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O/T: Want to address something with boss but not sure how

Evil4's picture

I have had a long-standing problem in my damn workplace with Bully Boss (BB) letting me know on a daily basis that I'm far less-than the others in my role. BB got in trouble and was supposedly at the penultimate stage of getting canned, but as I called it, Head Hauncho is yet again, madly in love with BB and BB is not going anywhere. HH redeployed me and two others to report to other people. In his brilliance he put two of us under New Guy, but NG reports to BB, so a lot of damn good that does. Not sure if this has anything to do with the pattern continuing no matter how hard I try. I've been a civil servant for 32 years, but apparently that means nothing and I'm worthless and totally incompetent. I get it. Children with less than a year in who shouldn't even qualify for the competitions for promotions are winning them right, left and center and here I am. Same spot for over 12 years because apparently I'm less-than. NG is part of the male clique that travels together. If one gets a promotion in another area, they bring their buddies with them and create crooked competitions and low and behold the clique members win. Well, NG was one of them but he claims he's seen the light since he's reporting to BB rather than his equal. He claims he's been scarred from having the report to BB over the last year. 

Well, I've been reporting to NG for over a year and I'm still very raw. I realized that the reason I'm still very raw is because the pattern continues. I still feel like I'm way less-than and I can't stand it. Although very competent and nice, I resent Baby Colleague so much. He's perfect and I'm no where near his level. OK, I get it. I fuckin' get that every damn day. I'm also far beneath Pretty Little Colleague, another baby with a year in, and I can't help but resent her too. Yes, I know it sounds petty and I know it's a me problem, but that job is killing me. I keep trying for competitions outside of my area and still haven't succeeded. It's getting to me.

Well, last week, NG said something that I felt was uncalled for. He's one of those who obsessively edits work to prove his two PhDs. Yes, I get it. You're sooooooooo fucking educated and I'm just a lowly undergrad. Whatever. Asshole. So, management wants to know what they can do to make changes because our survey results showed how unhappy we are. I said how I NEVER hear of anything good I do and only that my work gets ripped apart. Am I really THAT incompetent or is my 31 years really that worthless? I said that to make a point. Well NG starts groveling to me after that meeting but does he change? No? I'm on a fourth draft of something because apparently I can't write. Whatever. I don't even try anymore. I feel like telling him to write the damn crap himself since he keeps changing what he wants. So, out of the blue while we were going over something I wrote together, he tells me how Baby Colleague's issues that he's working on require so much more analysis than mine do. Well, what the fuck was the point in telling me that? I get it. I'm less-than. I can't get that drummed into my any more than it already is.

I have a meeting with just NG later in the week and I want to address his announcing to me about my child colleague's issues requiring so much more analysis than mine do, but I'm not sure how. DH isn't good to ask because his advice is to tell me to tell them to F.O. Yeah, that'll be mature and go over really well. DH says make sure that I don't tell them how hurt I am, but to tell him I'm super pissed off and sick of it.

Anyone got any advice on what I should say? I'm really tired of it. I'm literally physically exhausted and constantly on the verge of tears. I'm walking around in a constant state of humilation and resentment. I want it to end. They actually wonder why I'm so pissed off and sad all the time. They don't seem to have a clue of what it's like to be reminded constantly of how much lower I am than the rest. They don't seem to get their role in how I feel. Yes, I know that I shouldn't let them get to me, but day in and day out, it gets hard to live with that message 12 times a day.

I need to figure out a way of addressing it without blowing my damn stack and getting fired. Knowing NG he'll probably hold it against me and throw it up in my face at some point, but the way things are going now just isn't working for me either, so I might as well address it and give NG hell. 

Comments

Cover1W's picture

Hi, I am so sorry, work stress is very difficult!  Here's my advice as a manager:

* Document document document. In writing if possible. Gather and organize, in order, newest on top, what incidents you have. Maybe go back a couple months or more if it's do-able. (request/what you did - including examples/response of manager/your followup/response/outcome). Spreadsheet it or table of contents it and page number it for quick reference.

