I agree that this seems to be the main problem in second marriages. Half the people here on StepTalk are here because their spouse is putting them in the backseat to their kids and it's not working.

Someone said it best when they said "happy parents make happy children". The parents, whether bio or step, need to put one another first in order to provide a happy stable environment for the kids to thrive in.

I am so glad that my fiance does his best to make me and our relationship his first priority. We deal with a lot of problems from SD's BM, but we are always a united front. This is why I even stick around!

when I first meet my partner, then was introduced do his sons, the youngest said to me, " my dad will never marry you" as he had possibly had that discussion with them through the guilt of leaving.
Yep his kids are number 1. And to keep the ex happy he sometimes acts like shes number 2. Then I guess I come in at number 3.
But I always put him at number 1.
My kids know and feel this he is my number 1. They are teenagers and soon will be off on their own.
And he is no closer to being commited than when we first met.
Definetley something in it.

I think that is a major factor in second marriages. I also think another reason is the shear amount of personal and emotional baggage that goes into a second marriage. In our first marriage we don't deal with ex's, child support, and kids that we didn't raise in the formative years of their life.

I know that for me..I think one of the biggest issues I deal with is the fact that my current husband acts more like he is married to his brat then to me..And I guess that is putting her #1 instead of me..And yes, I guess some of it is guilt but honestly, another part of it is that I think that he was seeking "a mom" for his child and not a companion for himself..

I don't under stand why it is that when a female marries a man with children society feels she is magically OBLIGATED to his children..I mean lets face it..The expectations placed on Step Mothers is impossible..

septembers_child

I agree that it seems marriage the second time around when there are children involved push us into the backseat and it's a pretty crappy feeling. I keep thinking maybe the vows should be changed for step marriages...maybe if we didn't expect to be our spouses priority it wouldn't feel so bad...

Maybe our vows should include informing each other know that we are aware that we are #2 or #3 until....when?????

Listen, babe, from this day forward, I promise to love you and cherish you. I promise to be faithful, and I know you love me, and I love you but it's okay to please your exspouse before me....it's okay to spend all our extra money on your kids w/o conferring with me, and leave nothing for our family because of your guilt. I promise to still be by your side when your ex cries "woe is me" and has your ear for an hour. Until your children grow up and take their own mates to put as #1 (unless they marry someone who is divorced and has kids...) then I will remain yours truly, #3.

Have i lost it?

As big of a jackass as my husband is, I do have to give him credit for not failing me as far as his list of priorities goes. I mean, work does come first a lot of times out of necessity, especially before he retired from the military... I'm sorry, sir, I can't deploy to Iraq with the squadron because I need to spend some quality time with my wife. Yeah, right. But I've never, ever felt like I came second. Oh, we've had more than our fair share of marital problems, but it was never because of a priority issue. He's always put me/us first, even if it meant pissing off BM and risking her withholding visitation. I think we have the opposite problem, which is him trying too hard and setting unrealistic standards for himself to try to make me happy, because he feels guilty for all the crap his ex-wife has put us through during our marriage. He tends to overcompensate and that causes him a lot of self-induced stress. A lot of our problems stem from his guilt over bringing that wretched woman into my life, our kids'lives and even the skids' lives.

I disagree with the second part of that for us, too. I don't think it makes it easier for us to get a divorce, since we've both already been divorced once. I think it makes it even harder for us to consider divorce, because we know what it's like, we don't want to put our kids through that, we don't want to have failed twice and we already know that happiness comes from within our marriage, not from outside of it.

I personally think the biggest cause of marriage failure is unrealistic expectations and that goes for whether it's your first marriage, your second marriage or your tenth marriage. No one expects to have to work this hard.

~ Anne ~

Ladies and gentlemen, take my advice: Pull down your pants and slide on the ice! -M*A*S*H (Sidney Freedman to the OR staff on dealing with stress)

My husband puts his son first 100%, then himself, and I fall somewhere down the line. At first this was real hard for me to handle. My first husband put his job first and I left him after three years. I was on my own for over 8 before I got remarried again. My current husband is real selfish. First he is the guilt dad and spoils son terribly. I think it is more competition between BM and him. Second he spoils himself. I finally said the hell with it. I know this is no marriage but I just take care of myself now. I do not expect anything from husband or SS. If they think of me first then bonus for me. If I need something or want something I make sure I do it. Like I said not much of a marriage but I am not going to sit around and sulk because I am left behind. I am currently pregnant and I can't wait to have that in my life. Maybe the tables will turn when husband sees how much attention new baby is getting from me. Maybe he will see what he has been doing to me for opast two years. Don't get me wrong, I'm not mad or bitter.....I am just dealing with reality

mechanics of the 2nd time around are entirely different. i feel like the silver medal a lot of the time. when we had this discussion, my therapist kept going back to "you are the one who accepted this position" and "you knew that he had a child that was there first". i felt like i was talking to a loaf of bread, or the wall maybe. couldnt make the therapist understand that you can know what she said is true, but be taken completely by surprise by all of the things that come along with. guilt is a powerful emotion, and i think its probably just built in to the arrangement, further confusing everyones priorities

HI Elle36,

I read your post and it does sadden me. You can not live your life that way, your unborn child deserves parents who love and care for each other. My first husband was incredibly selfish and I adopted your attitude of who cares i am taking care of myself and my children. That is a temporary coping mechanisim. You will end of bitter and lonely. Why not urge your husband to go to counseling with you ? I eventually divorced selfish husband( he refused to admit there was anything worng with our miserable marriage) and realized how happy i was without him. A`few years later met a great man that i married. We have vowed to always put each other first , although sometimes difficult with us both having children.
my only regret.. why did I stay with such a selfish man for so long.

good luck to you .

