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Step Wedding double standard?

ESMOD's picture

I know we have a few of these wedding issues.. where (because we are mostly SM's).. we lament our exclusion.. or marginalization during these events.

BUT.. does anyone see it as a potential double standard that it's wrong to exclude a step parent from an invite to a wedding.. yet we also often see (future) step parents that want to exclude their skids (minor and/or adult) from THEIR weddings. 

I do get that many put forward the sanctity of the couple ettiquette when pushing for Steps to be invited.  And, we often give sympathy for those that DO go.. get excluded from pictures.. sit separately... and in other ways are treated more at guest level than "family".. 

But, the same complaint that we have for including a step.. could also be applied to them being told they should invite "US".. especially if the relationship has been mutually unpleasant.. contentious.. difficult.

Shouldn't we all (including skids).. be able to include only people that support us.. that are happy for us? and that including people that we have issues with.. (or maybe was the one that our bio parent cheated on the other parent with for example).. has high conflict/drama potential.

Should we all resign ourselves to eloping to avoid that (skids and SP's?)?

I mean.. that's what my DH and I did.. we went and got married with no friends or family.. just us.

My YSD decided to do two ceremonies.. a small legal one with her dad and I (and a few other friends) and then a more fancy, but more symbolic ceremony with her mom and his family..

I mean.. what is a dad to do if his wife and daughter/son seriously don't get along.. and even if it's more on the skids side that the wrongs have been done.. too much has been said by both to ever consider them capable of really being in a place where either would want the other at their special day?  But he loves his kid.. loves his wife.. maybe thinks they both have had a hand.. doesn't want to miss his kid's wedding.. but also doesn't want his wife to be upset.. really in that rock/hard place.  

I know we would hope people could rise above the pettiness.. but people just don't.  alcohol flows.. tensions grow.. things are said.. scenes could be made.  even just having to look at the "audience" and see the face of someone you pretty much despise.. could be a damper right?

(and then those pictures.. I'm personally for some token pics but there def should be enough variety so someone's whole wedding album isn't filled by future strangers!)

but.. my question is.. if it's ok to not want a skid there.. why can't they feel the same way?

 

Comments

Mominit's picture

I think a lot of it starts with history.  Has SM/SD actually DONE anything to alienate the bride/groom?  Or were they hated at first sight for no good reason.  Next would be degree of exclusion.  Is everyone including the neighbour's first cousin invited except SM/SD?  If BM is invited but not her husband, and BD is invited but not his wife....and then just a witness or two....maybe I could get my head around it.  But if you have more than 6 guests...unless you have been estranged and intend to remain that way - either invite both parents and their spouses, or have separate weddings.

I think having multiple "celebrations" is a great idea.  If BM/BD or SM/SD can't be trusted to behave themselves, then have a separate wedding.  If they hate the air each other breathes - have a small wedding (or elope!) and have a family party at another time.  But trying to throw a traditional wedding when you have a non-traditional family feels like playing make believe.  Let's pretend Dad's not remarried because Mom hates her.  Let's pretend Mom and Dad don't hate each other's existence and get a picture of "my happy family".  Blech.  Just because you're a bride or groom doesn't excuse you from the human obligation to try to be courteous where you can. (edit to add - and all guests should put on their best manners and try to be courteous too!)

And if you can't, then actions have consequences.  If bride/groom insists that SM doesn't come, (and there's not a valid reason for it other than you don't like that she exists), then it shouldn't be a surprise when Dad doesn't come either.  I'm not saying in cases where something truly valid happened (abuse, SM agrees and doesn't want to be there etc.).  But if you're not willing to have her at the wedding, then you shouldn't be willing to have her at Sunday dinner, or Christmas or birthdays either.  In which case - have at it.  But you've chosen who "family" is, and Dad/SM are no longer it. 