* If you have a meeting or offline discussion with anyone who gives you grief, take notes every time. Date it, note who you spoke with and who was in attendance if others were there. Write up your notes afterwards into a cohesive outline. Keep your feelings out of it and document the facts. Put these too in order of most recent on top. I use OneDrive for this and it works great.

* If you've reported things to HR, document that again, in detail, with examples. Same as above.

Then you can schedule a meeting or have your documentation ready to go. You likely won't have time to do a very thorough one before the end of the week but you could have a couple solid examples of the issue.

Ask them to give you specific, really specific, examples of what is going wrong, and what exactly they want you to do. Platitudes, complaining about your "work" is not legit. They should be able to give you a list of specifics, period. If they are not speciific enough ask for more specifics or clarification. I'm betting they will not want to do this.

I hope you are looking for a new position!  I think you are but don't give up!

MorningMia's picture

This, this, and this! Also, don't cave to them by acting sad or defeated at work. ACT. And, yes, keep looking. Don't give up. 

Evil4's picture

Thank you for your advice as a manager. 

I have been asking for specifics but my manager changes his mind on what he wants. I feel like I can't gain traction because I'll give him what he says he wants but then he changes it. I've accepted that I will NEVER be able to submit anything decent with these people. They sure love Baby Colleague though.

My soul is destroyed. I've been trying to get the hell out. I even look at lateral competitions and I can't even win those. I keep trying though. 

And yeah. I'm totally defeated. I've given up. I feel nauseas all the time and my migraines are worse. 

Cover1W's picture

All the more reasonn to document!  especially if they keep moving the goalposts. Document that. If you've met the latest specific requirements and the change them on you, then you for sure need to create a record of that.

As for lateral moves, are you looking in the same industry/area? Or even outside? I did a huge career change years ago, understanding how my skills were transeferable. Hopefully you may be able to analyze your own skills and position yourself to find something. 

Evil4's picture

I'm open to totally changing my career but I'm not budging on who I work for. I'm going for my full pension and I have just over 5 years to go. 

I have changed my career before, so it wouldn't be my first rodeo. Most of the competitons posted are in the same industry, so it's hard. I do want to change because I have worked with these bozos in a previous job. Several years ago, I had a dud of a manager who would literally disassociate whenever I tried to meet with him. I wasn't developing under him because he was in la-la land. I heard of a posting at my previous job and had to apply quickly because the closing date was that day. Well, I passed the written test and was invited to the interview stage but realized I had not done my stealth move in finding out who is already there and to whom I'd be reporting to. I found out it would be BB and I noped right out of that and withdrew from the competition so I could stay away from him. I had already had experience with him when I had previously worked in that place. Well, several weeks later, a new head hauncho came on board and she brought four people with her including BB. She punted La-La Land to make room for BB and told me in a very excited tone how I'd be reporting to BB. People who know me can't believe the perfect storm happened and that I withdrew from a competition to get away from someone only to end up with him anyway. I want to prevent that from happening again because NG changes jobs every three years whether he needs to or not. He's worked in so many offices in the industry and I want to make sure I don't end up with him again. So, to make a long story short, I think it would be better to competely switch industries to make sure I can get away from these jerks and never have to come across them again. I have five years left, so if I don't change, there is a risk that I'd work my tail off to move on only to have them show up at my new job. It won't be just one either. Whoever comes on board will bring the rest of them. They are quite blatant in being crooked about filling positions. They've been getting away with it for years. 

Cover1W's picture

I am so sorry, this is a terrible work enviornment. I HOPE that they don't to that early termination on you right before you qualify for pension!  And understand why you don't want to completely change it up and lose that benefit. 5 years is a while though. I still recommend documenting and backing up information for your own benefit, just in case. And if you know you can't fight them (been there done that too), keep your head down, don't question them and make them "forget" about you...?  It's a crappy thing to recommend but it's a plan!

