New member here .. Just don't know what to do
Hi everyone,
So grateful to find this site.
Right now I have a serious conflict between my fiance and my ex-wife. My ex-wife is a psychologist and has had a terrible time with my new relationship. She left me 5 years ago (for a woman) and I found a lovely woman who is wonderful to be with. She tried reaching out to my ex in the beginning hoping to have a basic relationship and my ex could not deal with that. The kids of course had their issues and complaints as we began blending (I think I did rush the moving in part) .. They would complain to my ex about things and I would continually hear back from her that they were not happy with my new relationship. Eventually she wrote an terrible email to both of us that was so insulting that it has left shockwaves for 2 years and made it impossible to reconcile. After biting her tongue for a year my fiance had a small circumstance that put her over the edge and she finally texted a response to my ex from that letter. Well it turns out my wife actually shared that letter with my daughter .. How do you do that when your a professional in the psychology field? and she has shared many other things. She even told my 10 year old son she tried to fix me and finally gave up. He recently told me that. I don't believe in bad talking a parent so I always feel like its an unfair situation. It appears she wishes I was single and available to her and the kids while she lives the life she wants.
So through most of this she has had the kids going to a social worker to work thru this stuff and other life issues. I am ok with that support however its been 3.5 years of them going and my ex also has lots of talk/analysis sessions with the kids and I think with all that analysis they can't help but find problems in their life with all of that. The therapist the kids go to doesn't feel that way, my ex doesn't and I'm on an island alone. My fiancé is putting pressure on me to get that to stop or at least for me to not be apart of it but its my kids and I need to be hearing from the therapist if they are going to her.
We did have a big breakthrough the other day when I let the control go and my kids and fiance let out their feelings with each other. The kids said they want to be a family and want to connect with her. Its been much better since but now I'm getting messages from the therapist and ex that we all need to talk. Its imperative.
My fiancé has such anger for my ex it is hard to know what is a legitimate concern and what is just doing the opposite of my ex. She doesn't want me near her and to barely communicate. I feel like I have to hide my communications.
I feel so trapped at the center of all of this. I probably haven't explained enough or made it confusing .. Its my first post and I'm just reaching out to you hoping for some insight, experience, or support.
Thank you!
Exactly .. She shared both
Exactly .. She shared both the letter and the text from my fiance. And shred her opinions on the relationship.
The ex- is whack and proof
The ex- is whack and proof that even psychologist themselves sometimes have no clue on how to deal with divorce/steps. You keep bringing up she is a psycho., and my first piece of advise, would be to look at your ex- as an ex- and not take her so-called psychology background into consideration at all.
Unfortunately, I admit your ex- will try to use the "fact" that she is a professional against you and your fiance (and the children) as much as she can. Your ex- is not interested at all in a blended family. She is interested in control and her being A#1. And, it is unfortunate that in the US, even a BM who leaves her spouse for another person, will still be given way, way more of a pass than either you or your fiancé.
These types of situations are always difficult, because BM will always be given the shadow of doubt of being innocent, and you will be given the shadow of doubt of being guilty. You need to be careful. I could just see this woman trying to "build" evidence that you are somehow neglecting or even abusing the children, and her trying to get full custody of them. Because it is all about control for her.
My advice, only you should have contact with your ex-. Anytime the children come over, make sure they do not speak badly of anyone--you, your fiancé, and even your ex-, and correct their behavior if they do so. You need to let your kids know that YOU are in charge of your household, and that they need to respect your finance and the fact that she will be your future wife. Your finance should try to stay out of the fray as much as possible, because it is your and your ex's issue.
Hopefully, if kids see you setting down the rules at your household of not allowing disrespect of anyone, they'll come around, but I have to say, regardless of what you do, sometimes this is just a crap shoot. Your ex- may succeed in PAS'ing them. Both you and your fiancé should focus on supporting each other, and you need to focus on supporting your kids as well and providing as positive of a role model for them as you can. YOU get to set the rules, and not your ex- and not even a therapist.
