I think 5 is way too young to be hearing things like that .. and I think it's especially rough coming from a stepparent.

I understand your frustration, but I can't even imagine how much those words hurts a 5 year old child.

I kind of winced when I read that but you are right.

Why have the child in a fantasy life thinking that her Mommy loves her so much and wants to see her so bad but all these bad luck things happen and one day she will come swooping in on the unicorn and ride over the rainbow. Not going to happen and you are also teaching a 5yo its Ok to lie.

I agree with something else you said. Many BMs have no problem telling little children their Dads are POS or do not pay CS all the time.

I agree on the lying thing. I dont ever lie for BM. She is a shitty parent. The kids know it... I dont have to say it. They put her on a pedastal bc they want her to be better. They get upset because they want her to be like me, involved and caring. I totally get why you said what you said, I would just try to be more tactful in the future. I say things like... I dont know why your mom said that buddy, but its simply not true. I'm sorry she said that... I wont let her lie to them about things. For instance she tells them that they will get to see her more when she moves or that they will have to choose at 12 where to live (BM here has been on supervised visits on and off, no judge will ever replace these kids out of state to a mother who is often not even allowed to see them). So I tell them its not true. But I dont say things I want to say like "your mother is a crazy violent witch who is horrible... etc etc."

I often say things I shouldnt.For example the other day SS was going on and on about all the new cars and trucks his step dad bought, and I said, bc we were just talking about it, it'd be nice for him to buy you a bed so you dont have to sleep with your little brother any more (hes 10, half bro is 3) I totally shouldnt have said that. But I did. it happens... just stay concious of what you are saying and try to correct things in a more tactful way. I dont like lies, so I do correct them when necessary.

I am a firm believer that kids should be told the truth. At age appropriate times. This was BAD BAD form.

I would have said..."I don't know why she does not show up, maybe you should ask her next time you see her. Now lets go play something fun"

Who in the hell tells a 5 year old something like you told her and then just let her go off to process it by herself?

A 5-year old child shared with her dad that she misses her mom & you took it upon yourself to tell her she isn't wanted???

Why not let her dad decide how this would be handled? You aren't obligated to make excuses or soften the truth, but certainly you are not entitled to take it upon yourself to make a child (who isn't yours), who already feels lonely & sad without her mother, that her parent doesn't want her.

Wanted or not, that doesn't change the fact that a child is going to miss an absent parent.

This isn't about lying or not lying. You're pissed at BM & pissed that the kid misses her.

I guess what matters in all of this is that YOU feel good. :sick:

As the mother of a 6 year old this breaks my heart. How any mother would abondon her child like that baffles me, BUT that is no reason to tell her what a POS her mom is. I know raising someone elses child is hard...there are many days that I would love to divorce my husband and the main reason I stay married is that I don't want another woman to be raising/damaging my child. My son is a wonderful child but he can try my patience and I love him with all my heart.

I'm so with you, Christinen! At first, I let DH deal with the absent BM issues but after 5 years of me raising SD full time, I've become so sick and tired of the countless disappointments from BM. Promising to visit every 6 weeks. Promising to take SD for Christmas, summer, spring break. Then, SD goes for months & years with zero visits, zero calls, zero anything. After that long, I can't even try to make up excuses. Both DH and I believe we shouldn't have to make up excuses for a BM who has no interest in visiting or even asking for custody of her kid. So we don't lie to SD about BM. We tell SD that if BM wants to visit or even take her to live with her, then BM can do that anytime she wants. Of course BM will never do that. Too selfishly busy committing felonies and looking for more men to have more illegitimate kids with.

I agree with most of the others here...you made a big error. My SDs are 16 and 18 and it's hard to imagine telling them that. Even though it's true.

I know you are well meaning but you didn't do sd any favors.

I have almost blurted this out before,.... I'm in a similar situation and feel your pain,... BM even had the nerve to blame the kids dad for why she didn't pick them up last time,.....

