Follow up to I texted BM
DH and I are meeting with a family law attorney today. His goal is to have the nightly phone call order modified in some way so that the kids don't have to make a phone call EVERY SINGLE NIGHT as that has become a huge issue (see my first post about what started all of this). If the boys haven't called her by 7:30ish she texts DH over and over until they do. I know that I shouldn't have texted her but I am just fed up with the harrassment of my entire family!!
Anyway, I am hoping that after we show the attorney all of the nightly texts to DH (and daily to SS11 on his phone when he had it) they will say we have a case to get this modified. Any advice you can give me on how we should approach this? I am hoping it's not a waste of our time but it's the only way we see a light at the end of the tunnel. A dim light, but a light none the less lol! DH is also going to ask about have the court order them to use the Family Wizard app that so many of you have mentioned. Fingers crossed on that one!
The court is not likely to
The court is not likely to see daily contact with a bio parent as unreasonable. Your husband needs a plan as to how this can be accomplished.
I think using family wizard for communication between the EX and your DH is a good idea.
BUT.. going to court and saying "we want to change the CO because we aren't following it" Not sure that will fly favorably.
I mean, honestly, wouldn't the cost of a simple prepaid tracfone for these calls with BM be much LESS than going to court and atty fees etc?
If SS is 11.. he is getting to the age where a phone will become more logistically necessary anyway. Get him a cheap tracphone to be kept at your house to be used for these nightly calls and call it a day. Shoot... make it SS's responsibility to CALL MOM and then there is a record for court that an attempt was made so she can't claim she isn't getting the calls
If you read my post from last
If you read my post from last week SS11 DID have a cell phone and BM used it to abuse and harrass the boys on a daily basis. If it got past 7:30 at night she was texting him over and over until they called her and then would call a few more times during the night asking what all of us were doing... It is a very toxic situation. I'm not sure how we haven't been following the CO? The kids have called her every single night between the hours of 6 and 9. I just don't think she should be able to text and call bitching about them calling. It is unnecessary and ridiculous.
You could have them make the
You could have them make the "one call" during that time period and keep the phone off before and after that.
Getting communication moved to family wizard will hopefully help with your husband's issues. But, your husband will still be likely to have to facilitate the calls with BM.
Shutting off the phone when it isn't between 6 and 9... an adult keeping the phone so these "texts that are abusive" can be kept from the kids is also ok in my mind.
Do you have screen shots, or
Do you have screen shots, or the actual texts, of BM's harassment of the boys? Because that is seriously ridiculous.
Yes we do. Before DH sent SS
Yes we do. Before DH sent SS's cell phone back to BM he took screen shots of her daily texts harassing them. There were also more than a few texts where she texts SS11 saying "Please show this text to SS9 as it's for him. I love you my baby boy and I hate being without you. I can't wait to have you back in my arms" He took screen shots of those as well as they come off very creepy...
I think complicating this
Is that apparently your DH is not home a lot of these evenings, and given that, a lot of people would think the mom calling them is not intruding on dads time
DH only works late nights
DH only works late nights MAYBE two or three times a month... it's not a common thing at all.
I would see to it that the
I would see to it that the ONLY nightly calls are made using FACE TIME only and done in the living room....with you and DH in the room......I bet they would stop. I would enjoy that...........
As to family court.......I really do think you have a case to at least try for it....BM is causing an issue during DH's parenting time....but because the kid is 11 and because he has his own phone.....it may be harder to win. I recently discussed this with my attorney b/c my ex is trying to modify all sorts of stuff and put in there like.........the other parent can call ONLY between 6pm-7pm and only once....but the kids can call whenever...( I don't think he put it in there, but it was just standard for his attorney).......I simply had it removed b/c it was bonkers........my kids are 12,14, and 17 all with their own phones...........I will call them as I see fit and my EX should be able to call them whenever he wants....b/c they aren't young children......one has a car...they play sports...have tons of school stuff......so it's not reasonable for me to be able to NOT call them when I want...and same for EX.
Highly unlikely
that a judge would mandate that DH and you get ot monitor calls.
Does not suprise me when people here suggest actions which would be viewed as parental alienation if a BM demanded it.
If they want to monitor calls
If they want to monitor calls because BM is saying inappropriate things, then it's not alienation. If they want to monitor calls to be controlling and make sure the kids don't say anything they don't like, then it is alienation.
Oh I certainly didn't mean
Oh I certainly didn't mean that a judge would mandate it....or that it should even be brought. up to anyone outside OPs home.
Just that OP and her DH can have the skids call BM from the living room or any other shared space, via facetime. I think after a few times....BM wouldn't feel the need to get the calls every.single.day.......because she will know that others may be listening to her BS.....that's how you get these crazies to stop.
And that was sort of tongue in cheek, like a big F-U BM....we are ALL listening. lol
STaround I would normally
STaround I would normally agree but the fact that she is emotionally abusing her own children and making them cry on a regular basis when she talks to them... wouldn't that warrant a monitored phone call?