Thank you for that note! She
Thank you for that note! She is so into her self I don't think she will try and seek custody. 50/50 now. The kids are actually doing quite well right now with my fiance .. My mistake that came out of inexperience and this situation was trying to control everything. If the kids had a problem with my fiance I talked with them and didn't share with her .. trying to work each issue out with the individual. The other day my son was ready to break it all up. I finally had to let her know how intense things were with him and she was close to calling it a day. In that intense moment were he saw me sad and upset and her upset he came to her crying and said I think we can be a great family and he realized he thought he wanted space from her when he actually now realized he wanted a connection. She was wonderful talkking to him straight without my sugar coating. I admitted to all that I had tried to control too much because I wanted this to work and for us to be a family. They have hugged everyday since. He comes in ...Hey I didn't give you a hug yet
My daughter is the most confused because she wants the connection with her mom and yet also can get along well with my fiance ... She has seen and heard so much she is caught in the middle.
So sorry. What a mess. There
So sorry. What a mess.
There are women who do such things as send disparaging letters and emails to people.
My DH's ex sent all kind of crap to all kind of people, DHs sister, uncles, DHs friends, her own kids etc
The only thing came out of it is that many relatives and friends cut ties with her, one SD cut all ties with her and the other sees her only once in a blue moon.
But then my exSO (different man before my marriage) had ex who had issues with her adult DD. She was blocked from phone and email so she ended up sending snail mail letters to DD's in-law and all kind of other DDs family describing how her DD and son in law were evil. Etc
You can't take these people seriously or personally. Block these people. Ignore. Don't engage. Etc
There are a lot of wonderful psychologists and social workers. And I've met some who were complete and total nutcases. Her being a psychologists means nothing
Thank you very much
Thank you very much
Your ex-wife is a hideous
Your ex-wife is a hideous nightmare and sooner or later your new girlfriend will figure out there is a whole world out there without your ex-wife in it.
If you want to keep your girlfriend, or any subsequent girlfriend, treat your ex-wife like she's the fire breathing dragon trying to gobble up your shackled damsel in distress gf. Defend her. Keep a firm boundary around your own castle. It is the only way forward.
Right now it sounds like you are trying to please the dragon and the woman you sleep with and your kids and your kids' therapist. Pick one.
You don't "please" your kids: you parent them. You don't "please" your kids' therapist: you assess whether they are helping. If you could have pleased your ex-wife, you'd still be married to her.
So the choice seems pretty obvious to me. But it's your life, you can choose endless misery if you want.
^^ this ^^
this
A lot of relationship drama
A lot of relationship drama is caused by poor boundaries. Your ex feeling like she has any 'right' to a relationship, judgement, etc of you is a poor boundary. She's no longer in a relationship with you, so her feelings about you should be none or irrelevant to her job of raising your shared children when they are with her. Any other feelings about you are for her to discuss in her own therapy sessions.
Your fiancee reaching out to your ex was also a poor boundary. I can see polite introductions and inquiries such as, "How are you?" at exchanges, but not actual contact.
Your ex involving your shared children in her battle with you - for any reason - is a poor boundary.
I think if your kids go to a therapist, on your ex's time, and you get a written report monthly and maybe bi-monthly you get a phone call about how the kids are doing, great. You do not need to show up for family counselling with your kids and your ex. Worst case, I can see *possibly* showing up for some kind of 'how can we possibly parent these children together' relationship counselling with your ex, but you'd need a neutral therapist - one that your ex doesn't know personally or professionally, and one that isn't seeing anyone else involved with your family either.
And your poor boundary is showing your fiancee your ex's diatribe of an email. Keep your fiancee away from the drama train that is your ex. Let her be the woman in your life and in your home, let your kids like her or dislike her but require that they behave towards her with respect, and let your ex deal with the drama she creates.
Thank you .. For clarity ..
Thank you .. For clarity .. My ex sent the email to both of us
Thank you for the comments.
Thank you for the comments. Honestly, I'm a peaceful guy who has no other conflicts .. Many nice friends throughout my life and was very supportive of my ex as she transitioned - Came out lesbian. She actually told me after a parent meeting that she cares about me and that I didn't fight for her. My jaw dropped and I thought later how would that work and how about fighting for me. I had a year and a half of being criticized. Now she wants to be buddies with me and treat my fiance like she doesn't exist.
