We have to deal with this same thing. We pay BM even more than you do per month, but she tells everyone that BF refuses to pay child support. (??) She seriously does, I've had several people bring up the subject to me because they're worried or concerned over what she's said. What can you say to that? We try to explain it in a respectful way without coming out and saying she's lying, but I can't fathom why she'd tell people BF refuses to pay the money when he really does, unless she's spending it on other things and still winds up broke at the end of the month...She told us the other day that she can't finish her Christmas shopping because she's broke. I don't know what bills she has but I know that she has a decent job, plus our child support. I guess I feel sorry for her because if she really IS broke and can't afford these things, that must feel awful.

*~So sayeth Nymh~*

It's sad when they jump to blame the fathers instead of considering tightening their budgets or something. Her expenses and debts are most likely just that...HERS. The child didn't ask for that. Has she looked into debt consolidation programs? I wonder why mothers complain about buying things like school supplies....did they want to have a child and just expect that they wouldn't be responsible for them? That it wouldn't involve sacrifice? I feel that mothers should worry about seeing their kids get what they need before they spend on themselves.

*stepping off soapbox now*

I completely see where you are coming from! That is my confusion with child support…no matter if you have children living with you or not, some bills you will just have PERIOD and I don’t think that custodial parents think of it that way when child support is discussed…For example, gas…no matter how many people are living in my house, I’m going to keep it at a certain temperature in the winter and summer…PERIOD Rent/Mortgage…SAME THING (maybe a variation in bedroom size but honestly, this is the house we liked and we would have bought it regardless!) Electric, Water/Sewer/Trash the more people using it the more the bill goes up…but not that much difference in what you would have to pay W/O another person living in the house (we’ve had family and friends who were in hard times living with us for 6 months and a year at a time and they were GROWN and it didn’t make that much of a difference!) The only thing I can see is Grocery…this is effected by the # of people…but other than that…CLOTHES, SCHOOL SUPPLIES, ETC…these are DIRECT needs of the child and IS what child support is for! Plus, it’s not like they don’t use electricity, water, heat, the roof on the house, etc. when they are here at the non-custodial parents house so what is the deal?! Not to mention EOW schedule is often seen as the “fun zone” so EOW we are going on “outings” and can easily blow through a couple hundred dollars on entertainment…That is why I think that CS is screwy, if she cannot afford to buy clothes and school supplies, then she needs to provide the court with an accounting of the CS money, what did she buy?! Not to mention it is TAX FREE?!

Make a GREAT Day!

My SS's BM didn't ever complain about money to us, she had too much pride. But we've found that that my SD's BM has from time to time, come calling for extra funds... sometimes I wondered if her stories were really true. We often don't have this problem, other than the fact that when we have SS signed up for a sport, BM agrees to pay for half of it... but never does. She never pays anything that is 'extra', but she never asks us for anything either... so, maybe that's the trade off.

In my opinion, I would ignore the extra funds requests, literally. My response to that is... "Oh, I'm sorry to hear that. Yeah, we are having some financial issues too. Sorry, we can't help you." Hang up the phone pronto...

We've been sued in court for more CS once in the five years we've been together and that wasn't so much because she needed more money, it was retaliation for us getting pregnant. Went to court and the amount was actually reduced, but it's still a huge amount and I can tell you for a fact that, minus rent and car payment, our entire family of four lives on less per month than what we send for her two kids in "child support." No, she doesn't ask us for incidentals and refuses to send us copies of doctors' bills, so we haven't had to pay much for the kids' healthcare, either, so I guess for us that is the trade-off. Asking us for money for this, that or the other thing would mean giving us the information about what the kids are involved in and she's so secretive about what's going on with the kids, I guess she'd rather pay for everything herself than give up a little info to us. Besides, I personally believe that there is no such thing as incidentals or extras. CS is the amount of $$$ it costs to raise a child and whatever we pay in CS is supposed to cover our share of everything extra, like sports, activities, etc. Even the judge told us that.

~ Anne ~

I'm venturing into the lions den on this one....but here I go..

I do use some of the CS I recieve for bills....
...this is why...from my point of view...

My x lived in a room in a basement for 3 years..my kids slept on an air mattress on the basement floor when they visited him on weekends.
He couldv'e gotten a small apartment with a pull-out couch or something..the room was his choice..that way he could save money for a house...on his own.

