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Update on the BM mediation debacle

RedWingsFan's picture

So, I drafted that email to BM that you could read in the last blog and DH sent it to her with a 48 hour response request. She'd originally tried forcing DH to go to mediation to change the parenting plan so she has more time and can file for an increase in CS.

Her response: The mediator cannot make an appointment unless we both agree to go. I really wish you would talk with him since the courts are going to REQUIRE it anyway. Let me know what you want to do.

My rebuttal to her response that he just emailed her:
Once again, you have failed to give me a definitive answer as to why you are insisting we go to mediation after being asked twice. If you go to the courts and a Judge requires me to appear I will, but keep in mind they are going to want know why. If you look at my previous email, none of the things that were listed are applicable to our situation so the courts CAN'T do anything. And no, despite what you think, my attorney has advised me that the courts will NOT force mediation. You will have to pay to file a motion in court and when the judge learns that there's absolutely no reason to modify the parenting plan, you'll be out the filing fee AND you still won't get what you're asking for.

I will state that if we follow the existing court order and you fail to abide by it just once, I will file a report with the police department for withholding my visitation and then immediately file a motion in the court for contempt. A hearing will be set within 30 days and since you are the violator of the court order, you will be responsible for all court costs, a minimum of $500 in fines, and paying for my lawyer's fees as well. There's even a possibility of jail time. That is not a threat that is the law.

You have two choices in this matter. You can continue to allow Z to choose where she wants to stay (AS WE PROMISED HER) or we will resume 50/50 visitation as per the court ordered parenting plan and you can drop her off at my residence on Sunday, October 14. Also, if you do decide to follow the court order, you will be responsible for informing Z that you have made the decision to force her and have taken that option away from her.

Keep in mind that nothing has changed in the living arrangements other than she has elected to stay with you because life if easy without punishment. You've allowed her to do far more than is safe and responsible and you've failed to be a PARENT to her. What teenager is going to want to follow rules when she can choose not to?

Again, to put things into perspective for you - the original court ordered parenting plan CANNOT be modified if both parties do not agree. I do not agree. PERIOD. I'll highlight the information taken from Colorado Law again for your easy reference.

Standard for Modification in Colorado
Under C.R.S. 14-10-129, the standard to modify child custody/visitation ("parenting time") in Colorado is generally whether the change is in the best interests of the children. However, if the requested modification would also change the majority residential parent, a Colorado court can only change it if new facts have arisen since the original decree, and:

The parties agree to the modification,
The child has been integrated into the moving party's family with the consent of the other party,
The majority residential parent is seeking to relocate with the children, or
The present environment endangers the child's physical health or significantly impairs the child's emotional development, and the advantage of changing residence outweighs any harm such a change would cause.

I expect a response to this email by tomorrow, October 12 with a DEFINITIVE answer. You either allow Z to continue with her choice to stay where she wants, or you drop her off at my residence on Sunday, October 14th and I will return her to your residence on Sunday, October 21st as per the court ordered parenting plan. Mediation is NOT an option and will NOT be entertained. Your decision needs to be emailed to me tomorrow. I am done playing this back and forth nonsense.

So, now the onus is back on her to decide what the fuck to do because frankly, we're done! I spoke with a family law attorney yesterday and they confirmed she has NO reason and cannot change the parenting plan just based on the fact that the kid doesn't wanna come over and abide by daddy's rules. If anything, the attorney advised, we should file a motion in court to take the kid away as she'd be better off with us full time!!!! THAT ain't happening, but still - to know that BM's threats are empty and without merit and we have the upper hand in this, I'm smiling a bit today Smile

Will update again as soon as we hear from that stupid C*NT }:)

Comments

StickAFork's picture

Ok, I got three lines down, and stopped...

First, YOU wrote and (he) emailed the "plan."
Second, YOU wrote and (he) emailed the response.

Why are YOU doing this? It's HIS kid.

PS: A judge is most likely going to require mediation.

ETA: If you have an attorney, why are you emailing her??
And why are you making such demands? Do you expect a positive response? That email read hostile to me...

stormabruin's picture

I will admit that when it comes to DH's court stuff I am the one who drafts things & keeps his paperwork organized. I do it because it's in our MY best interest to do so.

