I can feel my anxiety level rise as adult YSD's birthday approaches...
So, here we go again. We are currently in the "ostracisation" period of our relationship with the two SD's (48 and 54) and all of their flying monkeys (the SGKs). We were banished after the YSD sent my DH an email (coated in passive agressive sugar and completely unacknowledging my presence in any of their lives) telling him how he needs to be more like other grandfather's are to their grandchildren. Also, the letter stated that, although YSD and OSD are adults, they still need their father's presence in their lives too.
What brought this on, you may ask? You see, we did what we have been doing since the day the grand kids were born. We sent YSD's oldest daughter (now 14 yrs old) a birthday card and some cash on her birthday several months ago. Apparently, it hasn't been enough all these years to just send a card and cash. So, this is what incited the email. My YSD decided that it was time that DH be reprimanded for his past neglect of his two daughters and their kids, and he needs to change his ways so that they can move forward and strengthen their relationships with him. He never acknowledged that email by the way. The ultimate goal here for YSD is Will money, and on some level DH knows that, but refuses to admit it.
The ringleader's (YSD48) birthday is fast approaching and this morning DH asks me what we did for her birthday last year. Did we send her a card or did we send her an e-card through my email (since he doesn't have, and doesn't want one of his own)? I looked through my past emails and said that we must have sent one through the mail. We live 4 hours away from them, so we don't do personal visits. So, he said that he'd pick a card up for her this afternoon. My response to that is, "So, you plan on rewarding her for bad behaviour?" No reply from DH. Just the usual pursing of the lips.
That's when the hair on the back of my neck stands up and I start to go ballistic. I loose all composure and start ranting: "I can't believe you are rewarding her by sending her a card, as though she's done nothing wrong. In the meantime, she has managed to create a posse with her sister (OSD) and the four grand kids, to turn against you. In her sick little fantasy world, she wants to believe that you never got re-married, I don't exist and that your world should revolve around her and if it doesn't, YOU are a bad father and a bad grandfather. Once you have this conversation with her about her feelings, she will then turn on the big crocodile tears and tell her how much she loves you and misses you being part of her and her kid's lives. Then, eventually, things will improve temporarily because you will apologize and go to mush because you can't stand to see your baby cry, and the whole cycle will begin again."
And the reason the cycle will begin again? Because we live 4 hours away from them and we can't be there for them every time one of them sneezes! Here's the kicker: When I have heart to heart conversations with my DH, he admits that he's not the "grand-fatherly sort". He says that he did all that he could for his DDs when they were young. He was a very good provider and he took them on vacations, paid for their weddings, spent plenty of one-on-one daddy-time with them when they were children. He's just not that interested in doing that all over again with his grand kids. When we do visit them, we all get antsy after about 2 hours and he's always the first to motion me that it's time to go home!
Something else worth noting: My DH's first marriage was a shot gun wedding. Almost Literally. His then, soon-to-be-father-in-law gave him a black eye when he said that he didn't want to marry his daughter even though she was pregnant. Why is this important to know? Well, his parents (my now in-laws) disowned DH for marrying her (BM) because they said that she and her family were from the "wrong side of the tracks". They were willing to help bring up the baby, (my now OSD), but they didn't want anything to do with the birth mother or her family. As the result, my DH who thought that he had to do the right thing and marry her even though the believed it was entrapment, didn't have a relationship with HIS family for 22 years. After their divorce, he reunited with his family, but his DD's are still not part of his side of the family because too many years had passed for them all to become reacquainted. AND at that point, my parents-in-law weren't interested in trying to create a relationship with DH's kids either. So, this is now being brought up again by YSD. The fact that they had to grow up without their fraternal grandfather, and now the SD's kids are growing up without a grandfather too. All of this was in her pity me email to my DH.
I'm still trying to figure out what part I need to play in all of this. I want to support him in whatever he decides to do. The problem is that I see that this is just a manipulation tactic to make him feel guilty, so that YSD gets her attention and power back and I hate watching all of this unfold. As soon as he acknowledges that email, or sends her the card so that she can call and vent some more about it just not being enough, SHE will decide whether OSD and the SGKs can go back to talking to DH again. That's her power. "Now that Dad and I have had a conversation, and he sees things MY way, we can all go back to talking to him again."
I know what the goal is and it infuriates me! I have been part of this dynamic for 33 years now, and their is always some type of drama that comes from YSD. The idea of sending her a card makes me squirrely. Maybe it's just me...
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Send her a "Get well soon"
Send her a "Get well soon" card containing the number and address of a good therapist ... To help her deal with her feelings of loss, of course.
Why not just ignore and block them. All their calls do is upset you and your husband. There is no solution to this situation so stop trying because trying to talk to them only resets the clock and it all starts over again.
