Sorry for some reason the post got submitted on this forum without content.
I've been a single mother with no support from my son's biological father for 1.5 years. He's not in the picture at all (no contact, no financial support). I met a man 9 months ago and our relationship got serious very fast. We talk about getting married and having a family. He has been amazing with my son.
We've had a few issues discussing finances and after our last discussion I can't seem to see a future with him anymore. He thinks I'm unreasonable and we can't seem to see things the same way.
He believes in splitting everything 50/50. He moved in with me and we're equally splitting rent and bills. Should we have a child, his view is we would split expenses for our joint child 50/50. He recognizes that I take care of my son fully so he has offered to pay for college and daycare/schooling expenses for our biological child, but everything else would be split 50/50 for our joint child. I would pay for college and daycare/schooling for my son (would be his stepson).
I have an issue with this because to me that doesn't say he wants to be a family. It's saying you take care of your child and I'll only take care of half of our joint child. I don't ever want to be in a relationship where my son (would be his stepson) isn't cared for in the same way by him. My view is that he should fully support our hypothetical joint child for the time being and I would fully support my son so that it would feel the children are equally cared for and one wouldn't get more care than the other. He thinks it's unreasonable and we just can't seem to reconcile on this.
Could some of you please offer your opinions or how we could come to middle ground? Please no harsh comments.
He is not responsible for your child - at all. You should be going after his bio dad for child support. The fact that BIODAD is not helping is what is not right here, not that your bf doesn't want to.
But a shared child? Why shouldn't you have to help financially?
He is not responsible for your child - I agree you are being the unreasonable one here.
Have you gone after your son's bio father for child support? They are pretty good at tracking fathers down and making them pay. He's the only man who is responsible for your son.
If you can't afford to support your son and a new child, then don't have a new child.
What are your respective financial situations? How old is your son and are you pursuing his father for support? If not, why not? Was bio dad ever involved in your son's life?
In general, I feel that stepparents should not be expected to be financially responsible for stepkids. However, I also think it is not right for half siblings growing up together in the same home to have significantly different lifestyles/resources. You can explain to a child why his half sib gets to go on vacation with or gets more expensive gifts from a grandparent who is not also that child's grandparent, but it's harder to explain why he wears thrift shop clothes and has few toys or electronics if the half sib wears designer clothes and has a room full of cool stuff.
It's hard to know what situation we're looking at without a little more info. In a vacuum, though, I'd say your partner's position is not unreasonable, especially since he's willing to pay 100% of college/daycare (huge expenses) for your mutual child.
The children should be brought up with similar lifestyles, vacations, etc. One should not have a silver spoon in their mouth while the other is a pauper.
If the case is that both of you can afford a similar daily lifestyle, than either joint or seperate is up to you guys. Personally I wouldn't want to get into micro details like the PB is kid1's and kid2 ate some, etc. So I would do joint and equal for that stuff.
College is different due to the amount of the expense and you and your kid's biodad should fund that, not stepdad IMO.
While I don't believe that a joint child is as simple as 50/50 (joint children aren't a clear split, more like a combined effort), your BF is NOT obligated to provide for your son. Your son has a father and has you, it is on the biological parents to provide for your biological son. Have you gone after your ex for CS? I also don't think that you each taking a child and fully supporting that child is appropriate either. Your joint child would likely feel only supported by Dad, while Mom is favoring bio son.
It seems like you are looking for your BF to be a sole provider. He is not obligated to provide for your son, only his own children, and if you find that unfair, you may want to look for a different relationship. It may not seem fair, but I feel that your request is unreasonable.
Although technically your BF is correct, meaning that in a 100% fair and equal situation, that is how things should theoretically be split, i kind of get a cheap vibe from him. Like he will keep a ledger and begrudge every cent. Or, that something about your situation has him feeling defensive, like he doesn't trust you not to take advantage of him financially. That just doesn't sound like a fun or peaceful relationship. You also don't mention your relative incomes, earning potential, and expenses. Those things make a difference, as well as who will do the majority of the child care. In summary, he is either stingy or doesn't trust you is my take. Either way, sounds bad.
I don't know - I didn't count pennies and make DH pay more of the utilities and food, etc, for SS - but I wouldn't have agreed to pay any part of big expenses for him. I don't think she should be asking that of him, no matter how much he makes.
Our incomes are very similar. Earning potential is somewhat similar (difficult to tell right now). If anything, he is a bigger spender than me when it comes to certain things, so it's not even that we're splitting things trully 50/50 right now. Actually I'm paying more. For example, he would spend $1,000/month alone for food for him. My budget was $450/month for me and my 2 year old.
It's interesting you noted the trust thing because we've talked about it before. Certainly some of my friends (including myself) think he has been taken advantage of in the past so he is taking it to the extreme in our relationship now.
I think a lot of this depends on your financial situation. If you both earn about the same amount, 50/50 might be reasonable. But if he earns $100K and you earn $40K, for example, then 50/50 is not a fair split.
I'm not sure how he'll go about determining what 50% of a child's expenses are. Does he expect you to split every doctor bill, every grocery bill, every toy, etc.? That sounds like a business arrangement, and not a good one. Is there any flexibility?
But in general, I agree with him that he's not responsible for your son. And if he's paying half the rent, half the bills, half the groceries, etc. now, then he actually IS paying for your son. He could argue that he should pay only 1/3.
I think you're learning a lot about your BF. Slow down the relationship and don't rush into marriage.
That's pretty much what he expects, to split everything 50/50. So hospital bills, groceries, toys.
He's really not paying 1/3 right now though because his bills are higher than my and my 2 year old's bills. He alone spends about $1,000/month on groceries, my son and I spend $450/month on groceries. I'm very conscious of turning the lights off, not leaving water run etc. He's not, he keeps the lights on during the day, leaves the shower water running while he gets dressed. So if anything, it's not an equal 50/50 split right now, so I don't think he has that argument. He wants to spend alone time and go on dates, I end up paying for the child care that we're on a date.