I feel like the therapist is more aligned with her even though she clearly denies that .. may be my insecurity.
No, it is not your
No, it is not your insecurity.
I think the thing that
I think the thing that crushes me is I have always been there for her and my children through their mom's transition to her new female partner. When I get tough with my ex it just comes back in subtle ways to the children thru mom.
I feel like I'm breaking my children .. Not because my fiance is a problem but because Mom slowly poisons things. Never ugly but more out of concern for me and the children. I can feel her jealousy as I have someone in the role she had who is straight and does things she didnt do .. Great cook, keeps a beautiful home, is romatic with me.
I once dated a wonderful man
I once dated a wonderful man I was crazy about. He'd been on a big roller coaster with his ex-wife who finally left him, announcing she was actually a lesbian.
A couple years later I met him and we were great together. The first weekend she heard we were together she announced she wasn't lesbian after all and wanted him back.
Sound familiar?
You have to pick between being "supportive" of a person who views you as a possession and being free to live your own life with people who are actually nice to you. You simply cannot do both.
Your children are going to have difficulties not because you found a gf but because their mother is a piece of work. Nothing you can do can change that. Nothing.
So do your best to live a good life and model a healthy relationship to your children and model great boundaries for them.
You have a high conflict person in your life, ex-wife, so you have to start figuring out how to face actual conflict. You will have to give up your self image as a "no conflict guy" because to others it appears not as heroic but as the opposite. It's one of life's challenges and I know you can meet it.
P.S. I am free of that former bf with the ex-wife who'd always been awful to him but suddenly wanted him back. I'm sure he's still in hell and thank god I did not get sucked into that cyclone for too long.
Wow! Thank you so much .. The
Wow! Thank you so much .. The kid part is what scares me the most. I never imagined not seeing them 7 days a week and now its become a mess. I'm afraid when I face the conflict I will lose even more of them .. That said I believe you are hitting the nail on the head.
Very much appreciated!
Time for a zero tolerance and
Time for a zero tolerance and destroy the toxic opposition position. Drag your X to court and get a judge to smack her in the mouth to STFU in discussing you or your current relationship with the kids.
Judges tend to not like this kind of crap. Go loaded for bear. Have all of the toxic X crap printed and ready for submittal. Have all of the stories recounted by the kids logged and ready for review. The judge can take them to his chambers to confirm if necessary.
My wife would periodically attempt to establish a cooperative relationship with my SS-24's SpermIdiot and extended SpermClan ... to no avail and to much heart break for my wife.
She finally learned that it is not reasonable to try to work with the unreasonable in the blended family opposition. Things got a whole lot less upsetting and whole lot easier to deal with when she took the position that since they had proven their inability at reasonableness their only option was to do what they were told when they were told to do it or suffer the full wrath of consequences that we could apply in court, legally, financially, socially, etc.....
They learned to stay under the slime covered rock they lived under at the bottom of their shallow and polluted gene pool. Our focus was on our son's best interests and protecting our family from the SpermClan's toxic crap.
We lived this for 16+ years under the Custody/Visitation/Support CO until our son aged out from under it at 18. When he was 22 he asked me to adopt him. He knew who his REAL dad is and we got papers documented what had always been fact. I am his dad. We raised him to be respectful to them but also to recognize their manipulations and when to apply the test of reasonableness to anything they pulled or said. As he progressed into his teens he would go through our Custody/Visitation/Support file cabinets to do his own research on their crap.
The main counter that we had to the SpermClan's version of what your XW is doing to your kids was documented facts. We never bad mouthed them but neither did we tolerate their manipulations of the kid to go un-countered. Season your children with the facts in an age appropriate manner, review the CO, review her toxic rants, etc..... As they get older this will help them to navigate their own relationship with this toxic BM and to protect themselves from her crap. You modeling reasonable adult behavior and a quality adult relationship with your SO will do far more good for your kids than your XW's toxic crap will do harm.
Is she a licensed therapist? If she is.... nail her ass with the licensing authority for her unprofessional crap. I would if I were you.
Good luck.
Thanks very much for the
Thanks very much for the comments! Appreciate hearing your experience .. Wishing you well too!