I absolutely LOVE the Get
I absolutely LOVE the Get Well Soon card!!! After YSD sent my DH that email, I blew a gasket and he told me that I could delete the email and block her from sending their letters through me since it upsets me so much. He said that if they have something to say to him, they can call him on the phone.
However, he has just informed me that instead of sending a card through the mail, he'd like to send his DD an e birthday card through my email this year. So much for blocking her on my email.
No. Just no. Send him the
No. Just no. Send him the store for a card, then the post office to mail it. Your email is not up for abuse anymore.
Grandpas
I am very with you on your observations of your DH in the grandpa role. My DH84 is exactly the same. He, like yours, was a good dad but he's been there, done that. Nothing against his kids or grandkids, or now the great-grandkids, he isn't interested in being involved the way some of the kids would wish. Incidentally, this extends to both his and my kids so it isnt a step issue.
I think people see Hallmark commercials and other fantasies of the kindly grandpa and are disappointed when our reality doesn't match it. We acknowledge all birthdays the same way (card +$), usually go where we are invited and have positive hopes for everybody. But he has no desire to make much more effort than that. It's sad and I sometimes sense their disappointment but hes old, tired, dealing with his own issues and still has SD60 on his back.
You're right when you say
You're right when you say that DH not wanting to play an active role in hanging with his grandkids and grown DDs has little to do with them and more to do with his disinterest in reliving his attentive daddy role. YSD tries hard to make it look personal...as though it is a rejection of them. It's just not, but YSD can't lay on as good of a guilt trip if she doesn't make it seem personal.
Also, the other thing that you wrote that struck a chord with me is that when we are with the skids and sgks (and now 2 great grandskids), I am the one who is more interactive with them; trying to engage them in conversation etc. I know that my two SDs see that as it is pretty obvious, but as I am nothing more than an unwelcome apparition to the two SDs, they will never acknowledge that. As a matter of fact, YSD has recently stripped me of my "grandma" title with her two kids (SGKs). I found this out when visiting them a couple of years ago. They called me Grandma to my face, but then when they talked to their mother (YSD) they called me "Birchclimber". Ie: SGK would say something like: "Grandma, we saw a great movie last week. I can't remember the title." "Mom, tell Birchclimber the name of that movie we saw last week?" This was not only rude, but it was hurtful.
Oh, yeah
I'm definitely more interactive with the kids. But DH has the reputation, rightfully, as the comedian so his kids always talk that up. The reality is that he might have one funny interaction with the gkids or ggkids but thats about it. Whatever.
He can still send a card but
He can still send a card but he does not have to put anything in it but his signature. That sends a different message than a card WITH a gift in it.
He made a poor choice as a young man and paid for it dearly.
You're so right about the
You're so right about the poor choice. He knows that now...
As for the gift inside the card: we stopped sending his DD's cash a l-o-n-g time ago. They get a card with a warm message and well wishes. When it became apparent that they thought they were "entitled", we pulled the cash and gifts. We just send it to DHs grandkids, until they turn 19. Once they have jobs, they can buy their own treats. It goes both ways: they have NEVER bought us gifts.
I think a card is a good
I think a card is a good thing, an empty card signed "with love from both of us."
Similar here. We live 10-12
Similar here. We live 10-12 hours from DH's kids. Haven't seen them for nearly two years. (And SD will be shocked at how much DH has aged, which will be my fault somehow.) DH loves the grandkids, but isn't that interested in fooling with them. SD never puts them on the phone when she calls. When they do visit, I spend more time with the kids than he does. (My choice, not an expectation.)
They all seem to be ok with this. Fine with me.
And now it's the season of spending too much money on gifts for people that we never see. I suggested to DH that we send money to SD so she can buy the presents from us for the littles, and we give the older one cash. Oh my gosh you'd have thought I suggested killing a beloved puppy.
OK, DH, you figure out the gifts then. I'm not going to be the one running around at the last minute picking over empty shelves. I just don't get it.
The last time....
I used to run around buying gifts for 5 kids, inlaws and 9 gkids. At the time, I was working full time in a demanding job and going to school nights. I'd drive myself crazy trying to create a perfect Christmas. The result was a crushing depression each December.
SD always had lists for each of her 3 kids and I'd try to sync. That year, she wanted a maple rocker for SGD, then about 4. I ran around on my lunch hour and after work but couldn't find one. I called around and found a furniture store in the south part of our city, about 30 miles away. So there DH and I were, on a cold December night with snow and sleet coming down, walking into that store. I (finally) thought, what are we doing? This is crazy. From then on, it's been cash gifts for everybody.