The oldest girl is 12 and when she asked why my only response was, "see this is why we confirm plans and put things down in writing to make sure we don't misunderstand people. That's why dad is going to court to have a set schedule for you guys, so this kind of thing happens less often"

The girl already knows the difference between home life at dads and home life at mom's,... She really doesn't need me telling her that her mom is a POS SHIT STIRRER

I'm still with you christinen...It's better to tell the truth. And you're right--it IS about you when you are the one taking on a role your should never have to take for a deadbeat parent. Some people on here think SMs should be Mary Fucking Poppins but that's not reality. It's better to learn the truth sooner than later so the kid doesn't go their whole life believing a freaking lie. That can end up becoming a devastating realization when they are trying to cope with other real life skills as an adult (like work & college) Better to know the truth early on so they can at least start dealing with it.

I can't believe some here actually think this is ok. Kids are smart and can and do figure this stuff out.

Terrible thing to tell a young child their mother doesn't want them, no matter the reasoning.

That has to get top marks for cruelty. How would you feel if someone hurt your biological child like that.

Lying to kids is stupid, I've never agreed with it. My ex husband wanted nothing to do with the kids when I left. Only paid child support twice after I left, both times I forced it through the court. Both times he came round when the kids were at school and thumped me for my trouble. The kids were 2, 6 and 8, I never told them a thing. But I never lied, when he didn't pick them up for agreed access visits and they asked why, I told them I didn't know, he hadn't rung to say why he wasn't coming. That was the truth. I didn't make excuses or pretend he had to work, I just said I didn't know. I would never have been so cruel as to say he doesn't want you. What you did was wrong, and NOT YOUR PLACE, you had no right to say that. You could have continued to tell her father how you would have handled it, till you were blue in the face if you wanted to, but you had no business and no right to tell that child her mother doesn't wNt her. As a grow woman, if someone, especially a step parent told you your mother didn't want you, it would hurt like hell. She's five. Barely past the toddler stage, I'm gob smacked you feel you had the right. You have no idea the damage you have just caused yourself. This will all come back to bite you big time, your going to regret this. That little girl will never forget it, she will come to resent you for it. She will see her mom at some stage and she will tell her you said that and ask if it's true, then you will not only have a resentful child to deal with, but even if it's true, her mother is going to be as angry as hell with you for saying that to her child. You will bring the wrath of BM down on your head.

You have made this all about you, what you think is right, what you feel. Well it's not all about you, there is the emotional well being of a child to consider, and you just kicked that in the guts, then there is HER FATHER, your SO, you just went right over the top of his head, totally disregarded what he thought and what he felt and did it your way. He was trying to protect her from the harsh realities of life because she is only 5, you were just being incredibly arrogant and selfish, you didn't even think about this child, you just wanted to show her her mother was a bitch who didn't want her. The biggest loser in this is ultimately going to be you. Your dh will be angry and even if he gets over it, he's never going to forget it, and even if he says nothing, trust me, he's just seen a side of you he doesn't like, the BM will eventually find out, she's going to hate you and pay you back, and that little girl will grow to resent the hell out of you, and you will of course blame everyone but yourself. I still can't believe you felt it your place to hurt this 5 year old child the way you did. You should be ashamed of yourself, not defending yourself. What you have done is indefensible.

Well said lady face. Very well said.

As are you, as are you.

I can certainly understand your situation. If I were in your shoes, I *might* have done the same. I too believe in telling the truth no matter how much it hurts. However, my wife gave me a book and made me read it and I highly recommend it for you. It's called "How to talk so kids will listen, and how to listen so kids will talk". It opened my eyes a little. One thing I took from it is that before we, as parents, tell our children anything (even the harsh truths), we must first validate what it is that they are feeling. Once we validate their thoughts and their feelings, only then will what we say have any impact. SD5 misses her mother. Okay. What is it about her that she misses? Cuddles? Singing lullabies? From there you can build a connection of trust and create a bond with your SD that would be unique to you and to her.

I am a major proponent of providing the facts to Skids in an age appropriate manner. I think you did the right thing giving her the information but in hindsight a lighter approach to the wording would probably have been a better way to introduce the facts of BM's toxic idiocy to a 5yo.

IMHO of course.

Damn right christinen!! Too many kids are growing up believing they are more important than anyone else and that is setting these kids up for failure! One day they will realize the world does not revolve around them and they won't be able to cope with that realization.

Why oh why does everyone think skids need to be more special and more coddled than bios??