Weddings are not the time to choose sides in my opinon.  It's time to celebrate family.  If your guest list detracts from that, maybe just elope and have separate celebrations later so that you're not making a public spectacle of a private matter. 

MissK03's picture

There are so many factors that could go with these types of situations.

I've been with SO almost 8 years. If/when we get married I would never expect him to not invite his kids and I wouldn't expect them to not be there.

Since I can't predict the future so in x amount of years skids don't want me there... oh well. I don't see that happening but never know. 

BM got married and didn't even tell them she was getting married. She sent them pictures the day after. SD is still hurt by this and it's been 4 years. I am pretty sure it bothered the boys too.

My situation is "better" then others but still difficult I think. 

I seem to read on her wedding drama seems to happen more with older skids (ones that are my age.. I'm 37.. or older) Skids that are getting married for a 2nd and when SMS came in when they were adults... making dynamics different from someone that came along when kids were young. 

 

Mominit's picture

Sorry, I forgot to specifically address kids.  I also think that other than a few pictures, SM/SD are only in line of sight and can be expected to behave themselves.  (If they're guaranteed to make a scene I agree with excluding them either completely or by having separate events).

Kids can't be counted on to behave.  Some folks are getting married for the first time, and didn't envision having children at the wedding!  Some kids are young, and even if well behave will demand attention from their parent which can't simply be ignored.  Others are just poorly behaved.  If a child can be counted on to behave and not detract I think they SHOULD be invited.  Unless it's a no kids wedding (across the board, not a single child is invited).

But if the child is well behaved, or if the "child" is an adult that hasn't actually done anything wrong, and a parent wants them there, yes I think SKs should be invited to the wedding.  (Or...same thing....have separate celebrations if the wedding day is so delicate in the mind of the bride/groom that the simple sight of a person will "ruin" their whole day).

Lillywy00's picture

IDK....

Me personally, If I did marry this dude (he'd have to do a complete 180, divorce his mini-spouses, drop his militant behavior, delete his disneyland dad parenting, get therapy for his deepset guilt about his divorce 4 years ago, set boundaries with his ex wife, and allow me to run the finances of the household) .... I'd invite everyone but it would be at a location and during a time the skids probably wouldn't be able to make it. 

I honestly wouldn't want his skids around seething in jealousy, having to work my plans around THEIR school schedules, and having to deal with the dude catering to them on MY day. 

SO I'd probably elope/destination wedding with just us two and force him to turn off his phone so his kids cant blow him up every 15 min with trivial questions. 

Also, if I stayed with him (which I'm not) if/when his kids get married I could care less if im invited or not. One less gift I gotta buy and save 3 hours of my time to do something else more conducive to my lifestyle.

Rumplestiltskin's picture

It sucks, and I get it. As a future SM, as a divorced BM, and as someone whose father is widowed but healthy (heaven forbid but i could be a future skid!), it sucks. There are certain unpleasant realities when it comes to non-intact families. The biggest being not seeing your kids every day as a divorced parent. You can't "have it all" in terms of the big happy family. The more classy (by that i mean emotionally, not financially) those involved are, the closer you can come, i guess. ETA vacations are another issue. If you want to go on vacation with your kids, are you obligated to bring skids, too? My SO has 4 kids and vacations with some of them really suck. Two are prone to screaming tantrums. One likes to come to dinner with her nipples showing. Every night, even after being discreetly asked to cover up, and she's 26. I used to look forward to holidays and vacations, as well as family milestones, now it's fraught with minefields. SO used to love having his kids in bed with him, like 6 people on one mattress. We all give things up when dealing with step-dynamics. It's hard. 

CajunMom's picture

as MissK03 said. 

DH and I had a small garden wedding. All of his kids (and mine) were invited. We paid flights for those out of state and paid accomodations. Four of the five attended...Mini Wife (oldest daughter) declined the invite and later said, "well, you just got married in someone's back yard" to excuse her declining attending.  Little did I know she was just beginning her war against our marriage, that being her first "hit." Regardless, photos were taken that included everyone. No "this group" and "that group;" just "normal" wedding pictures.