I know some psychologists-
I know some psychologists- they know very little about human nature.
You're the one who needs to
You're the one who needs to be in contact and communicating with your ex. Your fiance tried to reach out and it backfired, lesson learned. Fiance needs to block ex on phone, email and social media. The ex is your responsiblity no hers. Fights and nasty texts/emails are yours to deal w/not fiance's. Why are you letting her fight your battles and deal with your mess?!
Your poor fiance is completely embroiled in the messed up psycho babble drama between you and your ex. You ALL do not need to talk, please leave your fiance out of it. Deal with the drama between you, the kids and their mother and keep it separate from you and your fiance's relationship. And it's not ok to "let the control go" with your kids. you should be parenting them instead of allowing them to vent their issues on your fiance.
"I feel so trapped at the center of all of this."
Oh poor man stuck in the middle of two women and your kids fighting over you. Stop the victim crap, man up, deal with your ex and parent your kids. Maybe you need to cool down the relationship w/your fiance until you get your drama in check.
Thanks for your note .. Just
Thanks for your note .. Just to clarify I am trying to keep it between myself and my ex .. My fiance wants to know whats going on in those communications (feels left out) If I get anything critical from the ex .. that stays between us. Its when I have kept it between my ex and myself and then something comes up thru the kids and she gets very upset that I didn't tell her.
I actually am doing most of what you are suggesting .. My fiance is just so angry she can't stop talking about how wicked my ex is even when there is nothing new.
Again thanks for your thoughts!
Bill
She can't stop talking about
She can't stop talking about it because she's shocked. You, however, are used to it and accepted it long ago. Let your gf be a window on reality for you. You SHOULD be shocked, too.
She wants to know what's going on because this is all relatively new to her and she thinks the two of you will be a team and your household will be managed together. After some years she may figure out that she's really a tourist (1). Or you may figure out how to stand up to ex and truly actually become a partner with your gf (2).
Option 1 she will disengage and not want to hear anything unnecessary and she will keep her resentful thoughts to herself. Option 2 you will make decisions together, both feeling secure in your partnership and shared worldview.
Thank you for your honesty
Thank you for your honesty and candor You are absolutely correct and my worry for the kids getting effected from the backlash of conflict between my ex and I gets the best of me. I just found this video following reading your post which just about sums up my problem in this situation and in my life in general.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSzjnJ8_1W8
Thank you again!
Wouldn't play for me
Wouldn't play for me (technical) but the title was awesome and the comment trail very positive. Thanks for sharing it here, one day I'll be able to see it.
You're on your way, buddy! Best of luck to you!
Much thanks! Appreciate it
Much thanks! Appreciate it
We have suffered from a
We have suffered from a vengeful ex plus pas'd SD. We received vicous emails with accusations, including her getting 'flying monkeys' to send us emails and threats. She also showed careful extracts from DH's communications with her and framed them in a certain way to look as if they were saying something they were not. She also did this to an 8 year old on the autism spectrum...
Be advised that 'no contact' is the only way to go with these high contflict people. I would not bother with any counselling or therapy, she has quite clearly shown that she is manipulative and toxic. Go to email or text only. Keep all proof and like Rags says 'nail her' in court if you need to.
Keep your fiance away from all her toxic crap. Your fiance made a big mistake in reaching out to your ex in the first place. I am sure she did this with the best will in the world but it always backfires. Never invite the vampire in.
"Never invite the vampire
"Never invite the vampire in." I seriously need this on a T-shirt.
MM nailed it (no pun
MM nailed it (no pun intended). Here's more. . . "Many legends state that in order for a vampire to enter your home he/she must be invited by the human they've come into contact with. Once they have been invited in they are under no obligation to follow human etiquette such as leaving when asked." See!! Once you let them in, they are under no obligation to follow human etiquette. SO, that completely explains why any kind of etiquette is completely thrown by the wayside whenever steps are around. :O Steps invite them in into their hearts and homes, and then viola!, the vamps are under no obligation to follow human etiquette. It is all starting to make sense now!!
Yep, that's exactly what I
Yep, that's exactly what I meant. I always think of Stephen King's Salem's lot. Or is it 'The lost boys' film? Long time ago but I remembered that saying.