LMAO--If I had a fkng penny for every time I hear: "You CHOSE to take on that role..." I did NOT choose this role people!! You don't know the agreement or the divorce decree or the abandonment of BM or the failed promises....

Oh, and "Certainly the child would prefer her mother...POS or not. That's what pisses you off to the point of being outright hurtful." I truly am glad SD prefers BM because they DO belong together!! Holy shit HOW I WISH SD WAS WITH BM FULL TIME AS PROMISED FROM THE GET-GO!! I ALREADY HAVE 2 BIOS. I don't need someone else's.

Right you ARE!!! I should have never entered a marriage with someone who has children. THANKS FOR THE SUPPORT.

How is this a "support" group when all we have here is a bunch of frumpy grumpy step-parents who want to bash other step-parents who are going through very tough times in their lives/marriages?? If I wanted a lecture on all the problems I have and am dealing with, and why I should have done this and shouldn't have done that----I would have gone to my mom. LMFAO.

Freedom and peace come when you can accept your true feelings instead of making excuses for them and denying them.

Point missed completely, ladyface. Lighten up a bit... I'm not angry. I'm not resentful. My despair disappears quickly once I have a glass of vino in my hand. Am I joking? Am I serious? Lighten up.

But IMHO, I haven't ever experienced amazing support here--only jabs, jeers, and criticism. I have not alluded to saying a thing that would "hurt a young child" on this site.

Pat on the back??? Since you don't know the path I've walked, not the people I have saved/influenced....I personally do not need a pat on the back.

Lighten up...do you really think this virtual world is real?

Do not be surprised when this child hates you.

Really - do not EVER complain about how this child behaves towards you. You asked for it. This was not your place. And if *I* were her other parent? You would be out.

I agree we are here to offer support to one another. However we are not here to support child abuse. This was emotional child abuse. She hurt that child terribly and maliciously. She didn't just blurt it out, she has been taking the tell her the truth approach for a while. That's her style, and I also agree with that. Her husband, the father of this child disagreed with her, he chose to cover for the mother and this made the OP mad, she admits she was mad, even told the husband, BM wouldn't cover for you. Then when she couldn't get him to do it her way, she took it on herself. Tell the truth, absolutely. However the truth is, mummy isn't coming because mummy said this or that, or if mummy didn't say why, then, mummy isn't coming, she didn't say why. END OF STORY. That's all the truth this 5 year old needed to hear.

I understand what you said and why you said it - and I kinda agree with you. Kinda, 'cos I'm thinking she's way too young to be able to process this - however!! Let me tell you a little something we experienced:

When SS and SD were 5 & 6 years old, BM took off. Left to "find herself" 'cos she wasn't happy. She started going out, getting blind rotting drunk and turning up home the next day. She came out of the closet and started dating both men and women. On a Sunday morning when DH would be out cleaning the garden with the kids, she would rock up in a taxi, fall out of it blind drunk, vomit on the lawn and pass out. Then she left and didn't contact anyone for 4 years.

During this time, DH cared for the kids full time and supported them 100% with no help whatsoever from BM. Then when kids were 9 & 10 years old, she came back into their lives with a new lover (a young girl aged about 20). She began picking the kids up every 2nd weekend to spend time with her. SD would call DH the very next night, beggging him to pick them up bc BM and her new lover were fighting. Then BM and her new lover broke up. A year later, she met her current lover and they have been together 2 years.

DH has always supported BM - regardless of her selfish choices in life. He supported her when she returned and was flexible regarding her re-connecting with the kids. All was gold. Then I came along and shit went feral.

SD and BM loathe the fact that DH is in a new relationship and is finally loving his life. They hate that they have no control over what he does or who he sees. SD was the mini-wife and has made our lives hell. BM is full on supporting her.

Now, DH (after 1.5 years), sat the kids down to talk to them. He explained that he was always there for them, even when BM took off. No what? SD didn't want to know. She refuses to listen and yells at DH for "rubishing Mom". Now, DH realises that by covering for BM and making up excuses for her, he was actually protecting HER and not the kids. Kids have her up on a pedestal and it ain't coming down any time soon.

So, DH has thought that maybe, if he'd told the kids the truth from the beginning, he wouldn't have such attitude from SD now. Only time will tell.