Is she saying that she misses
Is she saying that she misses them.. and that is why they are crying? or is she saying abusive things to them.. calling them pieces of crap or something like that.
It sounds like she is maybe trying to make them feel bad for not being with her.. but I think the kids are old enough to understand that both their parents deserve time with them.
When DH heard SS9 bawling his
When DH heard SS9 bawling his eyes out the last time and he asked him what was going on SS said that his mom thought they didn't call her (they had and even left a voicemail) and she was screaming at him that he must not even love her or ever want to come to her house or see her again. We only heard his side of the conversation through a closed door which was him saying over and over "I do love you mom I swear. I want to come to your house. I promise I love you" It's all so messed up in my eyes. As a mother it's very hard for me to see these kids go through this.
I'm telling you that this
I'm telling you that this happened to SD12 2 years ago..........she has not slept at our house ONE time since the incident. BM was dropping her off one night to sleep over (like she had been doing for the past year without any issues). SD12 came in crying...........it happened to be Christmas Eve and BM had been sitting in her car with SD before SD came in the house...saying how sad she was to be leaving her on Christmas...BM was crying...saying how much she will miss her and how lonely she will be with out her.........needless to say....DH drove SD back to BM's later that night....and that was all it took for SD to NEVER stay the night again in fear poor old mommy may be lonely.
It's the manner and content
It's the manner and content of all the calls/texts BM makes that gives your DH a chance. Not just the number of evenings but the hours of window to do so. A 3hr window is ridiculous . Also the length of calls, whether nightly or only several a week. Ten minutes a kid is sufficient ..
Ten minutes per child AND
Ten minutes per child AND only one call each per evening.
I think you are on the right
I think you are on the right path honestly, Sometimes you have to cut these crazy toxic women at the knees. I think for your peace of mind get it modified for the duration. Print every bit of evidence. Between now and court date let her accumulate more bs for you to present kwim?
Sure, getting a track phone is cheaper-but the damage done to the kids is what needs to be modified. I think the better idea might be ONLY calling a landline-unable to text. Only ONE call and a MUCH smaller window. With a caveat that says if your family is busy with something else during that time, sports, dinner, etc then it will be done the next day or present an alternate hour. Also put in verbiage for her to stop saying these kind of alienating things to the kids.
OP, why not just have the
OP, why not just have the kids call her right at 6 and be done with this nonsense? I don't disagree you should try to change it, but she will just find another way to be disruptive.
Get a TracFone and turn off
Get a TracFone and turn off the texting.
https://www.techwalla.com/articles/how-to-get-service-disabled-off-of-yo...
Think out of the box...
First there is no law anywhere that says that any US citizen must answer phones, read text messages, read email ect. Take back your personal rights.
If I am correct, your court order reflects Mom MUST? have access to kids daily via telephone? Does the court order really say KIDS MUST or MOM must have or will have daily telephone contact? OR does it use word 'may' call or will have reasonable contact.
What specifically does the current court order say...word for word about daily calls.
Thank God we never started that cell phone game. To this day we would not either. Sure we have private cells but we don't hand out our numbers. They are our person property...do you see where I am going with this?
Your DH can turn this around by securing a land line at home, you know a phone with buttons and a plug in the wall? Runs about 40.00 a month. Block bm from all private cell phones and give her the land line number. Or better yet you and dh give UP current cell phone number and get new cell phone numbers. Do yourself a favor and do not set up voice mail either. Saves all the stupid calls. I know this from my own experience.
How to explain yourself ?? well it is very simple, tell your lawyer, YOUR family has decided 'this works best' for your home.
Honestly you don't need a lawyer or judge for this. Just do it. Have the kids call mom when they are free and be done with it.
IF mom pitches a fit let HER look like a fool in court. BM brings you to court Because, you have given her a land line number???
There is a button also for answering machines. Its call ON / OFF...I would not be too quick to have an answering machine.
Back many years ago, I knew of a high conflict BM who told a Judge she wasn't going to get an answering machine so Dad could call kids "it works for her, she said"..the Judge didn't bat 1 eyelash about bm's decision for her private home.
We also blocked BM from emails too. She wrote such awful lies....The judge never ordered us to re-establish her gate way to abuse us. We were sure as hell not going to ask a Judge if it was ok to block her either.
I am very curious what your dh court order reflects about calling.
You are correct! We just met
You are correct! We just met with the attorney and the first thing she pointed out was that DH's CO only says that the children "may" have telephone communication with the other parent between the hours of 6pm and 9pm. She also said that BM sounds legitimately bat shit crazy and thinks we should, among other things, ask the court to force her to get a full psychological exam. She thinks that we could get full custody and request supervised visitation for the BM. I don't think DH wants to take things that far. He just wants the constant bitching, intruding and mind-f*cking of the kids to be stopped. So we shall see what happens but it sounds like we have a case against the psycho for sure!!!