My DH won't address a lot of the things I address. He doesn't ask a lot questions we want answers to.

If he ends up drowning in CS because he doesn't take enough care to have his paperwork handy & organized, I suffer too.

RedWingsFan's picture

To answer your additional questions:

We don't have an attorney, we simply spoke with a family law attorney regarding all of BM's demands.

We're making demands because SHE'S demanding him to go to mediation to change the parenting plan. It's not necessary to change anything, she just wants more money.

She's been quite hostile herself and has always bullied to get her way. Sending something sugary sweet isn't going to do the trick with this woman.

The only way she'll communicate is through email, so we're obliging her with an emailed response. I haven't copied HER other demanding and hostile emails here, but trust me, they've not been so nice and sweet as SHE is not!

RedWingsFan's picture

^^^^Yes, my poor husband is excellent with any math equation you lay in front of him but as far as vocabulary and writing skills go, he pretty much is clueless.

He gave me a response to go on and I elaborated. I didn't change his desires I simply worded it in a more appropriate manner. And I just caught a typo. SHIT! I was in too big of a hurry and I haven't had coffee yet!

RedWingsFan's picture

Yes, I wrote it because he's not too good with words and sorta jumbles things up. I've taken several writing classes and used to write professionally.

He ASKED me to do this, that's why I'm doing it. She used to bully him, rule him and control him. She's used to getting her way. Not anymore, sunshine.

And the attorney I spoke with yesterday stated that since there's NO reason to change the parenting plan based on the information provided, the judge is NOT going to require anything. Plus, BM has to file the motion in court to get anything started. She's desperate for money so can't afford a filing fee anyway.

She's just trying to get him to agree to alter the parenting plan to give her more time therefore she can go after more child support. He's not willing to do that.

RedWingsFan's picture

When they split, both of them agreed to let SD14 choose where she wanted to be and promised her they wouldn't force her. That was THEIR promise to the kid, when the kid still ruled the roost, long before I came into the picture.

So, in the beginning, since DH lived 1/2 mile from BM, they allowed SD every other DAY visitation (which didn't follow the court order either). Then it went to every other week when DH and I moved in together 8 mos after we'd met, and moved 6 miles from BM's place (that DID follow the court order). That lasted a few mos and then she decided she wanted every other weekend, then stopped coming over altogether because DH finally started punishing her for her bad behavior, whereas BM doesn't! Now BM wants to modify the existing order so she can get an increase in child support and per CO law, that's not a good enough reason!

RedWingsFan's picture

I already asked the family law attorney. Colorado does not have a specific age requirement and the courts look at the child's best interests. They will allow a child to testify and take their preferences into consideration; however, they don't simply award 100% parenting time (custody) to one parent simply because the child states they want to live with them.

She'd never get 100% time anyway. SD14 was allowed to be unsupervised at BM's home during spring break, was allowed to have her boyfriend over at age 13, which resulted in them having sex using condoms found in BM's room. She also had her boyfriend meet her at 4am, snuck out of BM's home and was found kissing boyfriend in the backyard in the middle of the night. There's tons more she's been allowed/permitted to do unsupervised and BM NEVER punishes her. We actually have proof of a lot of this stuff too, through texts, emails, facebook msgs, etc.

StickAFork's picture

These aren't reasons to prevent BM getting custody.
She left a FOURTEEN YEAR OLD home during Spring Break? Her and every other working mother in the country. Smile Facilities don't take kids that old.
The teen is having PROTECTED sex? Well, guess what, teens have UNPROTECTED sex all the time, and their parents don't lose custody of them.
Don't misunderstand. It doesn't sound like BM is MOTY. SD needs discipline, clearly.
BUT, this isn't going to remove SD from BM's custody. Can't imagine there's an attorney out there who said it would...

RedWingsFan's picture

No, we're not trying to remove the kid from BM at all. We simply have a lot of proof and evidence stacked against her if she pushes 100% custody.

Again, we're not trying to take SD away. BM is the one who is initiating all this shit because she wants more money. DH is refusing to give up his 50/50 - that's all.