That's pretty much what I told him, we need to slow the relationship down and he needs to move out so we can continue to be responsible for our own households. I'm fine fully supporting my son and myself and I've come to realize I just don't want to be with someone who is splitting hairs.
I have to say, I couldn't imagine expecting my husband to pay for a babysitter when we were dating for my kids.
My kids will always be my responsibility, his will always be his. We don't have an ours, we were done with having babies but I know that if we did, "ours" child would be equally financially supported and mine would still be mine and his still his. I don't think your BF is wrong here.
See that is too extreme for me. I get that he wouldn't pay for college, big expenses, etc. but splitting groceries like that will likely just cause conflicts. Are you going to label everything with names so you know who paid for the bread and milk? I can see that would be uncomfortable and more like a rooommate situation vs. a life partner.
You know he even brought up the example of well what happens when we go on an extra vacation we didn't budget for? (right now now we have a 50/50 budgeted vacation). He want's to make sure that's split 50/50. Like I better not be the one paying it. So he just has this mindset of splitting everything well in advance.
Mind you for valentine's day, he spent $50 on my gift, I spent $3,000 on his (we make the same). It's neither here nor there but I'm just saying that my attitude isn't we should only be giving 50/50 to this relationship.
Very controlling. 50/50 splits do not always mean equal partnership in a relationship. Honestly this won't work, tell him to move out and you should move on.
And learn the lesson of not moving in right away with anyone again until you've understood the kind of blended family you both want and are comfortable with that. Including the finances.
Couple of things- Where is your son's father and why isn't he paying support? Is he the one who chose to not have a relationship with his son or did you make that choice because he wasn't behaving like you wanted him to?
I think your BF is being smart. You are talking about hypotheticals and down the road. There are a million things that can happen between now and then. You are 9 months in and he is looking at things in a very black and white manner. The fact that there will be 3 people in the home and he is still willing to pay half is generous in and of itself.
Things could change, maybe he adopts your son. Maybe eventually money melds and you share accounts and it doesn't matter who is paying what. Maybe he does keep it separate for his own protection- maybe since he is a spender you keep is separate for yours.
This could be a greedy test for you as well, maybe he is trying to see if you are only after him for money and him to be a substitute dad.
OP, this is going to come across as snarky, but I need you to think about this as you move forward with dating as it seems you and your BF aren't compatible.
What makes you such a good catch that a man would overlook you being a single mom AND be willing to invest his own time, money, and resources into a kid that isn't theirs?
Now, I know that sound super judgy, but hear me out. You want a rare breed of companion that is becoming more and more rare because courts have continually screwed over men when it comes to divorce and family court. I understand that your son's father is garbage and you're looking to make a sharp right turn away from that kind of man again, but you're going to have to come to the table as Betty Bada$$ to make what you want seem less terrifying.
You need to have a child support order in place to collect CS from your ex. I don't care if he doesn't pay voluntarily, that order needs to be there.
You need to have a custody agreement with your ex, even if it states you have sole custody and your ex gets nothing.
You need to have a babysitter lined up that you pay for to go out on dates.
You need to have your own savings account, car, house/apartment, etc.
You need to be gainfully employed, and you need to remain gainfully employed.
You need to be able to make your partner and their wants/needs a priority. Your son is your responsibility, but the world does not and should not revolve around him. You still have to an adult woman in addition to being a mother.
You have to really parent your son. You have to teach your son to respect your partner and enforce the rules when he doesn't.
Dating for you is going to be hard because you will ALWAYS have 100% responsibility of your son and dating will only add more responsibility onto your plate. It doesn't get taken away even if your partner decides to act paternal.
I don't envy your position, but think about the type of partner you want and make sure that you're delivering equally to that. You can't use the excuse "but I'm a single mom" to skirt around being a good partner. That will build resentment in your partner who will feel like they're having to overcompensate for a situation that didn't help create.
You may find the partner you're looking for, but if you want to keep them, then you need to be worth the risk. If you were to meet the male version of you, would you be willing to date them? Marry them? Help them raise their child? If not, work on yourself so you're worth that risk.
And before I get any flack, I've given the same advice to men who find themselves in a similar situation. If you want someone willing to take a big emotion and financial risk, then you best be THE catch.
Ask yourself if the roles were reversed how would you act. You're asking your BF to sign up for a life of paying for 50% while letting your ex off the hook completely. So you're willing to be generous to your ex, and expect nothing of him financially. But your boyfriend offers to pay for the big ticket items (college!) for a child who isn't his, and your response to his generosity is "I want more. I deserve more. My definitition of family means you have to give me more". So he has to give up his honeymoon period with you, where it's just the two of you with no kids. He takes on the extra mouth to feed (and pays 50% - although he spends more and probably buys fancier food, you two will quickly become accustom, and don't think your growing teenage boy won't eat you out of house and home some day, on his 50% tab!). He accepts that your attention is divided between the child you must raise and the relationship you're in. So he's willing to sacrifice time, attention, money. And you're still of the opion that it's not enough.
My DH and I thankfully don't split bills. We have one pot, and it all goes in equally. But if he had started our relationship focused on money the way you are I don't think I would have taken the chance.
He's telling you what he's willing to do right now. You're saying it's not enough, you want more. Which of you is "right" seems irrelevant.
Just to clarify, he isn't paying for big expenses (college etc) for a child that isn't his. He is saying he would only pay for college for his biological child, I would still be responsible for my son, which I'm totally fine with.
That's the thing, I'm not th one that started the relationship focused on money. He did. I've always thought of it as one pot, but he has been very vocal about 50/50, including 50/50 for his biological child.
Well, that was unfair of you to assume that he wanted a relationship where it is one big pot. Especially since you aren't married and haven't been together that long. Honestly, him expecting 50/50 on finances seems more normal at 9 months in than "one big pot", even if you live together.