Evil4's picture

I was contemplating putting on an act where I don't see anything and am totally not bothered by anything. I'm going to make sure I fly under the radar and keep myself invisible. I'll speak only when spoken to and only about work to ask clarifying questions to make it look like I'm engaged and care about my work. It'll make me look like I care about their "ffeedback" as toxic as it is. I'm thinking of not saying a word to NG (about something shitty he said) during our meeting later in the week. There's no point. He'll just double down. 

Just a few minutes ago, I got an email that I got screened into a competition for a promotion. I have only one live competition right now, but all I need is one win to move on. 

Rumplestiltskin's picture

My dad once have me some good advice. He said that after a few years it will become clear whether or not you are the "golden boy" at your job, and if you want to advance and you aren't the gb the only way is to change jobs. If that isn't possible, what i would do is my job, no more and no less. Calmly ask for feedback and act on it as many times as it takes and keep collecting the paycheck until you retire or find a better option. 

ESMOD's picture

I agree with your Dad's advice.  Sometimes the only solution is to leave your position.. and sometimes even your company.   Whether it is fair or not.. we can become labeled and it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy.. and it appears that you don't have much "employee capital".. and it will be extremely difficult to turn the ship around after so many years there.  If you are close enough to retirement and the position pays enough.. and you have a pension or some other good reason to stay.. then you may just need to figure out how to do what they ask.. don't take revisions personally and collect your checks until you are ready to leave.  If you have a lot of years left you plan on working.. you probably will need to leave and find another job.. outside your organization.. 

I don't think you will get any traction trying to tell NG what he is doing wrong.  HR is there to protect them... not you.. they will only protect you.. if it means protecting the company/organization from litigation.. (llike Rags' hostile situation that was opening them up to a lawsuit)... 

You can also try to work more closely with the golden children.. maybe by association your standing could increase.. and perhaps they do have some skills they could share .. like the younger guy I work with who helps me with more complex Excel stuff when I need it?  I have learned lots "on the job".. but he has used these things more recently as an engineer.. and more recentlly in school.. not that he is better or smarter.. but he knows some things I don't.. but I know some things he doesn't too..

Rumplestiltskin's picture

Came back to add i just gave notice at my job. There were safety issues that were just part of the normal job that i didn't want to deal with anymore. Plus i could tell that the company valued and promoted people on qualities i don't possess and are impossible to acquire. But i get the feeling of being stuck. I wasn't looking but an opportunity finally presented itself. 

Rags's picture

I get it.  I was a Sr. Manager at my first employer out of my BS.  It took me 6  years to garner that promotion though I had several prior.  I was matrixed to a Director who very much resembles BB.  He had a minion who was his power point Ranger.  He was the golden haired boy for the Sr. Exec who ran operations in that city.

He had a bad Napoleon complex. Little, domineering, etc...  He ended up promoting very young inexperienced people into Sr. roles as he ran off the experienced high performers.  One was a young woman who he would entertain in his hotel room on business trips. I was on several trips with them and watched her do the walk of shame out of his room in the AM as the team started to head down for breakfast.  I eventually got into a contentious position with the director I was matrixed to.  I had to get HR involved. He had already run off a solid HR generalist so HR assigned a rock star who was a lesbian thinking that he would town his crap down.  He had a habit of ridiculing people in his every AM staff mtg.  I was at work late one day and watched him go into the conference room and set the clock ahead. He left. I corrected the clock before I left that evening.

He had used that trick several times.  I filed a hostile work environment complaint with HR.  Told them to please have an HR generalist outside of the conference room every AM.  The next AM I left my office for the staff meeting. He walked out of his  office a few steps ahead of me. I walked into the room a half a second behind him. He turned to me, told me to leave  pointed at the clock and said "You are late." I replied not according to the clock on the wall, he went pale, looked at the clock which was correct.. Then I looked at mey watch, told him that I was actually 2mins early according to the atomic clock website I set my watch to every AM before his meeting.  He then started grilling everyone in the room one after the other about not doing what he had instructed all of us to do. He had demanded that his whole Sr. staff team fill out the project application for the CEOs award.  There could only be one application per project open at a time so we all had spent time the day before sitting around a screen while one person typed. After far too long I stood up, announced that I had other priorities, my peer also stood up and we left with everyone but the one logged in following us.