StickAFork's picture

BM already HAS 100% custody. You think you have "reasons" why she shouldn't have it.
Really, all BM is trying to do is to legalize the agreement that your DH has already agreed to by his actions.
Then, support should be adjusted accordingly.
It all makes sense, and BM doesn't sound like a nutter bitch. (In this case. I cannot comment on other instances. Smile )

TheBrightSide's picture

How I'm reading the OP's situation is: DH is agreable to allowing SD to live with BM full time but doesn't want to have to pay CS.

And if he's forced to pay, then he wants to exercise his 50/50%?

If that's the case, he sounds like an a-hole.

RedWingsFan's picture

Unfortunately, you're mistaken. DH has tried on countless times to get SD to come over. She refuses because she's a spoiled twit teenager and mommy dearest allows her to do everything she wants.

He's been pushing for her to visit for months, she ignores him. They BOTH made a deal to SD when they first split they'd never ever force her to visit if she didn't want to. So, he's honoring that to SD even though he doesn't want to.

Now, BM is trying to cash in on that and he's not willing to give up his RIGHTS just because SD is being a snot.

TheBrightSide's picture

I stand corrected. I shouldn't have made a generalization when I don't know the full picture.

If he IS honoring SD's wishes...BM would likely be successful in getting CS modified.

I wish you guys luck.

misSTEP's picture

It is a common misconception that judges will "allow" a teenager to choose where they want to live.

They may give some WEIGHT to the desires of the teen, but they aren't going to put them into a bad environment just because the teen wishes it so!

Judges have been through it all and seen it all. They (or a GAL/mediator or competent counselor) KNOW that all it takes to sway a teen's opinion is something like "I will buy you a CAR if...." or "You can stay at your friend's house whenever you WANT!"

The human brain does not fully develop until you are close to or in your 20s. They cannot rationally decide what their best interests TRULY are. [And obviously a 13yo who is having sex probably does NOT have her own best interests in mind!]

It's like OUR judge said to OUR BM when she was supposedly letting SD choose whether or not to follow the COed visitation: "You are the PARENT. You are NOT the friend. As the PARENT, you are to do what is the BEST INTEREST of your child. I am sure there are times when your child does not want to go to school, but you MAKE them. Why? BECAUSE IT IS IN THEIR BEST INTEREST!"

RedWingsFan's picture

Yes - I totally agree. No judge is going to say "yes, SD, you can just choose to live wherever you want because that's what YOU want as a 14 yr old". At least not in the state of Colorado.

And yes, BM allows this kid to do anything she wants, so why would she want to visit every other week with dad? Dad has rules, structure, discipline, and doesn't baby or coddle her. BM does all that AND lets her engage in risky behaviors. She even told DH once that "SD is like my best friend, I don't want her to hate me"...

stepmomx2's picture

If only that were true. We just went through it with my SD13 and trust me, a judge can and will say you can choose where to live because that's what you want at 13. None of the supervision or discipline issues were taken into account at all. Life is easier at her mom's so that's where she wanted to be. The judge said she needs to make her own mistakes and find out if the grass is greener on the other side. BM gets custody and we're out $10,000. I wish it weren't the case but it is what it is. If this goes to court, and your SD wants to live with her mom, there really isn't much your going to be able to do about that. You may be opening up a huge can of worms with your email.

RedWingsFan's picture

I'm sorry that happened to you!!!

And yes, if it gets to court, so be it. DH is not simply going to roll over and start paying BM if it isn't necessary and he won't give up his 50/50 rights unless he's forced to by a court of law.

Jsmom's picture

Our judges here in GA give the kid what they want once they turn 14. BTDT and have the damn t-shirt.

Jsmom's picture

I am on the south side of Atlanta. They are hiring all over in this state. So many of the large manufacturing companies are moving to GA...

I have tried to tell everyone that we had no choice when the kid turned 14 they all thought we were giving up. Not giving up just realistic.....We couldn't win...