This should be read by all single parents wanting to start dating. With a few little changes (swap paying for things with providing free childcare) it applies to men and women.
This reminds me of the situation in the Joy Luck Club where a woman married a man who bought designer ice cream and didn't let her have any because she couldn't afford to pay for half of it. They both worked, but his budget and lifestyle was way above her price range and he still expected her to pay for half of everything.
1000/month for one person's food budget is a lot. Wow.
Some parents become single parents unexpectedly and end up with a deadbeat ex. It happens. It's really hard when the kid is young and daycare expenses are a huge burden.
It sounds like the OP can afford a modest lifestyle for herself and her child, but can't afford the lifestyle her BF wants to live. As time goes on her daycare expenses should go down and her income should improve. Maybe she could go on foodstamps or something if her income is low enough, and the govt can go after her ex for CS.
If the BF doesn't undertand her means, they could live separate for now so there won't be any resentment.
Maybe a fair arrangement would be to have him pay the entire incremental cost of the upgrades. She can afford a two-bed apartment at 900, he wants a mansion at 3000, so she pays 900 and he pays 2100, for the mansion.
Tell me about it, he only drinks alkaline water, eats organic food, you get the idea.
I'm not saying any of my child's expenses are a burden, I make a good amount of money to be able to support my child on my own, send them to private school etc. Yeah I think we just need to live separately right now because there's resentment building. He thinks he has the bad end of the deal because we're living in my house and I'm paying off my mortgage while he's just spending money on bills. I've told him we don't even need to live in my house, he can buy a house and I could move in there to appease him in that regard. Seems he's just penalizing me for making responsible decisions.
I'm realizing his thinking is very "me" focused and not "family" focused. Which honestly when I think about his relationship history, one comment stood out to me about his ex. He said he wished her income was higher so she could afford to do things with him. Like she never would have been able to afford spontaneous activities we've done. He worried that she wouldn't be able to afford her retirement either (I think of retirement as a joint venture, not me and you saving for retirement separately). Honestly I feel like the one being used because I can afford to go 50/50 on luxurious vacations with him, so he's holding on to me because I can live out his lifestyle with him.
At the end of the day it just doesn't sound like you guys have the same goals, lifestyles or picture of what your life together looks like. It is probably best that you do split now before you waste any more time.
1. First, he's offered to pay for all of day care and all of college for any mutual children? That's pretty sweet! As a counter, my partner makes many multiples of what I make, but contributes NOTHING to our 2-year old's college account, and he resents me for having set up an account for her. He wants to spend everything he makes AND everything I make to support his young adult children, and worry about our mutual daughter later (he'll be OLD and retired when she's in college, so that's just absurd). Your situation isn't so bad....
2. He's not bringing any kids of his own into the marriage, but he wants to establish some 'ground rules' for your child. I personally would MUCH prefer this situation over marrying someone with kids of their own. You can figure this out, and maybe even overcome his desire to run the relationship with a balance sheet. First, I think you have to conceptually agree with him that your 2-year old is your responsibility today, and for at least the next 16 years. Good on you for starting a college fund. Hopefully it's automatically contributed from your paycheck. You can agree to a 50/50 split by saying, before you, I spent [$1500?] on housing and food for me and my son, and that's all I can afford. I'd love to split this with you 50/50, but it has to be in the perameters of what I can afford. If you want to spend more than [$3000] per month, you'll have to make up the difference. For example, when we live together, the food and utility bills are disproportionately higher. And, is there a way to do this without having to create an expense report every month? For example, can you have a joint bank account, and agree to a number to deposit each month into the joint account, and the rest goes to your personal accounts, including your personal savings, your 401k and the 529 plan for the 2-year old?
I don't think this is such a bad situation if you can get past the nickle and dime situation. I promise you, at least from a financial stiuation, this is SOOOO much better than marrying someone who has kids of their own.
Your situation doesn't sound the best. If I was married to someone and their adult children accepted me, I'd have no problem supporting them. However, when your husband doesn't want to start anything for your mutual child, that's concerning. You should be taking care of all children right now in my opinion.
After reading all these replies, I definitely just have different values. I was previously married (not to the father of my son) and I fully supported my ex-husband. Money was never an issue because when he could, he contributed and we just viewed everything as ours. This mentality of 50/50 with my current bf is not right to me.
If the roles were reversed and I was to marry a man with a child (ex not in the picture), I would make sure he's the right man for me and go in knowing that we would both be supporting our blended family. My current bf has expressed to me in the past that he felt very insecure in our relationship because I'm so great and have so much going for me (his words) and he's scared he won't be able to live up to the man I need him to be. He has always been worried that I would leave him and maybe part of it is him protecting himself financially from investing in more than his share into this relationship. I don't think he's ready for this type of commitment and living separately will be better for us.
OP, can you answer why you haven't gone after the child's father for child support? He's the one that should be supporting his son, not your BF.
I don't nickel and dime my DH, but we are pretty much 50/50 on everything (except his son). We put a set amount into a joint account and the rest stays in our separate accounts. He paid his child support out of his own money, and anything else he buys for his son.
Maybe you will find the dream man who wants to support your kid, seems there are some out there. I wouldn't do it that way, either, I think he's wise not to do so.
But as you said, different values, so keep looking.
If I was married to someone and their adult children accepted me, I'd have no problem supporting them.
Really? You'd have no problem giving money to, buying big ticket items for, adult children who do not work.
I fully supported my ex-husband. Money was never an issue because when he could, he contributed and we just viewed everything as ours.
Whether you did this in a first marriage or not, it is immaterial. Second marriages, especially when there is a child involved, are not first marriages.
I don't think he's ready for this type of commitment and living separately will be better for us.
Good idea. And use birth control because, if you follow your past reasoning, if he walks away from the child you won't go after him for child support, and 'great' you will be supporting two children.