In reading all your posts, I find myself sad, yet happy.
I was so full of fear in the begining. The night he made the move to leave her and come to me, I was so happy. The next day was horrible for both of us. BM was at our job when we showed up. Everyone at work found out about us. BF & I loving refer to that day as 'black Monday'. Around 7:00 that night he told me he HAD to go back home with her. I wanted to die. I understood why but I was so hurt. I left town for a few days. The following two weeks were so hard for us. But we realized our feelings for eachother where very real. Too strong to ignore. He left her again for the final time 2 weeks after the first time.

We all know how well BM's can successfully put a 'brick' around these men and yes they pour the guilt down their throats.

I am so thankful that he does put me first. BM pulled out so many tricks in the first few weeks to get him to go to her.
OMG, It made me sick to my stomach. But as time went on, my trust in him got stronger. Even with her suicide attempt, cutting her wrists, he still did not run to her.

I can honestly say, I don't know what I would do if I felt the way some of you ladies feel.

That's why I give you ladies alot of credit. You are obviously strong woman.

DH and I got out for a rare evening just the two of us last week. We saw a play--a very funny version of the Canterbury Tales (which I hadn't remembered as quite so raunchy.) Anyway, there is one "tale" called "The Wife of Bath" about a woman who has been married five times. She tries to teach a young man "what women want". What is the one thing that women want, she asks? This young man searches high and low until he comes across an old crone who gives him the answer. "Sovereignty". Women want to be in charge of their own destinies, and of their domains. My hubby has had a field day with this ever since. But it is, I have to admit, true. And being a SM where there is a BM in the picture means you are not in control of important aspects of your own life.

That's corollary 1. Which brings me to corollary 2 - "if mama ain't happy, ain't no one happy".

Lack of sovereignty = unhappy wife = unhappy household.

Failure is built in. I'm only half kidding.

P.S. I agree with everything said about about divorce guilt and not being #1. I've discussed the priority issue with my DH many times.
It's improved dramatically -- now it's his kids, his job, and then me. Every once in a while I am elevated over the job. But Ex wife now comes last, except on those occasions when she has the power of "no" over kid issues that really matter to him--like custody, e.g., --in which case I slip back down again.

But I also think that it can be controlled, or balanced. DH has guilt of breaking up the family- BUT he also understands that the household his son was being raised in (fighting all of the time, HE was never home to avoid BM) was not one that would benefit ANY of them. SO while SS may have a hard time adjusting to the fact that his parents are divorced (mostly because BM won't let him get over it) the damage that would have been done to him being raised in the house as things were, would have been much more. She would not allow DH to spend any time with SS, that is HER son. (funny- after being so insistant that DH has nothing to do with SS, even when they were married, now she is such a lazy mom, we raise him and she kicks back and reaps the good times, way to go "MOM") So, I suppose I am somewhat lucky. He is more afraid that because BM does NOT discipline at all, and we do... he will not enjoy his visits. We have both come to the realization (recently) that our kids are VERY young and they will see both parents, like it or not. He goes through his phases of babying him, and letting him get away with Sh*t but they are normally short lived. Once it causes a problem between him and I, he resolves it immediatly. So, I know it can be done. I think SOME of these DAD's are relying on that as a crutch and an excuse to be a lazy parent.

These Dad's have to remember that "pleasing" their children, is NOT looking out for their best interest. Kids need boundaries... no matter what happened between Mom and Dad. That does not EXCUSE them from bad behavior. Hell, my parents are divorced... I still have to abide by the law, go to work every morning, pay my bills. These kids are being trained that because their parents are divorced- they should be excused from every resposibility in life. Now that is preparing them for adulthood huh! NO wonder there is a Forum for Step Parents with Adult Step Children... they have been TRAINED this way, and it never stops.

i think what you just said is so very very important! please let me copy and paste : "BUT he also understands that the household his son was being raised in (fighting all of the time, HE was never home to avoid BM) was not one that would benefit ANY of them. SO while SS may have a hard time adjusting to the fact that his parents are divorced (mostly because BM won't let him get over it) the damage that would have been done to him being raised in the house as things were, would have been much more. "
i think that this understanding is key, but it seems to be taboo b/c everyone expects them to feel guilty or like a failure, even if it is an abusive situation that they are trying to avoid.