Fast forward to 12 years later. A final event where I had enough of toxic treatment and completely disengaged from DHs kids. DH sees his kids away from our home. I'm good with that. Then out of the blue....I got invited to his oldest son's wedding!!! Let's forget that the asshole caused me much grief 5 years earlier and never made one attempt at rectifying the mess he started. Never mind I told the asshole to leave me alone. Did I attend? Absolutely NOT.  Why? To be subjected to his (and the other siblings) BS behaviors? Nah. I'm good right here at home.

So, this is a topic that is not cut and dry. And I'd dare say, StepMoms are more often slighted /insulted in these "wedding" situations than the SM being the asshole. DHs kids were NEVER excluded in our lives or events. I don't think I've ever said, I don't want your kids to attend X with us." Today it's a different story. And I'm okay with that story, too.

And that's the key...to KNOW the story...the history, as someone said. 

 

stepju6's picture

DH and I included my daughter and his kids in our ceremony (they were all young and happy to be flower girls). BM spam called DH and each one of his siblings demanding to speak to "her kids" throughout our ceremony and reception. So, yeah, I think I'd do a ceremony without them if I had to do it again. DH and I are super cool with not attending any of SK's weddings, child births, etc if that is what they want and we plan to tackle the issue when the time comes. 

Stepdrama2020's picture

Steplife is filled with double standards. Weddings being one of them.

Except Id bet the pig farm that the double standard goes against the SM in the dysfunctional toxic families, which represents many SM's on this board. They married into a situation where they are repeatedly abused, marginilized, and supposed to be OK with being excluded .

That being said , I highly doubt a SM would say this skid can come to our wedding, but this one cant. The skids have to sit at the back. Photo time only one skid can be in it cause I hate the other and its MY day so you can go to hell. Or this skid aint my family, only photos with my bios allowed. ETC ETC 

Sure there can be some real evil SM's but I think with most folks on this site wanted a good happy blended family only to be steam rolled by their DH's and/or skids.

NieMojCyrk's picture

I totally agree! Well said!

Merry's picture

Totally this. In general, stepmoms are excluded because they exist. Stepkids are excluded because their (or BM's) behavior is disruptive. 

Stepfor27yrs's picture

I was 27 when I got together with my DH. We got married when I was 37. I didn't want to get married to him until his kids were out of high school. His daughter didn't like me bc I believe her loyalties were with BM. I'm a likable enough person with a zany personality. Anyway, we didn't invite his son or daughter and got married in Maui with my only attendants being my sister and her husband. We had a great time. Many years later, his son got married and we went to their wedding in Tahoe. No issues with them just his ex wife wanted to dance with him and she pushed her way into a slow dance when he was already dancing with someone else. Pictures were fine. Although his ex tried to be in one of our side of the family pics and her son(the groom) told her "mom, you gave up that right a long time ago."  She also came running across the grass when the dj called out our last name which was for the new daughter in law. The adult kids had concerns about their mom at the wedding but overall it was fine. A few years later my SD got married at a nice venue clear across the country. Again the ex wife pulled my husband out for a slow dance and I was standing beside him when she looked at me and said "I don't care if you want him to dance with me."  He didn't dance with her. He stood there like a stiff Tin man and she walked off mad. I think step life is very hard. We have all been estranged for almost 3 years. It's very sad. 

shamds's picture

Have to suck it up the toxic abuse from skids happily, despite often doing more than the bio parent or biomum and then come wedding time stepmum is excluded along with bio kids of the subsequent marriage or the biokids (half siblings to bride or groom sd/ss) are invited along with dad.

then you are shunned and if you are invited you are put in a back corner, not allowed in any pics etc so skids can fake the 1 big happy family bs.