I haven't gone after the father for child support because he didn't want to be involved in his life. My personal view is that if he doesn't want the child, he shouldn't be burdened with child support. I'm fully capable of financially supporting my son.
It's not about supporting my son, it's about being a family. I think everything you do as a family is for your entire family, not just your biological children. That's what it seems like, I just need to keep looking because I've met men that think the same as me. They just weren't the best personality fit for me in the past.
I think if you're planning on a family with someone, you should be stepping up to the responsibility of supporting your family. That's what I would certainly do. My ex didn't want a child, so I didn't burden him with one. My bf wanted me with a child, so you don't get to choose me without the child.
If I didn't want a man with a child, I wouldn't pursue that man.
Does your ex still have rights to your son? If you truly want a partner who will be "all in", then you need to allow them to be all in. That means giving them the option to be able to adopt your son.
As a SM who loves her SSs, I won't lie and say there isn't a small part of me that wouldn't be heartbroken if my DH left me and I lost my SSs. Unfortunately, stepparents don't have any recourse to maintain contact or a parental relationship if their relationship with the parent ends. That makes stepparents gun shy to invest time, money, and resources into a relationship with a kid that they have ZERO control over whether they will get to keep that relationship long-term.
It's selfish to expect a partner to be "all in" and treat their stepchild like their own when the reality is that they can't be theirs.
So... you are actively denying your child the support of it's father.
Involved or not, he made the deposit that created your kid and your kid has a right to the benefits of those resources.
I would not enter into a relationship where my mate was not holding their X accountable for support of their child. This kid is being raised with such a screwed up example of adult relationships that there is just about zero chance of healthy adult relationships in his life as an adult.
Even if it is just a CO for financial support, even if she takes less than what the court would give, something should be in place.
Also, it is pretty common for fathers that have to "pay" for their kid to actually start stepping up and be a parent. The child deserves to have the chance at a relationship with his father.
Best of luck moving on. I can tell you from experience, it doesn't feel good taking care of your partners' children when resources are finite, especially when you feel like doing so compromises your ability to provide for your own child(ren). Your partner, or a any future partner who you burden with expectation of financially supporting your son, may grown to resent you AND your son.
I think with your desire for the total "family" relationship and your BF's desire to have you be responsible for your child and pay 50/50 for any mutual child, this relationship won't work. While I don't think a stepparent is obligated to support a stepchild, I understand what your issue is, and it's not just the financial aspect.
BM here broke up with a long- term boyfriend because she decided he wasn't responsible enough to provide for her kids (my skids). She found a man who was (the Golden Goose). He is very into the whole family thing, makes a lot of money and is happy to support her kids and be a father figure and head of the household. She is happy to help raise his son. It totally works for them because both BM and the Golden Goose wanted the same thing. You and your boyfriend do not want the same thing. I'd move on.
Geez.....this topic has hit a nerve..... Regardless, the real issue is that the boyfriend is a neurotic selfish tightwad baby-man with a weird fixation on snacks! 9 months is too fast to be living together and talking about marriage- slow your roll and wait for the right person.
It hit a nerve because many of us feel she is selfish to expect any man other than the father to help support her kids. Her BF has weird financial stuff too but OP's beliefs are part of the problem.
In this day and age, you must have expectations that a blended family will be mostly about compromise. You are being extreme in your positioning in this argument whereas I find your DH is not.
The better the budget, the less chance of misunderstandings or arguments.
What you're asking, is the expenses related to your child be reduced, by being paid by someone who is not responsible for that expense. That would be like you wanting him to pay for half your credit card bill.
Obviously your son is not a bill... but there are expenses related to him. Those expenses should be dealt with by mom and dad. He's neither.
You can live as a family even by splitting finances accordingly... He's willing to pay 50/50... that's already more than you're entitled to get from him...since you and your son take up 2/3 of the family...
I don't want to sound harsh, but him proposing to pay 50/50 sounds like more of a family man wanting to treat you equitably... otherwise it sounds like you want to profit on the basis of your belief that your financial responsibility should be lessened just because you're together.
I don't see any reason why it's unfair to expect that a child's expenses are 50/50 between parents... if you can't both support your child equally... then don't buy it... he shouldn't ha e to be on the hook for more than his half... regardless if whether you are together or not.
Finances when SS's biological father isn't in the picture
Sorry for some reason the post got submitted on this forum without content.
I've been a single mother with no support from my son's biological father for 1.5 years. He's not in the picture at all (no contact, no financial support). I met a man 9 months ago and our relationship got serious very fast. We talk about getting married and having a family. He has been amazing with my son.
We've had a few issues discussing finances and after our last discussion I can't seem to see a future with him anymore. He thinks I'm unreasonable and we can't seem to see things the same way.
He believes in splitting everything 50/50. He moved in with me and we're equally splitting rent and bills. Should we have a child, his view is we would split expenses for our joint child 50/50. He recognizes that I take care of my son fully so he has offered to pay for college and daycare/schooling expenses for our biological child, but everything else would be split 50/50 for our joint child. I would pay for college and daycare/schooling for my son (would be his stepson).
I have an issue with this because to me that doesn't say he wants to be a family. It's saying you take care of your child and I'll only take care of half of our joint child. I don't ever want to be in a relationship where my son (would be his stepson) isn't cared for in the same way by him. My view is that he should fully support our hypothetical joint child for the time being and I would fully support my son so that it would feel the children are equally cared for and one wouldn't get more care than the other. He thinks it's unreasonable and we just can't seem to reconcile on this.
Could some of you please offer your opinions or how we could come to middle ground? Please no harsh comments.
Life is not always, or rarely
Life is not always, or rarely even, 100% fair.
He is not responsible for your child - at all. You should be going after his bio dad for child support. The fact that BIODAD is not helping is what is not right here, not that your bf doesn't want to.
But a shared child? Why shouldn't you have to help financially?
Your bf is right.