After he backed off on the being late bullshit he went around the room hammering each person one after the other. Standard practice for this guy.  People would carpet scope staring at the floor trying to avoid his wrath. I was sitting to his Left.  He went around the table then landed on me last started ripping me a new asshole for disobeying him. I pushed back, he started yelling about what my boss would say if he called my boss. So I said lets find out and hit redial on the speaker phone in the conference room.  I had called my boss's desk just after correcting the conference room clock the evening before.  I had spoken to my boss early that AM telling him that he would likely get a call from the asshole.  When I had filed the hostile work environment complaint with HR he and his boss and I had a meeting. They were fully in the loop and told me that they would have my back.

When I dialed the speaker phone from the CR in front of everyone the little man syndrome Director stood up smashed  his fist down on the top of the phone and lost his shit. I leaned back, opened the CR door and asked the HR rep to enter the room. She had heard it all.  She asked everyone to leave the room except for she and the director.

Not long after that I got a call from HR and corporate security. They were investigating complaints about him having inappropriate relationships with young women. He and his wife just had invitro twins. One of the young women he was banging on business trips would watch their kids occasionally.  He promoted her to a Sr role that she had zero clue how to do.

Not long after that he was transferred to lead another division.  A former boss of mine was on that team.  She called me before he was transferred to ask me about little man.   I gave her the full meal deal info.  She called me just after he showed up, called the whole team into a conference room introduced himself telling that he knew they knew who he was, he did not give a crap if they liked him or not, and if they crossed him he would destroy their careers.

I got RIFd a few months after that.  So much for my boss and his boss having my back.

My phone rang a few months after that. Little man/Napoleon complex and his minion were fired. Little man was escorted out by the Federal Marshals.  He had started a consulting firm in his wife's name, signed contracts with that firm, and then used company employees during work hours to do work for his consulting firm.

Both of them were terminated and told not to use the company as a reference or include their time with the company on their resumes. 

I did the right thing and reported the crap. It cost me the first phase of my career.  I had been with that company for 8 years.  Though I am glad that I did the right thing.

Evil4's picture

It's funny that you mention Napoleon. Both BB and NG are short and it is said that they have Napoleonic Syndrome. In my experience men with Short-Man Syndrome are usually narcissists. They find ways to keep people down and even destroy them. 

Rags's picture

Find a pit bull labor lawyer and go for blood.  Hostile work environment suits scare the crap of many employers.    I have been involved in a few of those suits over the years.  Though not as the plaintiff.

Those cases were not nearly as strong as yours would likely be.  

I did not do due diligence when accepting a role 3 years ago.  That company has had a number of labor law related cases over the years I was there, as well as prior and after my tenure with them.  A quick google search would have identified a number of active and settled cases if I had done that search before taking the tole. I was with them for 2 years and while in that role there were 3 cases that I had to deal with that were either active cases when took the role or where  they moved people who were actively suing the company from other sites to mine.  Those were nightmares to deal with.

You should be able to find an attorney to take your case on contingency and drive for a settlement.  Companies do not like taking these types of cases to court in my experience.  So work the HR support path, get an attorney, and keep looking for your next role.   I have never sued an employer though I should have sued the employer that had the several labor cases against them.  That was likely a strong endocomplement and hostile work environment situation.

My philosophy is that if you are suing them and no longer working for them, you are not suing your employer and can answer that question with as strong no if it ever arises. You are suing a former employer. Two very different things.

In my legal layman's opinion of course.

Take care of you and find a peaceful place to land.  For me that has made all of the difference during transitions.

 

Harry's picture

To stop playing around with you or you will sue them. Public sector doesn't like being sued.