Island girl, there is never, never a good time for one parent to bad mouth the other to the kids. Kids don't want to hear it. They work it out in their own time. If your dh covered for their mother that wasn't good, letting them see for themselves though is far different from inventing stories to cover mum. Lies never work in the long term, even if they're told with the best of intentions. Have a look at an earlier post by lady face on this thread. She explains very clearly how to deal with this type of parent, and she got it down perfectly. It didn't involve saying anything bad about the other parent. But it didn't allow for the kids to live in dreamland either. Have a look at what she said. It's not too late for your husband to take this new approach.

DF will miss a weekend with his girls in January because we're going on a cruise for my birthday.

As soon as BM finds out why he missed that weekend, she will tell the girls that their dad didn't show up because celebrating my birthday was more important to him than spending time with them. That will hurt them (6&8) to the core. It will make BM feel great because the girls think their dad hung the moon.

According to some here, telling the girls this truth is just fine. :?

Any adult who thinks it's ok to crush kids with harsh truths in order to make herself feel better is down right sick in the head.

"I felt kind of bad about it". Then why did you say it?? In your heart you know it was so wrong to say that to a small 5 year old child. No excuses. None.

Although I am all for the skids being told the truth (as in court papers etc, because one person's "truth" can be a complete lie based on faulty perceptions), I strongly feel that she was too young for this AND that her own bio should be telling her any truth associated with her BM that may be considered negative.

Anything else is playing with fire - especially for a SM to do stuff like this.

I think this is going to backfire big time on you. Your sd will not grow to hate bm and appreciate you-she will simply resent you for talking bad about her mom.

IMO, you were wrong. You do NOT know why her mom did not pick her up. You can think you do, you can have an opinion-but unless you ARE her-you just don't know. The best response is, if she asks, to say as someone else suggested, "I don't know why she didn't pick you up".

And you can think all you want that she doesn't see you as angry stepparent and it doesn't matter if you've been taking care of her for months. Seriously. BM will ALWAYS be her mother, they have a bond that began while the child was in the womb that you cannot overtake simply because you have been providing the majority of the care the last few months. Trust me, been there done that. It matters not if you are super stepmom, the best person in the world-you are still not her mom and never will be barring a termination of her parental rights and you adopting her. Again it does not matter if you take care of her more, nor does it matter how many times bm has visited with her. Her mother is an important person to her and likely always will be no matter what-what you said was hurtful and unkind to her and it did not need to be said. You may see bm as unimportant in her life, you may think she plays a very small role, and that she is a crappy bm-but I guarantee you that is not how that child sees it and you telling her she doesn't want to see her is NOT going to change how that child feels about her own mother-but it is very likely that it will change how she feels about YOU.

Amber, she referred to the child as something, SOME THING, she had to put up with because she was married to her father.

And she does say in her original post that she AND dh are the ones who do all the caring of the child. She's not complaining her dh has dumped all the load on her, she's just complaining because she has to put up with that THING because she's married to her father. She has even predicted that this THING will just grow up to be trash like her mother. This isn't about frustration of the workload, this is because she is an immature jealous. selfish young woman who wants this child out of not only her life but her fathers life as well. She has also stated that she wishes BM would take her. She has made it clear she does not want this child and she feels quite justified in those feelings.

If this were a moment of frustration as you suggest, she would not be defending what she said so aggressively. She wasn't frustrated, she was mad as hell because she was stuck with that thing and she didn't want her.

If her husband is stupid enough to have another child with this woman can you imagine the life this 5 year old is going to have. She hates this THING but she doesn't want to give up her husband. All I can say is this woman has some seriously bad karma coming, not just because of what she said, but because she is self righteously justifying if, will not accept that she did anything wrong, and because you can rest assured if she is capable of telling a 5 year old your mother doesn't want you, what else is she doing and saying to that child.

This child is well aware this woman hates her, she may not have the vocabulary to express that, she may not understand that, but this child feels the hate. The op doesn't think she's emotionally abusing the child, but she thinks it's okay to refer to her as a thing. To mention in the same sentence, she is something I have to put up with because I married her father, just like I have a dog, my dh doesn't like dogs but he has to put up with it. That says it all. This was not said in frustration, it was said in hate.