He is not responsible for
He is not responsible for your child - I agree you are being the unreasonable one here.
Have you gone after your son's bio father for child support? They are pretty good at tracking fathers down and making them pay. He's the only man who is responsible for your son.
If you can't afford to support your son and a new child, then don't have a new child.
What are your respective
What are your respective financial situations? How old is your son and are you pursuing his father for support? If not, why not? Was bio dad ever involved in your son's life?
In general, I feel that stepparents should not be expected to be financially responsible for stepkids. However, I also think it is not right for half siblings growing up together in the same home to have significantly different lifestyles/resources. You can explain to a child why his half sib gets to go on vacation with or gets more expensive gifts from a grandparent who is not also that child's grandparent, but it's harder to explain why he wears thrift shop clothes and has few toys or electronics if the half sib wears designer clothes and has a room full of cool stuff.
It's hard to know what situation we're looking at without a little more info. In a vacuum, though, I'd say your partner's position is not unreasonable, especially since he's willing to pay 100% of college/daycare (huge expenses) for your mutual child.
Agree with this
The children should be brought up with similar lifestyles, vacations, etc. One should not have a silver spoon in their mouth while the other is a pauper.
If the case is that both of you can afford a similar daily lifestyle, than either joint or seperate is up to you guys. Personally I wouldn't want to get into micro details like the PB is kid1's and kid2 ate some, etc. So I would do joint and equal for that stuff.
College is different due to the amount of the expense and you and your kid's biodad should fund that, not stepdad IMO.
I don't think your BF is
I don't think your BF is wrong.
While I don't believe that a joint child is as simple as 50/50 (joint children aren't a clear split, more like a combined effort), your BF is NOT obligated to provide for your son. Your son has a father and has you, it is on the biological parents to provide for your biological son. Have you gone after your ex for CS? I also don't think that you each taking a child and fully supporting that child is appropriate either. Your joint child would likely feel only supported by Dad, while Mom is favoring bio son.
It seems like you are looking for your BF to be a sole provider. He is not obligated to provide for your son, only his own children, and if you find that unfair, you may want to look for a different relationship. It may not seem fair, but I feel that your request is unreasonable.
Although technically your BF
Although technically your BF is correct, meaning that in a 100% fair and equal situation, that is how things should theoretically be split, i kind of get a cheap vibe from him. Like he will keep a ledger and begrudge every cent. Or, that something about your situation has him feeling defensive, like he doesn't trust you not to take advantage of him financially. That just doesn't sound like a fun or peaceful relationship. You also don't mention your relative incomes, earning potential, and expenses. Those things make a difference, as well as who will do the majority of the child care. In summary, he is either stingy or doesn't trust you is my take. Either way, sounds bad.
Also, from the title i
Also, from the title i thought this would be about a SS who was eating through the entire household budget.
Me too! I was just going to
Me too! I was just going to say that HE should pay for the kid's food, lol.
I don't know - I didn't count
I don't know - I didn't count pennies and make DH pay more of the utilities and food, etc, for SS - but I wouldn't have agreed to pay any part of big expenses for him. I don't think she should be asking that of him, no matter how much he makes.
I agree that she shouldn't.
I agree that she shouldn't.
Dup
Dup
Our incomes are very similar.
Our incomes are very similar. Earning potential is somewhat similar (difficult to tell right now). If anything, he is a bigger spender than me when it comes to certain things, so it's not even that we're splitting things trully 50/50 right now. Actually I'm paying more. For example, he would spend $1,000/month alone for food for him. My budget was $450/month for me and my 2 year old.
It's interesting you noted the trust thing because we've talked about it before. Certainly some of my friends (including myself) think he has been taken advantage of in the past so he is taking it to the extreme in our relationship now.
I think a lot of this depends
I think a lot of this depends on your financial situation. If you both earn about the same amount, 50/50 might be reasonable. But if he earns $100K and you earn $40K, for example, then 50/50 is not a fair split.
I'm not sure how he'll go about determining what 50% of a child's expenses are. Does he expect you to split every doctor bill, every grocery bill, every toy, etc.? That sounds like a business arrangement, and not a good one. Is there any flexibility?
But in general, I agree with him that he's not responsible for your son. And if he's paying half the rent, half the bills, half the groceries, etc. now, then he actually IS paying for your son. He could argue that he should pay only 1/3.
I think you're learning a lot about your BF. Slow down the relationship and don't rush into marriage.
That's pretty much what he
That's pretty much what he expects, to split everything 50/50. So hospital bills, groceries, toys.
He's really not paying 1/3 right now though because his bills are higher than my and my 2 year old's bills. He alone spends about $1,000/month on groceries, my son and I spend $450/month on groceries. I'm very conscious of turning the lights off, not leaving water run etc. He's not, he keeps the lights on during the day, leaves the shower water running while he gets dressed. So if anything, it's not an equal 50/50 split right now, so I don't think he has that argument. He wants to spend alone time and go on dates, I end up paying for the child care that we're on a date.
That's pretty much what I told him, we need to slow the relationship down and he needs to move out so we can continue to be responsible for our own households. I'm fine fully supporting my son and myself and I've come to realize I just don't want to be with someone who is splitting hairs.
May I suggest that you also
May I suggest that you also examine your own expectation that a man should automatically take on caring for your son financially?
I have to say, I couldn't
I have to say, I couldn't imagine expecting my husband to pay for a babysitter when we were dating for my kids.
My kids will always be my responsibility, his will always be his. We don't have an ours, we were done with having babies but I know that if we did, "ours" child would be equally financially supported and mine would still be mine and his still his. I don't think your BF is wrong here.
Too extreme
See that is too extreme for me. I get that he wouldn't pay for college, big expenses, etc. but splitting groceries like that will likely just cause conflicts. Are you going to label everything with names so you know who paid for the bread and milk? I can see that would be uncomfortable and more like a rooommate situation vs. a life partner.