then when stepmum says enough and i don't want those who don't support me or my marriage at my wedding only for them to create a scene and make my wedding about them or skids who actively tried to destroy my marriage to their dad out of petty spite and boredom.

its not a double standard because what you're stating doesn't always happen. Stepparent didn't intentionally come into a blended family marriage/relationship to intentionally be spiteful to skids, alienate them and throw them out of our family/household. The vast majority want a harmonious inclusive respectful and civil household but many petty skids aren't interested in that

ESMOD's picture

I would quibble with the part where the step didn't come in being spiteful etc.. because... I have actually seen people on this site who absolutely should not have been stepparents.. want to marginalize their skids..want to minimize their spouse's relationship with their children.  I'm not saying the motivation is "spiteful" per se... but they don't like the kids.. that they exist.. and want their SO.. and hope the kid and related ex part of it dissappear.

And.. plenty of stepparents do come in and steamroll the new household.. new rules.. new expectations (not saying that the rules are always unreasonable.. but still).. 

But.. as most people are saying.. there can be double standards.. and that a lot of the times.. the answer is "it depends".. on the situation...the people.. the age etc.. 

But.. in a way, it's a bit "easier" for the stepparents and bio parents to kind of "elope".. because this is usually a 2nd marriage... and quite often it's a 2nd marriage for BOTH parties.. and well.. they already had the "big" one with family.. the dress etc.. and people are more inclined to enjoy the honeymoon elopement the 2nd time around.   The skids? often the 1st.. they want that big church daddy walk me down the aisle... and steplife complicates that.

And... I think we often call it "sucking it up".. when we mean.. accept reality.  Having kids requires people to adjust their lives.. and when they aren't YOUR kids.. it will feel more intrusive.  It's hard to jump into a moving boat... one that already has an existing crew and figure out how to copilot without a mutiny.  Knowing what is your business..what should be your business.. what you should hill to die on.. what should be let go? it's tough.. and then you have some often unwilling participants on that ship... the kids who have another captain that can be actively working against you.

And.. in almost all cases.. people KNOW this before they get married here.. before they decide to have kids.. or they think they can fix it.. that it will change.. and it doesn't.. and mistakes are made early on by everyone that poisons the well of any chance of good relatinships. or the fact that things may start out ok.. but over time sour.. and part of it may be that those outside voices.. they have weight and power.. that is uncontrollable.   and Skids.. even when they become adults don't automatically become immune to their influence and the way they were raised. (how many of us still want to please our parents.. even though we realize not all of it is healthy?)

But.. in the end.. does it suck to be excluded? yes.  but if you don't like the person.. don't like your skid.. why would you want to even waste your time?  As an adult..aren't they entitled to draw the boundaries they need in their lives too?  And.. just because we may not get on with a skid... doesn't mean that their parents need to throw that relationship away.. so in a situation where they may not have good options.. and as a father of a child.. or mother.. saying you won't attend a wedding unless their spouse that doesn't get along with the child attends? is kind of a hard hill to die on.. and as a spouse.. isn't it just easier.. and not sucking it up.. it's easier to just say.  Look.. go to the wedding.. have the relationship with your child on your terms.. as long as it doesn't overshadow ours.  It's freeing ourselves from a toxic dynamic too.

I guess.. long story short.. steplife is complicated and standard ettiquette rules won't always be easily applicable.. so maybe we need to suspend "standard expectations" in situations that are anything BUT standard.

Rags's picture

Sadly, unlike in historic naval situations, a new Captain commanding a blended family ship can't flog or hang mutinous crew members.

Damni it!

Wink

 

shamds's picture

Remarries there is a new household dynamic in her home and skids adjust reasonably fine but suddenly daddy remarries many years after divorce and they have their own new family dynamics (not unreasonable  stuff) but skids hypocritically expect the old status quo to stick out. 
 