My heart is breaking for that little girl and any kids they may end up having.

My ExH used to leave my sons flat all the time. Dressed and waiting for him. I NEVER once told my boys that their dad didn't want to see them. That would have crushed their spirit. I would say "I'm sorry Daddy didn't make it, maybe he had to work. Or maybe his car broke down." i NEVER EVER said those hurtful, cruel words to my boys. You are forgetting that that child will grow and will be able to come to her own conclusions about her mom. You didn't need to go there. It was vicious and it is that type of behavior that gives us stepmoms a bad name. If she was a TEENAGER, maybe I'd say otherwise. But FIVE? That is wack.

what a terrible thing to say. Absolutely disgusting.

Ok I am kind of mixed on this. I too was a BIG part of raising my two SDs with DH. My DH saw me as an equal and their mother hardly came around for the first few years. When she did come around she would ONLY pick up oldest SD and leave SD7 behind. One day, I will never forget this day, SD (7 at the time) asked me why her mom only picks up her big sister and not her and she was crying. I was NOT going to lie to this child, I told her what BM told me, that she thinks older SD needs her more and not younger SD. (this woman only came to pick up her oldest child ONE day ever two weeks!). I then put my arm around young SD because she leaned into me and we hugged. I then took her to a park and to a movie and out to eat. I told her I would be there as long as she wanted me to, not to replace her mom but to be the woman figure she needed. She shortly after that started calling me Mom in secret. I didn't mind, I let her. Why deprive this child with lies and let her go to bed at night missing mom anymore. Just telling this story makes me miss her as her and I are disengaged due to other issues but anyways, I don't see anything wrong with you telling her the truth but did you follow up with a nice conversation about it or did you just let her walk to her room like that? If you did, I would definitely sit her down and talk to her, let her tell her feelings. She is hurting really bad. I know people say to stay out of it, its not your daughter BUT I tend to see differently. As long as your DH is ok with you being an equal then be one. My heart was too big not to get involved. My DH and his Ex would not speak and if they did they would fight and the girls would cry. When I started to talk to BM instead, they slowly became more happy. Anyways its hard being a step parent. You never win. I did be part mom in my SDs life. I mean how could I not, we had them full time except when BM decided it was convenient to take them. I did their laundry, cleaned, did their school stuff with them, tucked them in, took them shopping..etc. Anyways its hard to just stay out of it when you are faced with full time step children who need a positive woman role model in their lives.

I give up. You did not say your mum doesn't
Take you because she doesn't want you. Never on your posts have you referred to your Sd as someTHING that you had to put up with because you married her dad. Never did you compare her to a dog. Never did you
say you wished her BM would just take her. This poster refers to the BM as trash, and she
Wants this piece of trash to take this child. That shows her feelings towards this child right there. She also says this 5 year old will grow up to be trash just like her mother. Do you still think your stories are similar. Do you think
What you said is equal to telling a child YOUR MOTHER DOESNT WANT YOU. I don't think so.

She proudly says this little girl didn't say a word, didn't she'd a tear, just turned and walked away into another room. Poor kid must have been in total shock. The next contact according to OP was later as they were all cutting pumpkins together and according to her that was all good. There was no hugs, let's go play ball,or go to the park whatever, just flat out slap in the face your mother doesn't want you. Then the child was left to deal with that.

I went through this with my kids' Dad over the years. Did I make shit up? No. Did I tell my kids the hard truth? No. I told them what others have suggested - "I don't know why Dad couldn't make it", "you could ask Dad", "I'm sure he has a reason". And then "So how should we spend this surprise time together???"

They eventually figured it out. My oldest (21) talks to the ex maybe twice a year. My youngest (19) hasn't spoken to him in four years. He's tried to blame it on me, but that doesn't fly. Sorry. He's done it all himself.

I didn't read all 230 responses, so chances are this has been said.

It is neither your "right" nor "responsibility" to tell this child that her mother doesn't want to see her. And this is coming from someone that is a completely involved SM and a total advocate of a "step" parent is a PARENT. There are a million things that I would LOVE to tell SS. A MILLION. Every time he asks for a baby brother I just want to scream "you would have 4 of them by now if your mom hadn't aborted them all". And every time she doesn't show up to his games and he asks ME where she is, I really want to tell him "she spent her gas money on pot". But I don't. I simply tell him "I dunno buddy, you will have to ask her next time you see her". And he is TEN, not FIVE!!!!