You know he even brought up
You know he even brought up the example of well what happens when we go on an extra vacation we didn't budget for? (right now now we have a 50/50 budgeted vacation). He want's to make sure that's split 50/50. Like I better not be the one paying it. So he just has this mindset of splitting everything well in advance.
Mind you for valentine's day, he spent $50 on my gift, I spent $3,000 on his (we make the same). It's neither here nor there but I'm just saying that my attitude isn't we should only be giving 50/50 to this relationship.
He sounds OCD
Very controlling. 50/50 splits do not always mean equal partnership in a relationship. Honestly this won't work, tell him to move out and you should move on.
Move Out
Yes he needs to move out.
And learn the lesson of not moving in right away with anyone again until you've understood the kind of blended family you both want and are comfortable with that. Including the finances.
Do you think he should pay
Do you think he should pay for childcare when you're on a date?
If so, I think you have some unrealistic expectations.
Any marriage managed on a
Any marriage managed on a balance sheet is doomed IMHO.
I agree
I agree
Me three
Too micro-managed if the dude needs to split groceries for two young kids like that.
For sure. You should be
For sure. You should be finance aware, but not totally finance driven to the point that everything must be divided and calculated.
Couple of things- Where is
Couple of things- Where is your son's father and why isn't he paying support? Is he the one who chose to not have a relationship with his son or did you make that choice because he wasn't behaving like you wanted him to?
I think your BF is being smart. You are talking about hypotheticals and down the road. There are a million things that can happen between now and then. You are 9 months in and he is looking at things in a very black and white manner. The fact that there will be 3 people in the home and he is still willing to pay half is generous in and of itself.
Things could change, maybe he adopts your son. Maybe eventually money melds and you share accounts and it doesn't matter who is paying what. Maybe he does keep it separate for his own protection- maybe since he is a spender you keep is separate for yours.
This could be a greedy test for you as well, maybe he is trying to see if you are only after him for money and him to be a substitute dad.
Why isn't your son's bio dad
Why isn't your son's bio dad paying any kind of support? Let's start there.
OP, this is going to come
OP, this is going to come across as snarky, but I need you to think about this as you move forward with dating as it seems you and your BF aren't compatible.
What makes you such a good catch that a man would overlook you being a single mom AND be willing to invest his own time, money, and resources into a kid that isn't theirs?
Now, I know that sound super judgy, but hear me out. You want a rare breed of companion that is becoming more and more rare because courts have continually screwed over men when it comes to divorce and family court. I understand that your son's father is garbage and you're looking to make a sharp right turn away from that kind of man again, but you're going to have to come to the table as Betty Bada$$ to make what you want seem less terrifying.
You need to have a child support order in place to collect CS from your ex. I don't care if he doesn't pay voluntarily, that order needs to be there.
You need to have a custody agreement with your ex, even if it states you have sole custody and your ex gets nothing.
You need to have a babysitter lined up that you pay for to go out on dates.
You need to have your own savings account, car, house/apartment, etc.
You need to be gainfully employed, and you need to remain gainfully employed.
You need to be able to make your partner and their wants/needs a priority. Your son is your responsibility, but the world does not and should not revolve around him. You still have to an adult woman in addition to being a mother.
You have to really parent your son. You have to teach your son to respect your partner and enforce the rules when he doesn't.
Dating for you is going to be hard because you will ALWAYS have 100% responsibility of your son and dating will only add more responsibility onto your plate. It doesn't get taken away even if your partner decides to act paternal.
I don't envy your position, but think about the type of partner you want and make sure that you're delivering equally to that. You can't use the excuse "but I'm a single mom" to skirt around being a good partner. That will build resentment in your partner who will feel like they're having to overcompensate for a situation that didn't help create.
You may find the partner you're looking for, but if you want to keep them, then you need to be worth the risk. If you were to meet the male version of you, would you be willing to date them? Marry them? Help them raise their child? If not, work on yourself so you're worth that risk.
And before I get any flack, I've given the same advice to men who find themselves in a similar situation. If you want someone willing to take a big emotion and financial risk, then you best be THE catch.
(No subject)
^^^Every word of this. Every
^^^Every word of this. Every.Single.Word. *clapping*
This!!
Ask yourself if the roles were reversed how would you act. You're asking your BF to sign up for a life of paying for 50% while letting your ex off the hook completely. So you're willing to be generous to your ex, and expect nothing of him financially. But your boyfriend offers to pay for the big ticket items (college!) for a child who isn't his, and your response to his generosity is "I want more. I deserve more. My definitition of family means you have to give me more". So he has to give up his honeymoon period with you, where it's just the two of you with no kids. He takes on the extra mouth to feed (and pays 50% - although he spends more and probably buys fancier food, you two will quickly become accustom, and don't think your growing teenage boy won't eat you out of house and home some day, on his 50% tab!). He accepts that your attention is divided between the child you must raise and the relationship you're in. So he's willing to sacrifice time, attention, money. And you're still of the opion that it's not enough.
My DH and I thankfully don't split bills. We have one pot, and it all goes in equally. But if he had started our relationship focused on money the way you are I don't think I would have taken the chance.
He's telling you what he's willing to do right now. You're saying it's not enough, you want more. Which of you is "right" seems irrelevant.
Just to clarify, he isn't
Just to clarify, he isn't paying for big expenses (college etc) for a child that isn't his. He is saying he would only pay for college for his biological child, I would still be responsible for my son, which I'm totally fine with.
That's the thing, I'm not th one that started the relationship focused on money. He did. I've always thought of it as one pot, but he has been very vocal about 50/50, including 50/50 for his biological child.
Well, that was unfair of you
Well, that was unfair of you to assume that he wanted a relationship where it is one big pot. Especially since you aren't married and haven't been together that long. Honestly, him expecting 50/50 on finances seems more normal at 9 months in than "one big pot", even if you live together.
We've talked about marriage
We've talked about marriage multiple times, so that's his view on marriage as well.