StickAFork's picture

Phew. What a mess.
If BM had a brain, she'd insist you give her "your attorney's" info, so she could contact them directly, as she should. Be careful when bluffing. Blum 3
BM has ever right to file a modification in this case. Mediation would cost FAR LESS than a court trial, but if your DH is hellbent on doing that, have at it.
YES, BM would get more CS. She has SD full time now, instead of half the time.
YES, there is a 99% chance that BM will be awarded the full custody. The kid is 14, not 4. She prefers her mother's house, for her own reasons, and BM isn't a complete, loser, drug addict, so... she'll get it.
You don't like this child; of that, you've been clear. Why insist so hard that she's there every other week now? You don't want her there.
DH doesn't want her there, either, since he hasn't enforced it until BM made waves.
IMO, you two are being the unreasonable parties, and are only trying to enforce the CO now so you don't have to pay more money.

You're right...this is all about money. But on which side???

Sorry...given the child's age and the fact that you don't want her in your house, it seems counterintuitive to be fighting this.

RedWingsFan's picture

While I understand your points, you don't know the entire situation.

Everything was hunky dory until BM got a boyfriend and the boyfriend told her that since SD is choosing to stay with her 100%, she should fight to modify the court order and then file a motion to increase CS.

Mind you, this is the same woman that INSISTED we allow her to put SD on a state-funded health insurance plan, went through all of this hassle back in May and she STILL hasn't done it yet.

BM is unreasonable for many reasons. But yeah, SHE was the one who came up with the idea of letting SD decide where she wanted to be. DH went along with it because at that time he was still under their control.

She ONLY has SD full time now because SD chooses it. There's NO legal reason for BM and DH to NOT have 50/50 as the original court order states. SD simply doesn't want to follow rules so BM allowed her to stay there full time.

DH is NOT giving up his 50/50 rights for that reason alone.

StickAFork's picture

"Everything was hunky dory until BM got a boyfriend and the boyfriend told her that since SD is choosing to stay with her 100%, she should fight to modify the court order and then file a motion to increase CS."

Well, that's no different than all the baby daddies' new lady loves on HERE who "handle" this stuff.

The long and short of it...SD is 14 and WANTS to live with her mother full time...it's going to happen. It may take awhile, and it may get expensive... but it will happen.

I actually did a custody change about this age.

Your DH should be increasing his CS and supporting his daughter full time.

DeeDeeTX's picture

So the current child support is based on 50-50 custody. But now, the stepkid is living most of the time with BM. Because of this, BM wants an increase in child support.

That actually doesn't sound unreasonable to me.

RedWingsFan's picture

It's not DH's choice to have SD with BM 100%. That's what you all don't seem to be getting.

He has 50/50 custody. The kid doesn't want to come over because DH actually has rules and doesn't allow her to have phone sex and sex with her boyfriend as BM does. She's supervised at our place, not at BM's. She's allowed to eat BM out of house and home, and for that, has gained at least 35lbs over the summer.

It's not in the child's best interest at all to live with BM full time. DH simply isn't going to give into her demands any longer. It's not his choice to allow her to be there full time, but since they promised the kid they would never force her, he's abiding by that.

DeeDeeTX's picture

Yes, but if the kid is actually at BM's your husband should care enough about the kid to support her while she is there, ya know? Whether she "should be" or not, he is allowing it.

Your BM may be a fruitcake, but I actually agree with her 100% on this.

RedWingsFan's picture

He already pays $250 a month, when he was sharing 50/50 time. BM is living beyond her means and now that SD is there full time BY HER CHOICE, she's eating BM out of house and home, so now BM wants more money.

The kid is fat and lazy and BM allows that. So, you're saying DH should pay BM more simply to feed the kid more junk food????

StickAFork's picture

He should be paying more.
Plain and simple.
BM got $250 for half the time.
You ran the numbers the other day and got $500 for full time.
That kinda makes sense, dontcha think?
DH has a teen daughter, and they cost money. TRUST ME. Oh, Lord, do they cost money.

On a side note, I can't remember...do YOU support YOUR teen daughter?

RedWingsFan's picture

He shouldn't have to pay more if it's NOT HIS CHOICE TO GIVE UP VISITATION, PERIOD. And she has no legal leg to stand on.

