. It was glaringly obvious that it was her responding. Now I'm dealing with the same thing with his third wife whose second language is English. I'll get an email from "the ex" in broken English that is clearly wife #3. Luckily the kids are all over 18 now so there's not so much communication. I have no idea if he pawned off his responsibility to his current wives or if they needed that control. Whatever the case it was annoying that there was no actual co-parenting with the other parent, it was all with his current spouse.
I admit I wrote ExH responses
I admit I wrote ExH responses, but he was present and I expressed his opinion at all times (even when I disagreed). His Attorney forbid him responding with out my or his direct assistance as ExH never phrased things well and made a $10,000.00 mistake which had to be corrected through court. (For those nosy like me - He gave the impression he was in agreement with a move 400 miles away because he did not directly say No to the hypothetical, BM up and moved.)
Please save those texts. He
Please save those texts. He wants to be a full time parent & can't even be bothered to talk to you, but rather pawns you off on his wife. A judge would have a feild day with this one.
I think you need to go into
I think you need to go into beast mode tbh.
To your EX.
Let me be clear. I will not coordinate or discuss issues pertaining to our children with your wife.period. You will communicate with me directly. I will neither respond, nor acknowledge any communication from "that woman". Your wife, your new child.. they should have zero impact on issues related to our children. If you prefer that we communicate soley through legal representatives.. that can be arranged.
Also, You will cease discussing potential changes in custody regarding our children. You have no business "bribing" our daughter and setting her up for disappointment. We have NOT agreed to any changes and there will be no changes in custody if I have anything to do with it. All you are doing is causing your children to be confused and hurt by these conflicting messages. Any attempt to discuss this with THEM will be considered an attempt at parental alienation and will be dealt with severely in a courtroom setting. Consider yourself put on notice.
To your daughter.
I'm sorry that your dad has discussed things with you that have not been agreed to. Since he has chosen to broach adult subjects with you.. he must feel you are old enough to hear more details about custody issues. So, I will give you some further perspective. Unfortunately, his motivation for changes appears to be driven by his desire to stay home with his new child and reduce the amount of support he pays for you and your brother. Unfortunately, he doesn't have sole decision making on your schooling. I would not be inclined to agree to home schooling and I think that you would agree that being isolated from a normal social life would probably not be as fun as he may be making it seem. The bottom line is that he is promising something that in reality he can't guaranty. And..Travel ball is something that you could pursue HERE too... if he is a proponent of supporting that.. he could certainly pay for that to happen now instead of asking me to get less financial support from him. I was under the impression you were considering not doing softball in the future.. but if you want to pursue travel ball.. and your dad is in for paying for it.. we might be able to see how that would work here. I know he is trying to make it sound super attractive for you to make a move... and I don't doubt that he loves you and likes the time you spend together, but he has no business discussing changes in custody with you that have not been agreed to. And, you are old enough to know that the motivation for these changes is that he wants to stay home with his new baby... and that you moving there would get him out of some financial obligations to me for your care.... Homeschooling won't be an option there..so what he is trying to offer you is not reality as it could play out. I'm sorry that I have had to explain these things to you... I believe that adult issues should remain discussions with adults.. but I do also need to make sure that you are getting a more full and balanced perspective on what you are hearing from him.
I am going verify with the
I am going verify with the therapist today, but I think this is stuff she is going to have to hear now. Unfortunately him making promises like this to her are just horrible.
Your ex wants to take BD out
Your ex wants to take BD out of school and home school her...why? Teenage years are when they should be with their peers not isolated at home with dad.
Given your daughters medical history will your ex be capable of dealing with that on top of being a stay at home dad caring for a toddler. I don't think it would be conducive for a toddler to spend all day in the ER while his half sister is being treated for a debilitating migraine.
The childish thinking that he doesn't have to deal with you because he hasn't had to in the past due to work and the not wanting to continue to pay CS for his children.
All of this presented to a lawyer is not going to bode well for him or paint a very good picture of him, even if he is a retired military captain/admiral/etc.
"Your ex wants to take BD out
"Your ex wants to take BD out of school and home school her...why?"
To have a built-in, free babysitter ...
My corporate attorney is
My corporate attorney is writting up a letter for me. One of his partners handles custody and will take over if I need it. He agrees that this will probably shut him up pretty quick and that he has no case for a move.
Great. Amazing how quick
Great. Amazing how quick people can turn into alienators, isn't it? I assume your ex has some narcissistic traits?
Looking back I see more and
Looking back I see more and more.
We weren't physically together most of our marriage, he was home roughly one weekend a month for 8 out of the 10 years we were married. What I thought was PTSD, probably was a combination of things.
This makes me soooo sad to
This makes me soooo sad to hear. I thought things were smoother on that side!!!!