Yes there are some evil stepparents just like there are evil bio parents too out there. I'd also argue many skids didn't even wanna give their stepparent a chance in their lives and did their very best to destroy their marriage out of spite with no care or concern for their bioparent.

it goes both ways. Skids eventually move out of home and on with their lives, they can't expect to dictate what happens in daddy or mummy's household with their new spouse and partners whom are building a life and future together. 

justmakingthebest's picture

This stirred up all my feelings this morning!

DH and canceled our wedding. We were supposed to have it on a beach here where we live. It was going to be beautiful. However, BM wouldn't let SS come out for it. So, instead 2 months early, while visiting DH's family in KS we got married. We planned the whole thing on the drive there- Amazoned a dress, everything done from the road. All so that SS could be there. To us at the time having all 4 kids there was the most important thing. More than my family and friends. We did have DH's family, which is wonderful. My BIL walked me down the isle at the family church, and it was beautiful and special, but if we could go back- F that. We would have gone through with the wedding we planned that was what we wanted. 

I will never be invited to anything related to SS18 in his life and that's ok. I didn't do anything wrong. BM is just that horrible of a person. I only supported SS and if he can't see that, that's on him.

Rags's picture

We eloped with 2wks notice to friends and family, 29yrs ago .... 4 weeks from tomorrow.

A planned wedding was not possible at that time.  My IL's chose to not attend other than my DW's aunt and her husband.

My mom was there, as well as my brother, SIL and then 5mo old niece, my college BFF and his GF.  My dad could not make it due to working internationally.

Over time my ILs and I built a close relationship though at the time I was persona non grata. DW and I met her freshman year of university, I was finishing up my 11yr undergrad career. I am 12yrs the elder. I get the hesitancy of my ILs.

Most people renew their vows at 25yrs. We did it at 20yrs. My FIL was not in good health and I was concerned that he would not make it 5 more years.   My DW planned the wedding she wanted. I advised that we do it  in or near her nome town to accomodate her extended family.  It was beautiful. The venue was a beautiful winery surrounded by vinyards, we had about 50 people there.  DW had a beautiful designer dress, shoes, hair and makeup, it was catered by a very nice restaurant that DW had been frequenting for several years when visiting her family, SS (then 21yo) officiated.  DW picked some great vendors who ended up winning best of that year for that region of 8her State.  Two award winning wines were featured.  We just drank the last bottle of each last weekend.  A 2008 Pinot Noir, and a 2012 white blend. Still amazing wines.  My brother, who is a wine snob, loved them.  We cracked those bottles open during a visit to my mom and dad's house.

We lost my FIL a month short of 4 years later. Sadly, he did not make our 25th.

I am so grateful that he got to walk my bride down the isle.

Do not postpone the special things. You and DH have your beach wedding and embrace your best lives. If the Skids choose to not participate... so be it... and... good riddance.

IMHO of course.

Rumplestiltskin's picture

One thing i will also say - a lot of SMs probably are afraid to have their husband go to these weddings without them, in fear of what inappropriateness (sp?) or influence BM might have on them. It's not always about pride or being spiteful. There are SMs on here who were happily married for years with no problems from BM, then after a wedding or a grandchild or some issue, the husband becomes re-enmeshed with BM, and the SM's life was turned upside down. 

ESMOD's picture

That wasn't necessarily something I considered....I could see the birth of grandkids reigniting issues.. but I guess the wedding could be a start at it?

Harry's picture

When you raise. A Stepchild. It's something you really don't have to do. You spend your time effort, money,  ect. You adjust your life for some body you don't have to.  Then the SK who could be living in a car eating dog food. With out your help. Just turns on you.  You could of been like there father didn't give two sh*t about his own kids. 
At least a SK could is thank you by having you at there wedding.  
Not have SK at yoir wedding that the bio parent thing.  Bio don't want kids screwing up there wedding.

CLove's picture

We eloped. I didnt have all the wedding traditions. We said "lets do this" and we did it. I really wish I had had all the traditional stuff. I have never been married before and dont really see myself doing this again with anyone else.