Marriage doesn't equal "one
Marriage doesn't equal "one pot" finances, either. He's not wrong for wanting to keep things 50/50. He just may be wrong for you.
And this....
And this describes perfectly my wife.
LT, I tip my hat to you and your brilliance.
OP, be the person described by LT and you have every opportunity of finding the relationship you crave.
Good luck.
This should be read by all
This should be read by all single parents wanting to start dating. With a few little changes (swap paying for things with providing free childcare) it applies to men and women.
This reminds me of the
This reminds me of the situation in the Joy Luck Club where a woman married a man who bought designer ice cream and didn't let her have any because she couldn't afford to pay for half of it. They both worked, but his budget and lifestyle was way above her price range and he still expected her to pay for half of everything.
1000/month for one person's food budget is a lot. Wow.
Some parents become single parents unexpectedly and end up with a deadbeat ex. It happens. It's really hard when the kid is young and daycare expenses are a huge burden.
It sounds like the OP can afford a modest lifestyle for herself and her child, but can't afford the lifestyle her BF wants to live. As time goes on her daycare expenses should go down and her income should improve. Maybe she could go on foodstamps or something if her income is low enough, and the govt can go after her ex for CS.
If the BF doesn't undertand her means, they could live separate for now so there won't be any resentment.
Maybe a fair arrangement would be to have him pay the entire incremental cost of the upgrades. She can afford a two-bed apartment at 900, he wants a mansion at 3000, so she pays 900 and he pays 2100, for the mansion.
Tell me about it, he only
Tell me about it, he only drinks alkaline water, eats organic food, you get the idea.
I'm not saying any of my child's expenses are a burden, I make a good amount of money to be able to support my child on my own, send them to private school etc. Yeah I think we just need to live separately right now because there's resentment building. He thinks he has the bad end of the deal because we're living in my house and I'm paying off my mortgage while he's just spending money on bills. I've told him we don't even need to live in my house, he can buy a house and I could move in there to appease him in that regard. Seems he's just penalizing me for making responsible decisions.
I'm realizing his thinking is very "me" focused and not "family" focused. Which honestly when I think about his relationship history, one comment stood out to me about his ex. He said he wished her income was higher so she could afford to do things with him. Like she never would have been able to afford spontaneous activities we've done. He worried that she wouldn't be able to afford her retirement either (I think of retirement as a joint venture, not me and you saving for retirement separately). Honestly I feel like the one being used because I can afford to go 50/50 on luxurious vacations with him, so he's holding on to me because I can live out his lifestyle with him.
At the end of the day it just
At the end of the day it just doesn't sound like you guys have the same goals, lifestyles or picture of what your life together looks like. It is probably best that you do split now before you waste any more time.
I'm sorry, but you sound
I'm sorry, but you sound responsible and he sounds like an extravagant, selfish turd. You deserve better.
He's "special", aka sounds narcissistic.
Also if I'm being honest, he
Also if I'm being honest, he spends close to $2,000 on food for himself some months if he gets himself lots of healthy organic snacks.
Joy Luck Club
Me too - I thought of that same storyline in the Joy Luck Club! Reminds me exactly of that!
thoughts
1. First, he's offered to pay for all of day care and all of college for any mutual children? That's pretty sweet! As a counter, my partner makes many multiples of what I make, but contributes NOTHING to our 2-year old's college account, and he resents me for having set up an account for her. He wants to spend everything he makes AND everything I make to support his young adult children, and worry about our mutual daughter later (he'll be OLD and retired when she's in college, so that's just absurd). Your situation isn't so bad....
2. He's not bringing any kids of his own into the marriage, but he wants to establish some 'ground rules' for your child. I personally would MUCH prefer this situation over marrying someone with kids of their own. You can figure this out, and maybe even overcome his desire to run the relationship with a balance sheet. First, I think you have to conceptually agree with him that your 2-year old is your responsibility today, and for at least the next 16 years. Good on you for starting a college fund. Hopefully it's automatically contributed from your paycheck. You can agree to a 50/50 split by saying, before you, I spent [$1500?] on housing and food for me and my son, and that's all I can afford. I'd love to split this with you 50/50, but it has to be in the perameters of what I can afford. If you want to spend more than [$3000] per month, you'll have to make up the difference. For example, when we live together, the food and utility bills are disproportionately higher. And, is there a way to do this without having to create an expense report every month? For example, can you have a joint bank account, and agree to a number to deposit each month into the joint account, and the rest goes to your personal accounts, including your personal savings, your 401k and the 529 plan for the 2-year old?
I don't think this is such a bad situation if you can get past the nickle and dime situation. I promise you, at least from a financial stiuation, this is SOOOO much better than marrying someone who has kids of their own.
Your situation doesn't sound
Your situation doesn't sound the best. If I was married to someone and their adult children accepted me, I'd have no problem supporting them. However, when your husband doesn't want to start anything for your mutual child, that's concerning. You should be taking care of all children right now in my opinion.
After reading all these replies, I definitely just have different values. I was previously married (not to the father of my son) and I fully supported my ex-husband. Money was never an issue because when he could, he contributed and we just viewed everything as ours. This mentality of 50/50 with my current bf is not right to me.
If the roles were reversed and I was to marry a man with a child (ex not in the picture), I would make sure he's the right man for me and go in knowing that we would both be supporting our blended family. My current bf has expressed to me in the past that he felt very insecure in our relationship because I'm so great and have so much going for me (his words) and he's scared he won't be able to live up to the man I need him to be. He has always been worried that I would leave him and maybe part of it is him protecting himself financially from investing in more than his share into this relationship. I don't think he's ready for this type of commitment and living separately will be better for us.
OP, can you answer why you
OP, can you answer why you haven't gone after the child's father for child support? He's the one that should be supporting his son, not your BF.