Oh and one more thing...
Oh and one more thing...
WHEN BM asks --What if there is an emergency? HE cant do this to me. HE must have a cell phone so I can text him the info.....
Dh's answer is, IF we can not be reached on the phone number we have provided BM, please ask YOUR lawyer to contact OUR lawyer and leave word with our Attorney. PLUS and hopefully not, if extreme serious nature--the police will come banging on the front door of dh's house.
Think out of the box OP---
I don't get the whole nightly call thing
If it's the kids time with the other parent, why make it weird and keep the pseudo-married connection by having them talk to the other parent? To me it gives the kids the impression that they shouldn't trust being at each house without the other parent around or checking in.
XH and I never knew this was a thing. We never had DS do it. He was fine, he knew he was loved by each of us, that each household was its own entity, and that he'd see the other parent soon enough.
I guess I could see a phone call once during the week if it's a full week on/week off, but only if the kid, not the parent, was really needing that check-in.
And just from a logistics standpoint, what a pain in the butt for everyone.
Yeah, I don't get the need to
Yeah, I don't get the need to talk to a kid every day when they are at the other parent's house - seems excessive.
Seriously, why does a parent
Seriously, why does a parent have to talk to the child EVERY freaking day. It's a bit much and BM seems controlling. Throwing in the theatrics of crying and manipulating these kids with her drama. I get contacting them but to get her panties in a bunch if a day passes....give it a freakin' break already.
She needs to get her life and top using these kids as a tool against their father. She's screwing them up mentally and has no idea the damage she's causing with all this f@ckery.
What would happen if you
What would happen if you turned off the phone at night or put it on mute?
IMHO POS manipulative child
IMHO POS manipulative child destroying waste of skin parents in the opposition need to be grabbed firmly by the proverbial short and curlies and dragged firmly to court where the rolled of copies of their bullshit are used to beat them about the head and shoulders as brutally as possible to show the Judge what POS wastes of skin they are.
No kid should be exposed to these POS people regardless of who they are. It is far better for these kids to never see these POS failed breeders again and for the sane parent in their lives to raise them. Too bad the courts have no balls to make this happen.
Grrrrrr.
The appointment with the
The appointment with the lawyer likely cost more than a cell phone line for the kids would cost for an entire year. Even though it says "may" in reference to the calls, if it has been the status quo then it will likely be allowed to continue if this goes to trial. Going to trial will cost you a lot of money. Is DH really willing to spend 30k plus throughout this process over a cell phone? In retailiation for requesting a psych exam, BM could in turn request a custody evaluator for both homes that DH will likely have to pay for since he is bringing the motion. I hope DH has a good job, is willing to put in a lot of extra hours, and that you don't mind watching skids all that time.
Believe me when I say it's
Believe me when I say it's not JUST the cell phone. BM has been a psychotic bitch from the time I met DH. When she found out he was dating me she drove to his house, broke in through a window and destroyed his furniture and ripped his curtains off the wall. When DH wouldn't lether have the boys for an extra week over Christmas last year she threatened to take them and never come back. I could literally go on for days with examples. The cell phone is the least of our problems.
How experienced is your lawyer?
How experienced is your lawyer? I ask because I can't believe a seasoned family law attorney would ever say, "we could easily get full custody and request supervised visitation for the BM." Read around these boards and you will see that is simply not true. Fathers do occasionally end up with a custody change, and supervised visitation by birth mothers, but it is rare and usually hard fought.
Your lawyer is either inexperienced, or is telling you it will be "easy" in anticipation of a long court fight that will bring in lots of money. I am generally positive about attorneys - but this statement just doesn't sit right.
(Read the blogs of luluonce. The BM in her case has severe mental issues and has done things that truly endangered the lives of her daughters. Her DH does have full custody with supervised visitation, but it is something he has to fight for on a periodic basis.)
She has 30+years experience
She has 30+years experience and has done a ton of work with the Department of Children & Families. She knows what she's doing, I have no doubt. She told us flat out we could spend $100k if DH decided to go full boar and try to get full custody/supervised visits for BM. She didn't say it would be easy just that with all the evidence of BM's mental instability we could do it. But we have no intention of spending that kind of money or time. All DH wants is to get the original CO modified so that she can not intrude on our life constantly and doesn't have so much control over everything.
It sounds to me that you have
It sounds to me that you have the right attorney for this action. Our initial attorney was not the right one though we were successful in defending the SpermClan attempt to take custody of SS from my wife.
We replaced the initial attorney with a very experienced zero bullshit shark of an attorney who was clear on what we wanted and very effective in sending that message in a firm manner to the SpermClan.
Good luck.
Prior to your edit,
Prior to your edit, you did say the attorney said DH could "easily" get custody. Good to hear she is experienced and doesn't think it would be "easy" and that she was honest about the cost.