AND yes, I do fucking support my daughter, court ordered $500 per month in child support every month. Jesus

Jsmom's picture

I actually agree with Stickafork and I have lived this mess. We don't pay CS because BM actually owes us even though Sd lives with her full time and we have SS full time. But, that is because she makes a very good living.

If the kid lives with mom full-time the CS should reflect that. If the kid wants it and is over 14 the courts will usually give it to them. We lived this mess. SS turned 14 and wanted to live here. SD turned 14 and sued us to live with BM. I have seen it both ways and the judge sided with the KIDS....

misSTEP's picture

RedWingsFan, I think they are all "saying" that if someone keeps your child without your consent (or a CO saying they should), you should PAY them MORE for that priveledge!

Willow2010's picture

In my state a child at the age of 14 has the 'absolute right' to choose where he/she lives. Meaning, a Judge will grant a change in custody solely based on the minors wishes.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

What state is this?!

And in this situation, it would be nice if CS was linked to visitation. If the kid does not want to come see her dad then dad should not have to pay for kid. I know it does not work that way, but it should.

RedWingsFan's picture

^^^^^^^^^^Exactly our point! Geez, they put all the power in SD's hands from day one and now BM is running with it.

He's never going to give that right up without a fight. And the kid has already proven time and time again that by living with her mother, it's not in her best interests.

Do I love not having SD around? Hell yeah. She drives me insane and I honestly can't stand her.

But does DH have to roll over and give his visitation up JUST because BM and SD want him to? FUCK NO

DeeDeeTX's picture

I'm saying he needs to either shit or get off the pot.

He wants to pay CS based on 50% custody yet let the kid stay at BM's 90% of the time. He either needs to start paying based on 90% or start insisting the kid come over 50%.

StickAFork's picture

Ta-Da!!
He doesn't actually WANT to enforce the time with his kid. If he did, he'd be already doing that. NOW, the only reason he's *saying* he wants his 50% visitation is because BM is going to court.
THAT is not a "dad trying to be involved." That's a dad "trying to get out of paying more CS."
He had no problem with SD living with her mom full time. Only now that BM wants the CS to match it, MAGICALLY, daddy suddenly cares.

RedWingsFan's picture

God, again you don't fucking listen. The kid has refused his every attempt to get in touch with her. She's the one refusing to come over based on her own selfish wants that BM feeds into.

So yeah, he let her go to BM's full time because when the kid was 11 and they made that promise that they'd never force her, he was abiding by that.

So BM decides she wants to cash in on SD's choice and DH says fuck off. But somehow, HE'S the bad guy?

StickAFork's picture

He is NOT the bad guy. I never said that.
What I DID say is that you are going to lose this battle. It's a no-win for him.

StickAFork's picture

I would suggest an attorney, but those are expensive, and not necessarily honest.

Go to your local law library. Search for cases that have used the laws you've quoted. Check and see what precedent has been set. The statute as listed "on the books" is NOT necessarily how it is applied in the court room.

StickAFork's picture

No problem.
I have no issue with you.
I just don't know you, either, so I was trying for a better understanding.
Sorry.

RedWingsFan's picture

^^^Funny, that's exactly what he's doing. And it's not HIM that needs to shit or get off the pot, it's BM! She's the one initiating all this shit.

misSTEP's picture

This type of thinking is based solely on people who have never had to deal with children who have been alienated against one parent by the other.

misSTEP's picture

As far as I am concerned, if the father gives up his 50/50 custody based on the child's wishes (i.e., brainwashing into a PAS situation), that is like paying a kidnapper the ransom they demanded and then they STILL don't let you have your kid back!

TheBrightSide's picture

"You can continue to allow Z to choose where she wants to stay (AS WE PROMISED HER)"

DH was agreeable to allowing Z to "decide for herself".

RedWingsFan's picture

Yes, when she was 11 and they first split, they made all kinds of promises to this kid just to see her thru. She would cry herself to sleep for an entire year every single night because "my parents got divorced and shattered my entire world". They also allowed her to control them both.

DH was talked into this by BM. This was 3 yrs ago. He's not one to go back on promises but regrets this one!

whatwasithinkin's picture

This is why we should not make bargins with our kids. And I speak from being a Mom with children that follow a court ordered visitation schedule.