My depressive Decembers started to lessen each year as I dialed back. The best gift to my family is a rested, poised, happy me because my mood affects DH and everybody else.
Yes, yes and yes to all of
Yes, yes and yes to all of that. I am the one who does all of the Christmas Gift buying for the SGDs. He doesn't really get involved in the gift buying, but always makes sure that I have included $$ in the package.
My YSD does put him on the phone with the SGDs, but it's hard to watch as he struggles to find things to say to them. Oh, and the way the tone of his voice changes when he speaks to DD and those kids....urgh... He puts on this weird soft-spoken voice, kind of like Mr. Dressup or Mr. Rogers. It's hard to watch someone who is usually masculine and business-like to be reduced to that.
I can't tell you how much I
I can't tell you how much I have come to resent spending any money on any of them, Merry. They are ingrates who always look at us when we do give them a gift and or cash, with a look that says, "Is this IT??" ! Then, after a little coaxing from the SKIDS, we finally get a "thank you". I think that they assume that they are "entitled" to better gifts from us. They look at our lives and think, you can be more generous than this, because we DO have more than they do. But by golley, we worked HARD for it! Our money didn't come easy! For some reason, they seem to think that theirs should!
sorry you went through all that!
30 plus years - I dont blame you for feeling anxous. The SD's are Emotional Terrorists (look that one up) and using their precious kiddos as Emotional Hostages. Its not fair to the kids and its not fair to your husband. He did what he thought was the ebst thing to do at the time for the children. My DH also stayed with Toxic Troll BM for the children until he just couldnt anymore after finding out she cheated.
Its so hard watching this vicious cycle unfold and the sick dynamic play out. Luckily for now there arent any grands to worry about. But currently SD22 Feral Forger is no contact, its my husbands b-day and shes texted him previously that he is "just the sperm donor and not a father to her" and then of course blamed ME for "taking away her father".
Thats probably why you are not acknowledged - because you "took him away" ie he didnt make them the center of his universe. They probs balme YOU for their parents marriage not working out. Thats a topic they can address with their therapist.
I hope your DH stands up to their Emotional Terrorism.
Emotional Terrorism:
Emotional Terrorism:
"Emotional abuse is a way to control another person by using emotions to criticize, embarrass, shame, blame, or otherwise manipulate another person."
My YSD must be holding classes on how to do this effectively!
You NAILED IT CLove! Thanks for putting a name to it and shedding a little more light on it. I will be doing more reading...!
I feel that knowledge is empowering
And with that knowledge you can help your DH deal with all this upheaval, so that you BOTH have peace.
From the comments and responses, I gather there are marital assets that are considerable that the SD/SGKS will go after/are going after those.
If you have airtight wills and you are sole benficiary (as you should be), make certain you ALSO have power of attorney for if either of you gets sick, has dementia. Airtight wills are awesome, but the other side of the coin is the POA. Death is certain, but there is that purgatory place of Not Being Dead But Might As Well Be. Where vultures circle wreaking havoc over whatever scraps they can spot or imagine.
If they are being this nasty NOW, just imagine if your DH is laying there in a hospital on a macine (sorry not a nice vision I know), how much MORE vicious they will be and the talons will be out because they will be coming for YOU. I have seen this with my family.
So - yes, Emotional Terrorism with Hostage Grandchildren/Great Grands. Thats what you are seeing there.
I did some more reading on
I did some more reading on this and I presented this term to my DH this morning.
I explained that she is holding his other daughter and the Grandkids and Great-grandkids hostage until DH goes into negotiations with her to give into her demands. Only then, will she release the "hostages" or "flying monkeys" depending on how you look at it, to be free to resume conversations/relationships with DH again. I told him that she is trying to hold on to a great deal of power within the family and to negotiate with her will only empower her even more. One should never negotiate with a Terrorist.
He said that he has no intention of doing anything. Quote: "I'm too old for this. I'm not going to her first...she can contact me if she wants to talk. But I will send her a card and she can do whatever she wants with it. Send it back, rip it up, I don't care. But no one will ever say that I didn't do my part!"
I can't decide whether this is a good response to the situation, or a bad one.
*Banging head against wall*
My DH is approaching 70. At
My DH is approaching 70. At this point their family habits are well-ingrained. OSD46 grew up with a lot of attention, and I could be the nicest woman on the planet, but I caused OSD46 to get less attention from daddy and that's all that matters.
These guys, especially when they are older, are not going to stand up to bad behavior from their children when they didn't do it before. They aren't going to suddenly see the light. They know they are getting older, and what if something happened to you? It's harsh, but true.
I have no hand in any of the gifts DH sends to his kids/gkids. Next time your DH asks you what you guys did last year, tell him you don't remember. Let HIM research on the computer. Let HIM handle the gifts. I don't even know anymore what my DH sends to his family. He's lazy so I suspect it's gift cards. They don't want me as part of their family; so be it.