I want to beat the odds. If divorce rate in second marriages is 75% or higher... I want to be in the 25% that proves them all wrong. I have learned from my mistakes (and boy did I make them) in my previous life- that is how we refer to 1st marriages- our previous LIFE . I want what is best for my FAMILY as a whole- step kids bio kids- me and my husband. If the marriage is not stable, than the family will follow. I want my girls to see how a mom and a wife are SUPPOSED to be treated, as well as learn HOW to treat a husband. That is what raising kids is about, right?! Monkey see, monkey do... had this young boy been raised in this household, with his BM and BF, sure his parents would still be married BUT... he would have thought that being a Dad means going to work, going out with your buddies and coming home at 3 in the morning. He would have learned that belittling your wife is the only way to live and that Dad's have NO ROLE in raising children. He would not have had a chance at being a good Father or Husband, and would have expected his wife to handle all the child rearing and fought in front of the kids on a regular basis. That is what he would have been subject to, and that would be normal to him. That thought is so sad to me. I am grateful that DH got out when he did, for more than just my own personal selfish reasons... also for sake of SS. And had I not gotten divored, my girls would grow up thinking that all husbands hit their wives and they would have very possibly gone out and found someone just like Daddy to be with. THAT THOUGHT SICKENS ME. My ex has gotten help with his issues... AA (2 years sober) and MANY MANY anger managment classes, and I am proud of his accomplishments- but no eraser big enough can remove those scars... my kids deserve better in a family, as do I. He is a good Dad, without me there to anger him. (not that I blame myself, no one has the right to lay hands on me.. but the truth is... we pushed each others buttons... that is no way to live).

I want the best for my kids... and a safe, loving environment is #1 on my list. I want them to witness how love is supposed to be. A man standing behind his woman, and vice versa. Their innocent little minds deserve that much in this tough world. A safe haven called HOME.

a follow up on something daddysgirl says--DH and I were talking about this last night--why does everyone assume that a divorce is something to feel guilty about? This assumption that kids do better with two bio parents in a nuclear family is a pretty flawed one, I think. It assumes two people who love each other and are good at parenting together. Relatively rare to get right, whether first or second. My mom and dad got divorced when I was 2 and I am thankful, b/c they would have been awful parents together. Not every person who makes a baby is a good parent, and sometimes a person is a better parent out of the bio-marriage than in. More, who's to say what is the "norm"? Every kid lives their own life and not comparatively to some other kid's magical two-parent life. If the divorce rate is so high, then is the nuclear family really the norm?

I realize if a child is older and has seen his or her parents married, even loving, then it is life-changing to see them split up. But, so is disease and death and pregnancy and family hostilities and poverty and abuse etc. etc. --- all the other difficult things each and every one of us go through, young, old or in between. My DH says he never felt guilty about the divorce from the kids' perspective, b/c it was so bad with the ex that it would have been worse for the kids if they stayed together. I don't think my DH parents from guilt. I think he parents from grief. He misses his kids so much when they are not around, it physically hurts him.

In the beginning, however, I think DH did manage his relationship with BM based on guilt. We seem to be past that, thank goodness. But that is a different kind of guilt from "guilt about what you're putting the kids through", isn't it? Isn't it more about "guilt what you're putting your ex-partner through"?

Well probably it's different for each couple that splits, as are most things. But for some folks, this may hold true as I think it does in my case. When you break up with a lover after a relationship, do you spend a lot of time hanging around that person? Probably not right away, if ever. Can you imagine the hassles that would ensue if you did? That's what divorced parents with children go through. Because you need to keep communicating about the kids, you can't give the relationship any breathing time. But yet the divorced (or not yet divorced) person move on to another relationship simultaneously, without moving the first relationship to a new phase first. That's a recipe for hell for the new significant other if I've ever heard one.

I agree with the above--the best thing a dad and SM can do is demonstrate for kids what love and stability look like. If second marriage partners want to feel guilty about something, they should feel guilty about screwing it up a second time by allowing the demons and ghosts of the past to destroy this new chance at happiness.

All those years I thought that I was crazy or selfish or both when I sensed that the primary couple in our home was my DH and my SD not our marriage. I even convinced myself that it was necessary for the SD's mental health that she be placed first.

CRAZY THINKING, it took me a long time to recognize how unhealthy that dynamic was for me, the marriage and the SD. I'm finally taking care of myself and demanding that our marriage come first and things are much better in our marriage. The SD is struggling to figure out what the heck happened! However, I truly think that this is better for her also. My DH is the enabler but he is learning.

I always knew that my DH loved me and also knew how much he needed me-so I stayed. I also thought that one day the SD would grow up and begin to live her own life leaving DH and me to live ours. Again, CRAZY THINKING!! SD needed a good swift kick out of the nest and finally DH did just that.

Guilt is a tricky feeling and easily manipulated. If I had a "do over" I would have not accepted my 2nd place role. I would've stood firm on the house rules. I would've helped my DH enforce some tough love on the SD. I think that our marriage would've survived my demands and been better for it.

But one final question: why, why, why do I always have to learn the hard way???

Glynne