I even said this last night that Im going to divorce him so we can have a "do over".

That being said, the general reason we did it that way was to avoid  drama and bad feelings. Absolutely no one wants to spend 30-50k on a wedding where there is one iota of bad feelings ANYWHERE.

So, on both sides, if a skid is wanting to exclude anyone with bad feelings no matter where they come from, its sort of undestandable. Same with Stepparents.

AND that being said, its rude to exclude anyone if they are being drama free plus ones. Especially if they are the spouse of a parent and especially if that parent is using marital assets to help pay for all that hoopla.

Rumplestiltskin's picture

Also, just stopped by to say that i am absolutely terrified of SO's kids' weddings. He has 4 kids, 2 BMs, and both situations have the potential to be minefields. BM2 is from the same country as SO and is close with a lot of his family. Huge weddings costing $100k are kind of a thing. At the last one i went to, his cousin's parents rented out a casino. Mother of the bride changed outfits several times. Lots of processions and such. The groom's parents are expected to pay and SO has 2 boys with her. She likes the finer things. I can see her pressuring his family to pressure him to pay and participate, and i can see his parents feeling "shamed" by the community if he doesn't. 

Rags's picture

generally pay for the wedding. The Groom's parents pay for the rehersal dinner, the wedding flowers, and the Tuxedos for the wedding party.

My XMIL and XW needed a social event of the year wedding.  We married in a huge Cathedral.  XMIL insisted on XW having 9 attendants.  I didn't have 9 people I wanted in my side of the wedding party. My lifelong BFF, my HS BFF, and my little brother (my best man). That was it. For months I defended that hill from my XMIL and XW attempting to force me to add 6 more to the Groom's party.   I ended up proposing that my future BIL, and my XW's male cousins make up the gaps in my party.  Not an appreciated recommendation but that was what we went with. So, 5 of XW's Bride's Maids were escorted by kids between 15 and 9.

Diablo

My XILs asked for my parents to split the cost of the wedding with them. My parents counter proposed that they would provide half of that number ... if... all of the money (my parent's and my XIL's) went directly to myself and my XW for us to do with as we chose. Invest, downpayment on a house, etc...   My XMIL lost her future federal felon convict mind.

So, my parents covered only the rehersal, flowers, and tuxedos. In a Karmic blessing, we married on Jan 2 and the Cathedral still had all of the Christmas florals decorating the huge spaces, so... no flower bill.

simifan's picture

I think you are looking at two entirely different issues. It is extremely rude to only invite half of a couple to a social event. Would they invite Uncle Jack & not Aunt June, even if everyone dislikes her? Doubtful. Even if Aunt June was a raging alcoholic, probably not. You invite both or neither. Especially given this is a celebration of the skids UNION, it is very hypocritical. Would the skid be ok with their new spouse being excluded, also very doubtful. 

It is socially acceptable to invite a couple without their children. It also makes a difference if the children are minors or adults. The parent of a minor does not have absolute control over the schedule for their children. There are reasons why not having the steps their would be acceptable, especially in high conflict situations - other parent refused visitation, other parent would make the children's lives unbearable, ceremony would be disturbed, etc. Those getting married without steps without a good reason, I would hope the parent would think enough of their child to say no.  

ESMOD's picture

The conflict I see with the uncle/aunt vs dad/sm situation is that you can not invite an uncle with less (not zero) fallout.  and I have known people to absolutely not include people when their partner has been problematic.. or to even not include specific partners in certain situations..  but not inviting a father when it's his wife you have an issue with?

I think it is an area where sometimes ettiquette needs to be less rigid... most ettiquette was established in a time when steplife was not as prevalent of an issue I think.. 

I mean.. there ARE cases we have seen even on here.. where the SM has been more aligned with the "evil" stereotype.. pushing their spouse to not see their kids etc... and I would have a hard time wanting someone like that at my wedding..