Living like that, was not really an option for me...having full-cusotody & responsibility for the kids. All three of us sleeping in one room ..them on a mattress on the floor of a basement is no way for them to live.
By combining my income & some of the CS I could provide my 1/2 toward acceptable housing for the kids....(in combination with my BF's 1/2)

It's not elaborite.....it's a decent neighbourhood ..with decent schools...crimes not too bad in comparison...its the smallest house in an older neighborhood.....it's a good place for his/my kids...

I honestly don't see why he should resent that.......

I had a car that I liked very much!!!! Payments were low, miliage was good....BUT as the kids got older..it's too small. We travel long distances with bags of sporting gear..& luggage and a dog!! If I didn't have the kids....I wouldn't need a mini-van. It's harder on gas, I travel more...constantly actually..drive me here..drive me there..game here..practice there..to school..to friends..etc.

I wouldn've prefered to keep my car. But because I have full time care of the kids...it wasn't practical..

Dont' get me wrong...most of the CS goes to food, clothes, school related expenses...recreation ie skates, swims, movies...but I don't think it's wrong for a portion of it to help with things like thier own room..or decent transportation which is used for THEIR NEEDS ...

I have to sum up quickly....maybe I'll elaborate more later

I was short $$ for school supply time..also. I had the flu, was very sick and missed 1/2 my income the month it was all needed. I refused to ask him because of the reaction I would get....I refuse to 'beg to him' for anything!! I bought what I could..not all the paper..not all the binders...cut way back on new clothes for school. And just made it up gradually as my pays got back to normal......

Sometimes things come up...that aren't due to financial mismanagement..I don't have sick benefits at my job. I buy much of my own clothing second hand....but I mostly shop for my kids at name brand stores...on sale of course! (my daughters name brand jeans are all second hand...we can get 6 pairs for the price of 1 in the store..so that's all good with us. Free's up money for nice new name brand tops)

I'm not frivolous with money....we don't take vacations..we put most our time AND money into the kids...and when we do something for us...it's not usually expensive. I resent it when my X...insinuates that I AM frivolously and recklously spending CS for my own expenses.

I dye my own hair....(no mishaps yet)... I cut corners for me all the time so I can provide things for my kids....

My BF & I have provided them with a happy stable home..where we give so much of ourselves to them..our lives are stressful..not carefree..we are very busy and devoted to providing for all of their needs. Our money is not free to take trips or travel and do many of the things my X enjoys.....and it just burns me up.

The kids & friends aren't running in out of his house tracking in dirt, the carpet on the stairs...ohhhh. He doesn't need pails & pails of laundry soap...or have to replace broken dishes that the kids drop..or all that other day-to-day stuff...wear & tear.

My daughter flooded our basement 2 years ago...I had to use the money I was saving to replace our roof..to fix the basement..

There is more to it..than just a new shirt and some kraft dinner.

I really do get angry about the insinuations sometimes...because I know what I give up to provide for my kids....

I was typing when you guys were replying.... I'm reacting more to his past insinuations than your own. I also know that hubby's x used CS for getting her nails done, taking vaations to CUBA....while SD used her own money for her own basic needs. Bio-bitch had a free ride....and that's maddening too....

Thank you so much for articulating this perspective. I have never asked my ex for an extra dime either while he has NO responsiblity for his children (his choice) and does whatever he wants with his life. This is not uncommon. I realize that situations may be different with the few hundred people who come to the site of all of the millions who are in step parenting situations worldwide. It is a very different perspective when you are the parent who provides for your children's day to day needs. It does make a big difference. Wherever the child's primary residence is...that is their home. You know as much as the biomom's might be angry, jealous, resentful, insecure....I also see A LOT of that in the stepmom's on this site too. Not uncommom I am sure...I know that I have experienced these things too!

The situations described on this site are by no means the norm, in that biomoms are as described by people here and stepmoms are all loving step parents, primarily concerned and most knowledgable about the needs of their step kids. Of the millions of step parents worldwide, let's be honest that the people who come to this site are a very small number comparatively speaking.

Indeed some people who have provided an evaluation of their BF's life situation with their kids are very new to the situation...how do they get to be the expert so fast when they don't know all of the
dynamics of our BF or husband's past relationships. None of us know what the dynamics really were in their relationships, so let's not pretend that we do.