I get being the one that is there for the step kids. I understand POS BM's, I deal with one, day in and day out. I TOTALLY GET IT. BUT... my SS will catch on as he gets older. He is starting to understand who is there for him and who isn't. And in the end, he won't resent ME for talking poorly about his mom. He will resent his mom for not being there, and when she IS there, she talk poorly about us. She won't come out on top because she doesn't have what it takes to be a good parent. And SS is learning that... all on his own.

Do you think I want to hear him ask every single weekend where his mom is? NOOOOO, I would rather stick ice picks in my ears. But I just put my arm around him, tell him that I love him and let him know "your mom says she doesn't have the gas money today". Or, "your mom says she isn't feeling well". SS rolls his eyes and takes off.

I think it was completely out of line for you to have done this. But the mistake is already made. I really hope it doesn't bite you in the ass in the end.

Good luck.

I think that you are at a point where discretion is the better part of valor. IMHO what you said was fine, how you said it could be sugar coated a bit to taylor it to a 5yo. Something along the lines of "I am so sorry your mom does not make the effort to spend time with you but your dad and I like spending time with you. Let's go get an icecream. How about that?"

As he gets older give him more facts and information so that he can be protected as much as possible from BMs toxic crap. We kept multiple drawers in our file cabinet of well organized, well labeled files and folders of Custody/Visitation/Support/Marrige Records/Divorce Records/Arrest&Criminal Records/Income and Tax information/Court Reporter Minutes, etc..... on the SpermIdiot and the SpermClan and the Skid could research to his hearts content and ask all the questions he wanted. His mom and I answered factually and would show him the fact confirming documents.

At 5 we kept it light. As he got older he got the full meal deal on his toxic SpermIdiot and the SpermClan. In to his mid teens he started engaging to research any BS that the SpermClan spouted that did not pass his smell test and there were many occassions when he called them on manipulation and crap during following visitations.

Coddling does not help these kids. Loving and supporting them in life including countering the toxic crap of the blended family opposition is what helps them.

Most of us would love to enforce accountability on the toxic opposition and we would love to have them actually step up and deliver on their responsibilities including sticking to the schedules in the CO. In our case we got to where we would schedule vacations during SpermClan visitation because we got sick of eternally postponing them until SS could be with us since the SpermClan would rarely work with us to coordinate visitation and our vacations so SS could be with us. If we enjoyed it we would do it again some other time with SS. We also called the crap directly with the SpermClan when they would weasle out of visitations and we would make them tell SS on speaker phone so we could prevent them from lying to him. None of the the car broke down, or grandpa is sick, or ..... Just fact and if they lied we called them on it on the phone with the kid listening. They could avoid the pain by telling the truth. We were there to hug the kid and hold him through his anger and tears.

IMHO of course.

That was, just mean. She is only 5. Wow just wow.

What she said was absolutely not fine. It was cruel, vindictive, selfish and not her place. Nothing fine about it.

I too justastepmom felt desperately sorry for that child. She appeared to have been totally stunned and went into shock after this cruel blow was delivered. I cannot believe anyone could be so cruel. It was heartless, cold, calculated and vindictive. She took her spite out on an innocent child. She had told her husband several times he needed to load both barrels and pump them into that child by saying this to her. He didn't want to do that, so he lied to the child. Neither the op or the child's father had enough of a brain between them to just tell the truth, which was either, mummy said she wasn't coming because......whatever mum said. Or, we do know why mummy hasn't come, we haven't heard from her. Dad didn't have to make up stories, and this woman had no place, no right and no heart to do what she did. She was mad as hell because her husband was defending his ex, making up stories about her to protect the child, but at the same time protecting his ex, and op wasn't having it anymore. Her hatred for the ex, and her jealousy because her dh was protecting her by making up excuses caused her to dump her frustration on this baby. She wasn't being honest or telling the child the truth for the child's sake. She was mad as hell and hit out at this child because her dh wouldn't do things her way.