It is not good for the kids, and it's not good for the parents or steps involved because it always comes down to this type of email. And it also comes down to a 14 year old being given the power to make her own choices regarding visitation. I understand why we as parents want to do this for our kids but it always ALWAYS backfires.

As far as the email itself, Ive been on both sides of that too. Just remember something that noone here has mentioned. I have lost track of how long SD has been back with BM but there is such a thing as status quo. And if she has been back there any amount of time, it will be looked at like a change in circumstance. But not only that, the court probably can and will require mediation, and thirdly, I dont know the over all history but unless BM has violated that court order time and time and TIME again, chances are a judge will lightly smack her on her hand and she will be on her way.

Ive had my fair share of court rooms, if I got this email I would probably email you back and tell you to stop blowing smoke up my butt, and then Id turn around and file and the court could tell me no to my requests. Let's hope BM isnt that savvy. Because anytime you mess with court you never know how thats gonna turn out..Good luck...I feel your pain

RedWingsFan's picture

She's not that savvy and he's had to point out several items over the course of their divorce as well as years later, that was documented in the court order that she simply failed to read.

stormabruin's picture

If the BM has taken it upon herself to change the visitation, dad isn't obligated to bend to her demand that he then pay her more money.

If the order states he pays $xxx.xx in CS, that's what he's obligated to pay.

Nothing states that BM is obligated to have SD more than 50/50, costing her more money. If BM wants to accept more time than that, it's on her dime.

RedWingsFan's picture

^^^^THIS! Thank you. This is exactly our point in fighting it. SHE came up with allowing the kid to come and go as she pleases and now wants DH to just give up visitation simply based on that?

So, he's giving her the option of following the original court order and force the kid to come over every other week or to drop this bullshit

RedWingsFan's picture

^^^Exactly. She knows she has it made at mom's. Can run the neighborhood, meet and have sex with her boyfriend and she's never punished. She is babied, coddled and given everything she wants.

THIS is no reason for BM to all of a sudden "win" full parenting time and for DH to give up his 50/50

RedWingsFan's picture

I really hope things go well with you and you're never faced with this situation. It truly is stressful.

Part of me wants to tell DH just give her whatever she fucking wants so she'll get outta our hair but then again, she won't stop. Now it's more money and later on, she'll just want more and more because he rolled over for her this time. So, she's so used to calling the shots, she's pissed that he's not bending to her demands and she's threatening court and shit.

He truly wants a relationship with his kid, but not forced. She clearly made it obvious that she wants nothing to do with dear dad unless it's for money. That's the only time she ever contacts his parents or grandparents either. She learned that directly from BM.

So, yes, just because SD and BM want what they want, DH is supposed to just hand it to them on a silver platter and say "yes dears, whatever you want?" NOT ANYMORE!

Clearly An Upgrade's picture

This whole thread is just bumming me out. I can totally empathize with Redwing...DH and I would have loved to have told surly, whining SD (at 14) that she could just keep her sniveling ass at BM's if she didn't want to follow our rules and be semi-pleasant to the family during her sporatic (at best) visits. DH tried to keep the visits going per our status quo, until BM told SD that she "could choose WHETHER SD wanted to see her father". Giving a CHILD the option of choosing NOT to see one of their parents is abusive in itself. Only in COD situations (with bio parents that hate each other) could this EVER fly. You will only have a few possible outcomes, none of them healthy for the child.

Either a) the kid plays both parents into tripping over themselves to satisfy child's every whim so that the child "chooses" them over the other parent, b) the child learns that they can bounce back and forth between homes in order to find the path of least resistance (and fewer rules/guidelines), c) one of the parents gets wise to the dynamic and refuses to play this sick ass game. (Usually that will be the more intelligent, responsible parent, and ultimately the best place for the child to grow into an intelligent, responsible adult, but rarely where the child will "choose" to be.

Pretty much anyone that has had a teen knows what trying to "force" a teenager into doing something they don't want to do is like. Difficult at best, with two bio parents on the same page, impossible when bio parents are pitted against each other to be favored. Allowing a child to opt out of visits with one of their parents is ridiculous, and only a marginal parent would allow their kid to get away with that, whether custodial or not. This is usually the age when tensions come to a peak, because neither parent wants to be on the "losing" end, and the child knows exactly how to work this insecurity.