I'm glad you're sending the letter via your attorney!
So in order for your EX
To be a stay at home dad for his new baby. He needs to stop paying CS
This is the point to all of this. He a real winner. I must say.
Home schooling your DD plays into this HOW ?
He wants to take away your DD time in high school. Her time to thing what needed in life. Group working together. Being a Team as in business, sports clubs ect. So he doesn't have to work.
this lazy guy is going to be a great teacher
I didn't have time to read
I didn't have time to read all the responses. I'd block SM from contacting you, and start a Google Calendar and share Read privileges with him only. If he wants to give SM access, that's up to him. Then only answer him, and ignore anything that doesn't need to be answered.
Custody battles cost $10-30k or more. I doubt he has the funds for that.
ETA: It's not going to look good for him that this all started with his requesting a CS reduction, and saying he doesn't want to work. I hope you have all that crap in writing. Start keeping a journal of all the promisess he's been making to DD.
EATA: Don't reduce his parenting time, a judge would see that as vindictive. And don't threaten him with court. If you need to take him to court, just do it. If he takes you to court, his CS will be reviewed and increased. That should be a deterrent.
Co parenting is between two
Co parenting is between two parents. Custodial issues are between two parents.
There is nothing in CO about dad's wife or mom's husband having custody or authority in parenting. Nothing. Zero.
So why dads or moms SOs would demand to be the ones to coordinate scheduling and custodial arrangements? I really don't understand.
So parents shouldn't coordinate anything and delegate to their spouses? By this logic OP's DH and SM should be making all arrangements about OP's kids and actual parents should step back. It's weird.
I get it some men are incapable and SMs step in but it's not something required. OP did not have children with ex's wife. SM isn't a parent in this equation.
I'm confused, a judge most of
I'm confused, a judge most of the time WILL require the parents to communicate about their children. Her communication isn't excessive, demanding or constant. If they need to discuss something as big as custody change, or a change in visitation time that would be required by the courts for the parents to communicate, not put the SM in the middle.
Nothing bad has been said
Nothing bad has been said about the SM- the OP isn't making her the villain, she simply would rather communicate about big decisions like custody changes with the actual parent that says he wants to have her in his custody. Makes perfect sense.
Wellllll, about communication
Wellllll, about communication. I know a few cases where BM's have been told to send all important updates to ex's via mail, as in United States Postal Service. Lets face it some divorced parents don't talk at all.
Granted I am really coming late to this. Most of you know my xdh and I have 50 50 shared residential, NO support exchanged. I worked, he worked. He carried insurance. Why would I take money from him for child support. Our situation was not like some bm's where dad have zero time with minor kids,
. Anyway...Justmakingthebest...If I were in your shoes, I would 'consider'---just 'consider' this:
Let her go live with Dad. It is natural for her to want to go. Maybe you never thought this day would come??? I, on the other hand, am not surprised. Your x isn't a bad dad, or a drunk or a drug addict. Thank your lucky star's (((HUGS))))
I would Keep her with you until August so you can have the majority of summer with her..
You could have a new court order written UP that clearly states IF daughters grades drop below, you pick the grade that is in her range, she will be returned to YOU without issue at the end of the current school semester per Cali school district. Your x would have to agree with that reasonable entry.
I must admitt I am not a fan of homeschooling myself, but I am aware of success stories.
Flip the current visitation schedule since it seems to work ok. You would have all summers, and all holidays. You pay flight back to your airport, dad pays flight back to his.
You know your x has good medical insurance so that is not an issue, right?
Everyone on here brings to the table their own experiences. Mine turned out very good. It was not easy to get there but I am so glad we did.
I know you are upset, and I can tell it hurts too. I also know my consideration is nothing compared to what the majority wrote. It's just something to think about.
Edit to add....I tend to agree, this is between xdh and you.
.
If she thought this was about
If she thought this was about a legitimate desire for DAD to have more time with his daughter... and that desire was mutual.. I have a feeling that JMTB might have been at least receptive to the discussion.
But what happened was he informs her that he wants to retire and take care of his baby as a SAHD. Can she agree to lower the CS?
The only change is his choice to indulge his desire to stay home with his baby. It's not that he offered up at the beginning.. that he also thought he should take over care for his daughter too.
When JMTB said.. "no.. I have already been accepting less than would be ordered by 400/month" that's when he pops up and decides there is more than one way to skin the financial cat and he will get his daughter to live with him.. (also could be a fab live in babysitter.. but he hasn't shown THAT card)
So, it really isn't so much a "you have had the chance to full time parent our kids.. now I want the chance with them.. he wanted to do it with his NEW child and only started bargaining around with his other kid to get to the same financial goal.