Make sure your wills are iron-clad. Your YSD only has a few years left to use the 14-year old as a weapon, and I suspect she will.
They really do hate to not
They really do hate not being the center of Daddy's universe. It's the ongoing theme in step marriages. Like a power struggle or tug of war, only this side doesn't feel that I should have to grab the rope and pull. And I don't think that he should feel like the middle marker anymore either. He should be more weighted to my side, at this point in his life. After all, I am the "til death do you part" portion of his universe. Not them. They come and go into our lives as it is convenient for them. But, every now and again, they have to still stir the pot to make sure that they still have some power to control the narrative. And when this happens, our otherwise peaceful and enjoyable universe is spun into chaos.
As for our will....We review it with lawyers every 5 years or so and it appears to be air tight. I always ask if there is anyway that the SDs could challenge it, and the answer is always the same. Anyone can challenge a will, but they don't usually win, especially when it is executed by a lawyer. Sadly, this doesn't give me peace of mind. My SD is like a dog with a bone. She willl gather a posse and they will shake me like a rag doll until something falls out of my pocket. I just know it. I know that I am in for a battle. All of my current drama with them points to that fact.
Have you considered a trust
Have you considered a trust instead of a will?
No anonymous gifts. If they
No anonymous gifts. If they want a gift, they can have a relationship, and demonstrate gratitude.
No, don't do an e card with
No, don't do an e card with YOUR email. You don't exist, right? A card...and just a card...if he wants to do something to relieve the divorced daddy guilt she's heaping onto him. Of course she'll be furious there's no large check included...and maybe...fingers crossed...she'll punish you both some more by ignoring you for decades.
Ugh. I'm so sorry his nasty offspring had to reproduce. My significant other is currently being punished as well by his 30 y.o. princess daughter (over $$ of course) and as a result his 3 sons give him the cold shoulder as well (she has them all by the balls). His daughter not speaking to him means his only grandchild is being withheld. Unfortunately he loves kids, would love to do things with a grandchild. That's a big plus you have going for you, that your DH doesn't go crazy over playing grandpa. I dread the thought of what my boyfriend's grandchild is being raised to act like.
You're also lucky the ringleader is 4 hours away!!! Oh how I wish...
I have nothing to do with my boyfriend's family...i don't remind him of birthdays or acknowledge any of his family at holidays. They've pretended like I don't exist for 20 years so I do the same. He's on his own!
Your right about reproducing.
Your right about reproducing. My YSD couldn't find a decent sperm donor for the longest time. She was forever getting dumped by her boyfriends. This was not a surprise to me! At one point, about 15 years ago, she told DH and I that, as she was getting older, she was concerned that she would never find a suitable "father" to have children with, so she was actually contemplating sperm donation. Yup. She wanted to be a single mother.
This wasn't a big shock to us at the time, because she's always been someone who acts before she thinks. I mean, I understand people who use sperm donors, but she could barely support herself as a single woman. How in God's green earth did she think she could manage a job and a baby on her own? Anyway, within a month of her springing that news on us, she found what she deemed to be perfect husband material. He looked like a biker, and she announced that fact to us just before we met him.
So, they had a child, got married and she began to propagate like a cockroach. She had two daughters in total and sadly, the youngest of the two is a carbon copy of her. Psycho Grand Kid. The biker hubby (no bike btw) actually turned out to be a nice guy. The kids loved him and when they would visit with us for the weekend, they spent most of their time with him or me.
Long story short, she screwed around on him, accused him of abuse, made sure that the kids would never see him again, and then temporarily used DH and I as her "flying monkeys" for court purposes. I believe, but don't know for sure as she never tells us the truth, that the kids are able to visit him again. I regret the part that we played in her effort to alienate him from his kids. We got bamboozled by her lies.
.....it will haunt me all my days...
Oh my I'm so sorry. Always
Oh my I'm so sorry. Always dysfunction with everything they do. My bf's idiot daughter got knocked up by a loser (i really think she was trying to trap him). He was gone by the time the kid was 6 months old, and she filed a restraining order against him. She's now dating a five time federal felon (robbed 5 banks) and is pushing the daddy role on him big time. Lots of pictures of her 7 year old kid always on his lap and him holding her. I'm just hoping and praying she doesn't get pregnant trying to trap this one because he's a gigalo.
OMG, Catmom....Just, OMG!!!
OMG, Catmom....Just, OMG!!! Big hugs. Hang in there, and buy a security system for your home!!!
More like other grandfathers?
More like other grandfathers? More like the ones she sees on TV, in movies? She really should get out more...