Mediation may work in some situations. I have not personally seen it work, because for it to be successful, both parties must enter mediation with a desire for resolution. If the parents are coming in with years of resentments sitting on their shoulders, a mediator can only do so much. In our state, once a child reaches age 12, they are also interviewed separately by the mediator, and their wishes are also taken into consideration, with the mediator "acting" not only as the middleman between the parents, but also the liaison of the child. That setup in itself is not conducive to resolution, because it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out WHY a teenager, that has a history of enjoying a fairly healthy relationship and visits, with BOTH parents, all of the sudden doesn't want to see BD or BM anymore. (Abusive situations excluded.) The parent that is "favored" at that particular moment stands to gain everything, while the other parent is just a sitting duck, thinking that mediation is "supposed" to be helping.

As a SM that has watched my "non-favored" DH be totally cut out of his daughter's life by BM, with the help of a mediator who was supposedly representing the "wishes" of his kid, I call bullsh*t on the whole arrangement. Also, DH was only unnecessary to SD for a short time after mediation....she was crying to him less than six months later that "things are SO awful with BM, daddy, and I want to come live with you now". Chalk it up to love, naivety, idiocy, whatever, DH and I welcomed SD into our home full time. SD then didn't want visits with BM. So we figured at that point, she gets to make her own choice on visitation, AGAIN.

Can anyone guess what happened next? BM bought princess the jeans we told SD she'd have to save her $$ for, and when confronted about her scheming (she'd also lied about WHERE she got the jeans, tried to say she had saved her lunch money for the jeans), DH was no longer "nice" and SD wanted to go back to BM's.

Now the kid has gone back and forth so many times that not even the lawyers can figure out who owes who, how much, if any, child support, and we're literally counting days off of a calendar to figure out who gets to claim SD on this year's tax returns. No one has any control over SD, she does what she wants, when she wants, and her father is so f*cking sick of the histrionics and bullsh*t from both SD and BM that he just can't put his heart into anything having to do with her anymore.

So that was my long-winded way of getting to this: Barring abuse, (and I mean real abuse, not "my mom/dad is mean to me" non-specific sh*t), NEVER TELL A KID that they can choose NOT to visit with one or both of their parents. If kiddo doesn't like the rules at one house, or thinks it'll be more "fun" at the other house, too f*cking bad. There are serious consequences to letting a CHILD, that doesn't have a fully developed brain, call the shots and make their own "choices" when it comes to mom and dad. And while it may feel nice to be the "favored" parent when you ARE, just know for 100% that the only guarantee is that you'll be on the other side of that the first time you have to actually parent and say NO. Fickle little as*holes by nature and design, those teenagers. And it's FAR worse if encouraged by parents desperate to be besties with the kid.

I totally agree with whoever said that if a parent presents in mediation or court saying that "little Susie doesn't want to go to dad/mom's anymore" should be told to pound sand. There certainly shouldn't be a monetary award (more CS) for encouraging the alienation of their kid from the other parent. If both parents aren't enforcing regular visits, therein lies the problem. WTF. *Stepping off my soapbox*

RedWingsFan's picture

I agree with you and DH fully regrets ever allowing BM to coerce him into letting SD choose where she wants to live. They even drew up an agreement and signed it and framed it for SD when she was 11 (yes, she was babied THIS much) saying they'd NEVER EVER force her to be anywhere she didn't want to be. This was at age 11...

They both gave this kid adult status and SO much power over them. It was literally disgusting how she'd boss her dad around in front of me in the beginning. Dad, I said I don't WANT that, give me something else. And he'd go, ok sweetheart, whatever you want. I gagged several times within an hour of listening to her command him around. He honestly had no clue, since she did the same with BM when they were still married and BM allowed it as well.

The thing is now BM allows, DH does not. He's put SD back into "child" status and she HATES it. So she goes running to BM who treats her like her best friend and doesn't want her to be mad at her if she says no or God forbid, actually disciplines her!