I think his motives are suspect and may well be driven by his desire to want what he wants.. even if it means he doesn't really meet the obligations to his first kids.
Have you gone online to
Have you gone online to calculate the CS for the son you have with you, giving he was underpaying by $400 a month? If your calculations keep is a wash (same as you receive but he has full custody of DD) I'll bet anything he will back off from the deal so quick your head will spin.
There will be some difficult
There will be some difficult days and weeks ahead. It's very hard.
Oh I hear ya, ^^^ there was a point I also thought, Hmmm jerk doesn't want to pay me cs so THAT is why he wants 50 50 .
But I could not over look he was their dad too...sure we were divorced but they love him as much as they love me. I was on that fence Jerk, good dad, JERK JERK , good dad. Ahole doesn't want to give me money, good dad. I knew I could win full custody. But that would hurt the kids.
Anyway this is not about me Justmakingthebest,,if you are reading this...I am so sorry you are having to go through this. It's a lot.
I know you will make the best decision for your situation.
It probably would be a lot
It probably would be a lot easier if they were local to each other... but splitting up siblings... uprooting the girl at this point..doesn't seem totally designed to rectify a lack of time with dad.. and I do get the impression that JMTB has been pretty generous there too.
For me, the biggest thing
For me, the biggest thing that makes me think JERK versus good dad is that hr hasn't talked to OP about these plans. CS changes so he could be a SAHD were delivered to OP by SM. DD living with Dad was delivered by DD. These are major changes, and he as the parent needs to be the only handling them and tackling them with OP. And now that OP is willing to talk about them (granted, not nearly as favorably as if he'd come to her first), he won't unless his wife handles it. OP already knows the wife's position; what she doesn't know is what her XH has planned to make sure their 13 year old is taken care of. Has he found a neurologist for her? Has he chosen a homeschool curriculum? Does he know the cost of the travel sport she is playing, if she is eligible for the team, etc?
BM in my life had/has a knack for funneling things she doesn't want to talk about with DH through the boys. It's usually things that she knows DH wouldn't agree to/with, and she assumes DH will say yes if the boys ask. Or if she asks "on behalf of the boys". She thinks she's being sneaky by doing it, but you can see it a mile away. She has even physically turned her back from DH to ask SSs questions that DH should really be answering (like changes to custody days).
If OP's XH genuinely wants his daughter to live with him, he needs to call OP to discuss how to make that happen. When YSS moved in with us, BM didn't share much. It was a NIGHTMARE. Her inability to talk to DH made it hard to get or share info, and we were dealing with a suicidal YSS who entered into weekly therapy within 12 hours of moving in with us.
OP has every reason to be cautious about this. She shouldn't outright deny the request, but she certainly shouldn't entertain a move that transplants her DD away from her specialists, out of her school, and into a new, intense structure of sports without talking to DD's father about it. ESPECIALLY if he is planning to be the SAHD who coordinates all of this AND didn't have issues with talking to OP before.
I find myself musing over the
I find myself musing over the fact that he thinks he'd be getting a good money deal by taking his daughter... This man clearly has no idea how much a teenage girl can cost.
Amen to that.
Amen to that.
At one time, my husband was
At one time, my husband was so wanting to have his son that he agreed to continue paying full CS if she would allow his son to live with us. She happily agreed when she had a new boyfriend who didn't want a kid around but then yanked him back when she was alone and lonely and "needed him". I told DH at the time to get it all legally changed, but he believed they would keep things cordial.
If your XH wanted your daughter for those reasons, I would consider it. But he doesn't.
Also, I find it awfully confusing that she should both quit playing ball and join a travel ball team. I think your attorney should take that as he is willing to foot the costs of paying for travel ball and ask to have that included in your new CS agreement requests. You can always negotiate that away, but it sure seems like Dad is pro-travel ball even to the point of paying for it.
That's one of the points that
That's one of the points that kills me. Because of our out of state visitation schedule with him, she was never able to play travel. Why would that be any different if I was the non-custodial? Her visits with me would make it impossible. Why does she want to quit one team but join another? Who knows.
It is a lot of empty promises. THAT is really bothering me because now, even though I have been the primary parent her whole life and been there for her as he was pursuing his career, now I am the bad guy and he won't even be able to keep these promises.
Silly, manipulative wabbit.
He has NO idea how expensive teen girls are. No way could my DH have afforded it w/o my income.
I'm quite curious about where the SM is coming from in all this. Does she even know her H is trying to get your DD to live with them? SM may be willing to be the breadwinner now, but working to support someone else's kid is a very different proposition. Can you just see it? She'd be working full time AND be expected to pick up all the slack at home AND pay for a teenaged girl's needs AND pony up for travel ball.
I almost wish you could give it a test run, JMTB. It would be highly entertaining.