I am not in anyway demeaning some of the situations that people have experienced describe on this site...some of this is horrible and it is hard to believe that it is allowed to continue. It almost seems as though some people are held captive by ridiculous nonsense. In fact, taken out of context, it would be hard to believe that these are issues that adults are having to do battle over.

Don't you ever just get frustrated reading about negative stuff without any possible, constructive and positive resolutions...just for your own emotional well being. We can't feel all of this negative stuff on an ongoing basis and believe that somehow it doesn't show in other areas of our relationships.

Yes I do agree that some kids can have two homes where they feel equally comfortable, supported and nurtured but I would say that is rare. From the feelings that I hear described in this site, people can't resent the kids with that intensity and still believe that they can provide a stable, loving home for them!

There are a few key issues that seem to be big contentious issues. But all of these issues are there when the new woman meets man and gets serious. We don't see the issues in the same way until the raging hormones settle down and the reality of step parenting settles in. The issues don't change over time...our perspective does.

The raging hormones that I was referring to are those little pheremones that act up when you are first dating. Once they settle down and you see the situation as it really is....WOW...that is a whole lot more difficult to deal with.

You stated that child's primary residence = primary custody which equals to most of the child's time. When I refer to primary residence, I am referring to the child's definition, not a legal, parental or adult definition. Where does the child view their primary residence, where they keep their most important possessions, where they refer to going home, where they feeling like they belong. You can hear their answers in what they say and what they do. Perhaps they belong both places, or one or the other or neither.

Even when we were having so many struggles with my stepson, he once had a discussion with me as to where he would go if something happened to his Dad. (His parents had fought for custody when he was little. The girls were sent with Dad and son was sent with mom...far away. After a few years, when son's behaviour was challenging, mom sent him packing to be with Dad as long as she would have to pay no child support. He agreed. He just wanted to be with his kids.) I stated that he could continue to live with us just as he did then. His home was with us and he would state that. He visited his mom a few times a year.

I feel really sick to think about how the chaos, that was originally about his behaviour, but in reality was about our inability to work together as a couple team, let him down when we bought separate homes. This is some unfinished business that I must talk to him about soon. I want him to know that none of this was really about him.

Just an aside...as our kids have grown...all five of them. It is interesting to see their relationships evolve, regardless of things that have happened with my husband and I or the ex or anything else. Sometimes it just takes the tincture of time, patience and letting go of that facade of control.

I just skimmed briefly..... I hope I choose the correct words, I'm rushed...

I understand exactly what hopeful is saying regarding primary residence being 'home'. Maybe we're splitting hairs on the terminology. The kids school is that neighbourhood, their freinds, the majority of thier 'stuff', thier bed, thier room, thier clothes, thier books, their pictures, thier stereo, thier games, their dog.

The day to day pick-up your stuff, drive me here, basic interaction of living or the daily chit chat about freinds or events at school that day....all the nuances of daily living...are experienced in the 'primary residence'...or thier "living space" they are all the things that make home, home....

I don't think hopeful is saying you don't have those things....in a non-cutodial home......but the amount of time spent at each location..is not the same...I believe that in itself effects things in this regard

Although they are comfortable at their Dad's.....it is not their 'home base' so to speak....they don't attend school from there..their 'normal' routine...of being a kid doesn't happen there... It can't be 'home base' or 'home' because of the time spent at each location.....

In the cases mentioned above where thier 'environments' are in a constant state of flux....by the 'primary residence' constantly moving....that goes to our point exactly. (excuse me for speaking on your behalf...and correct me if I'm wrong).

Where the main, consistant, daily routine, daily grind, day-to-day stuff tends to be what the kids consider home.

Your home is where you live...the amount of 'living' you do, your emotional attachment to your home...comes from the memories..comes from the familiarity...the interactions that occur with-in the walls..etc

What-ever phsycological thing that...causes people to become emotionally attached to thier living space.....happens because of the time spent thier and the security, familiarity, etc...

It's not that non-custodial parents don't provide loving, stable, homes for thier kids....of course they do!!!
They are every bit as capable of providing the same emotional and phsycial care as any one else.......

We too tried to provide a 'home' to my SD when she came to live with us...but I don't think it was ever 'home' in her heart. Dispite our best efforts to make her feel at home....it was not the same....

My experiences as both a custodial & non-custodial parent has lead me to my perspective on this.....