I don't nickel and dime my DH, but we are pretty much 50/50 on everything (except his son). We put a set amount into a joint account and the rest stays in our separate accounts. He paid his child support out of his own money, and anything else he buys for his son.
Maybe you will find the dream man who wants to support your kid, seems there are some out there. I wouldn't do it that way, either, I think he's wise not to do so.
But as you said, different values, so keep looking.
If I was married to someone
Really? You'd have no problem giving money to, buying big ticket items for, adult children who do not work.
Whether you did this in a first marriage or not, it is immaterial. Second marriages, especially when there is a child involved, are not first marriages.
Good idea. And use birth control because, if you follow your past reasoning, if he walks away from the child you won't go after him for child support, and 'great' you will be supporting two children.
Or she will go after him for
Or she will go after him for continued child support since they were a "family" and so he has to keep supporting someone else's child.
I haven't gone after the
I haven't gone after the father for child support because he didn't want to be involved in his life. My personal view is that if he doesn't want the child, he shouldn't be burdened with child support. I'm fully capable of financially supporting my son.
It's not about supporting my son, it's about being a family. I think everything you do as a family is for your entire family, not just your biological children. That's what it seems like, I just need to keep looking because I've met men that think the same as me. They just weren't the best personality fit for me in the past.
Wow - so you think a BF or
Wow - so you think a BF or husband is more obligated to support your child than the bio father. Interesting.
I think if you're planning on
I think if you're planning on a family with someone, you should be stepping up to the responsibility of supporting your family. That's what I would certainly do. My ex didn't want a child, so I didn't burden him with one. My bf wanted me with a child, so you don't get to choose me without the child.
If I didn't want a man with a child, I wouldn't pursue that man.
Being with a man with a child
Being with a man with a child doesn't mean I have to support that child. And vice versa. I really don't understand that line of thinking.
"I think everything you do as
"I think everything you do as a family is for your entire family, not just your biological children."
Obviously, your BF does not feel this way. This relationship is not a financial "fit" for you. Time to move on.
100% and what I told my
100% and what I told my boyfriend.
Does your ex still have
Does your ex still have rights to your son? If you truly want a partner who will be "all in", then you need to allow them to be all in. That means giving them the option to be able to adopt your son.
As a SM who loves her SSs, I won't lie and say there isn't a small part of me that wouldn't be heartbroken if my DH left me and I lost my SSs. Unfortunately, stepparents don't have any recourse to maintain contact or a parental relationship if their relationship with the parent ends. That makes stepparents gun shy to invest time, money, and resources into a relationship with a kid that they have ZERO control over whether they will get to keep that relationship long-term.
It's selfish to expect a partner to be "all in" and treat their stepchild like their own when the reality is that they can't be theirs.
So... you are actively
So... you are actively denying your child the support of it's father.
Involved or not, he made the deposit that created your kid and your kid has a right to the benefits of those resources.
I would not enter into a relationship where my mate was not holding their X accountable for support of their child. This kid is being raised with such a screwed up example of adult relationships that there is just about zero chance of healthy adult relationships in his life as an adult.
I agree.
I agree.
Even if it is just a CO for financial support, even if she takes less than what the court would give, something should be in place.
Also, it is pretty common for fathers that have to "pay" for their kid to actually start stepping up and be a parent. The child deserves to have the chance at a relationship with his father.
Makes sense
Best of luck moving on. I can tell you from experience, it doesn't feel good taking care of your partners' children when resources are finite, especially when you feel like doing so compromises your ability to provide for your own child(ren). Your partner, or a any future partner who you burden with expectation of financially supporting your son, may grown to resent you AND your son.
Or when they guilt you into
Or when they guilt you into it to fulfill their dream of a "happy family".
If that's their attitude, I
If that's their attitude, I wouldn't be with them.
I think with your desire for
I think with your desire for the total "family" relationship and your BF's desire to have you be responsible for your child and pay 50/50 for any mutual child, this relationship won't work. While I don't think a stepparent is obligated to support a stepchild, I understand what your issue is, and it's not just the financial aspect.
BM here broke up with a long- term boyfriend because she decided he wasn't responsible enough to provide for her kids (my skids). She found a man who was (the Golden Goose). He is very into the whole family thing, makes a lot of money and is happy to support her kids and be a father figure and head of the household. She is happy to help raise his son. It totally works for them because both BM and the Golden Goose wanted the same thing. You and your boyfriend do not want the same thing. I'd move on.
Forest for the Trees
Geez.....this topic has hit a nerve..... Regardless, the real issue is that the boyfriend is a neurotic selfish tightwad baby-man with a weird fixation on snacks! 9 months is too fast to be living together and talking about marriage- slow your roll and wait for the right person.
It hit a nerve because many
It hit a nerve because many of us feel she is selfish to expect any man other than the father to help support her kids. Her BF has weird financial stuff too but OP's beliefs are part of the problem.
In this day and age, you must
In this day and age, you must have expectations that a blended family will be mostly about compromise. You are being extreme in your positioning in this argument whereas I find your DH is not.
The better the budget, the
The better the budget, the less chance of misunderstandings or arguments.
What you're asking, is the expenses related to your child be reduced, by being paid by someone who is not responsible for that expense. That would be like you wanting him to pay for half your credit card bill.
Obviously your son is not a bill... but there are expenses related to him. Those expenses should be dealt with by mom and dad. He's neither.
You can live as a family even by splitting finances accordingly... He's willing to pay 50/50... that's already more than you're entitled to get from him...since you and your son take up 2/3 of the family...
I don't want to sound harsh, but him proposing to pay 50/50 sounds like more of a family man wanting to treat you equitably... otherwise it sounds like you want to profit on the basis of your belief that your financial responsibility should be lessened just because you're together.
I don't see any reason why it's unfair to expect that a child's expenses are 50/50 between parents... if you can't both support your child equally... then don't buy it... he shouldn't ha e to be on the hook for more than his half... regardless if whether you are together or not.