I think it's different for everyone. For me, home was definitely with my mom for all the reasons you mentioned. When we went to our dad's we felt like visitors, even when we "lived" there for 6 weeks straight over the summer. It just wasn't our "home base" like you say.

My SD however is adament that she has two homes, one with mom and one with dad, even though the longest she's ever stayed with us is 48 hours. I think we provide a much more stable loving family environment than her mom does, so she feels very at home with us even though she spends the vast majority of her time with mom.

You make a lot of good points about emotional attachment to and personal belongings in the home. SD has clothes, books, pictures, stereo, games, etc that "live" at dad's, which all take part in making it her home too. I didn't have that growing up. My stuff was at mom's and we had to pack for our visitations with dad.

One time, SD surprised us both when her dad had stayed in the city all week because of his work schedule and he said "Can you imagine not coming home all week?" and she replied "Try two weeks! That's what I have to do all the time!"

Every situation is unique, that's all I'm saying. It's too hard to generalize.

Going back to happy mom's original post.....i had to check twice to make sure i didn't write it myself....you are in the same exact situation as my dh and I, right on down to.....I fricken hate her guts!!!!! I don't know how I'm going to put up w/her shit for 8 more years!right on down to . we even pay the exact amount of support. but i have 9 1/2 more years! i had a money conversation with her and tried to get her to see things in this perspective......lets say you and dad are equally responsible financially for the child....he pays $400 and that represents half of what it takes to care for child, you put up your $400 for a total of $800. what costs $800 every month FOR THE CHILD????? we already pay half for the insurance, we pay half on add med, we keep our own supply of clothes at our home. her answer was...thats not it....he is supposed to pay me what it takes to raise child...blah blah. it was pointless. she makes more money than DH and gets anything at all she wants, but never has money to care for the child. it's sickening! and the child support system allows it. she always says....he didn't mind getting in that bed and making those babies with me, but when i need help...... my answer to her finally was.....ok, you are exactly right, he was equally responsible for making them, then he should have them 50% of the time........her answer......thats fine as long as it doesn't change my child support! i know this sounds ugly, but she was cheating on DH, he caught her, forgave her and even begged her to not leave him! she thought the grass was greener...found out she was wrong.....should have kept her legs closed! sher1068

Ok all custodial parents receiving CHILD SUPPORT who actually spend the money on their KIDS this is not for you, so don't get huffy, keep in mind you are NOT the norm, I know as funny as that seems but MOST Non Custodial parents and even JOINT parental partnerships when WE receive the KIDS they are in too small clothes, in-sufficient clothing (spring clothes in cold weather etc), grades are a joke for school, hair is not CLEAN, TRIMMED or STYLED, shoes are too small. NOW WE my DH and myself because we REFUSE to let OUR kids go around while here with us looking like they are HOMELESS when their MOTHER receives $3,000.00 per month FROM STRAIGHT CHILD SUPPORT (no arreage, no alimony), yes $3,000.00 total for both kids. AND they truly do arrive to us as I mentioned above, so we are PAYING for mom to drive a 2008 car, for mom to have on 400.00 shoes for mom to, let me see in the last 4 weeks and 4 weeks only she has been on 3 airline trips and 1 cruise ALL PLEASURE, but the kids came last weekend without winter coats! So we have to provide for 2 houses because who in their right mind can say YOU DUMB A** B**CH (yes I am mad) cannot afford to get your kids a freaking coat but you just got your CS Check (we are registered with the Attorney General so when the check is mailed and when it is cashed we can see it) IT sure is funny that everytime the CHECKS are cashed MOM has on BRAND NEW stuff and GOES ON trips and the kids look like their DAD is AWOL!!!!! My step kids truly look like kids who not only DONT have a supporting father in their life but like they don't even have a FREAKING MOTHER, and I guess when I think about it, THEY REALLY DON'T HAVE A MOTHER, because what true MOM would do this????

Oh and for all of you who say BIO MOM tells people she doesn't receive CS, we are in the same boat, my DH has actually had shared friends call him and suggest "that he needs to provide for his kids, he should have seen how they came to school today" His friends are SHOCKED when he advises BM gets $3000.00 per month SHE NEEDS TO SPEND THE $$$$$$ ON THEM. The only person who looks like they are recvng THAT MONEY is BIO MOM, NOT THE KIDS!

"Be there for the joy. Be there for the tears. Be there for each other."
(Step-Mom the Movie 1998)