I'm the side chick in my relationship

Hi all, first time posting and could do with some perspective from others. Boyfriend of 2 years has 3 kids, 17, 13, 9. Divorced from cheating mother for 5 years. My concern is that sometimes the behaviour between his youngest daughter and him makes me feel a bit "icky". It genuinely makes me gag on occasion. He clearly shows obvious preference to her over the other children, his 13 year old son has mentioned this to me on several occasions but "she's the baaaaayybee" so boyfriend always collapses to her whims. She pouted on an outing last week because her granny had a new puppy and her dad pet the dog. No one can have a conversation without her interrupting,"dad look at this" "dad come play cards" "dad watch me draw" daddaddaddaddaddadDAD. I swear Im going to start calling him dad, maybe he will listen.

I feel like the third wheel in their "date" when we go anywhere. He puts his arm around her waist and squeezes her in, or carries her when shes tired, all the while completely ignoring me. He calls her baby names and they talk in baby voices. He still stands in the bathroom when she brushes her teeth, undresses for a shower and carries her up to bed. She is almost 10. She carries a large stuffed animal with her everywhere we go, talks to it, feeds it everything she eats and insists we include it in conversations. The manky thing gets foisted on me in public to carry. Ive suggested it stays home when we go out but boyfriend insists on her taking it. If I mention anything, boyfriend says Im jealous. Had I known this was the weird dynamic, I certainly would not have agreed to move in with him. I have a son the same age, him and my stepdaughter are in the same class together. Im affectionate to my boy but hes 9 and starting to learn how to become a young man, he wouldnt dream of baby talking at this age. His peers at school are all too cool now, playing football, gaming etc. so it's normal for this age to stop clinging like a limpet to your parents.

My sister and BIL are parents to a 6 yr old girl and 2 yr old boy and they find it odd SD is acting younger than her age. Am I being a bit harsh?

#thirdwheel#babyvoice#stepdaughter

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Not Harsh

TBH, perhaps you should mover right back out. Ick.

Mini-wife

If you do not wish to move back out, and wish to continue this relationship, there are a few things you can do:

1. Record them together.

2. Have a heart to heart with your partner. Tell him how you feel. If the whole "your just jealous" defensive gaslighting comment comes up, explain carefully that no you are not just jealous, he is behaving inappropriately. Even his son has this same opinion.

3. Start really thinking about if this is the person and relationship for you. It doesnt sound like it. And read around here, as well as research "mini wife" & "emotional incest".

4. Keep up on the birth control, or you will be stuck.

Good gawd a MINI WIFE

BTDT it aint fun. Its soul sucking.

Your gut is telling you, your family is telling you, this aint right cause it isnt!

Wait til she is a little older it WILL BE creepier.

His reaction is that YOU are jealous. Think about it. Your BF has no boundaries and sees this as jealosy cause he considers you and the mini wife on equal terms. Well actualy no, he knows he puts her higher on a pedastol than you and he loves, just loves the triangle he formed.

You can try to talk with him, but really the fact that he normalizes this creepy behavior , why would you want him. This guy is not single, he has a GF , his daughter.

Find a single guy that cherishes you like the goddess you are.

Blessings

Oh dear that sounds horrific.

Oh dear that sounds horrific. My DD2 doesn't even take her soft toy when we go out. All she cares about is what shoes she's got on to jump in puddles. Abort and move back out until he can see your point of view and he can stop coddling her. Tell him how you feel being a third wheel and you are considering moving back out if he doesn't change this behaviour. I honestly find it such a turn off if DH's give their daughters icky miniwife affection instead of you.
I walk into the lounge and DH immediately (well skids do it themselves now but 5 years ago he did this) pushes them across the couch and makes sure my spot is next to him with his arm out ready as his number 1. If your BF doesn't do this and ignores your existence while he cosies up squeezing his 9 year old to him every night and your sitting on your own feeling awkward.. you need a new BF. Goodluck!

Wait, she's almost 10 and he

Wait, she's almost 10 and he stands there while she undresses for a shower? Gross. Technically it's not molestation but it's creepy nonetheless. I would find it hard to have relations with a man who did this.

The manky thing gets foisted

The manky thing gets foisted on me...

NO. "No" is a complete sentence. No to carrying ickle manky things. If you weren't there, Dad and mini wife would have to a) leave it at home, 2) take turns carrying it, or iii) toss it in the trash while they're out.

How does mini wife behave when he shows you affection?

TBH, she's almost 10 and he's watching her undress: makes me shudder.

Ickle............ lol

Ickle............ *lol*

No this isnt harsh is does

No this isnt harsh is does sound creepy.....

You lost me at the 'he stands there while she undresses in the bathroom'

He probably doesn't see anything wrong if she hasnt hit puberty yet but it is STILL a boundary violation and if I were you I'd say something about how it makes you feel uncomfortable seeing his creepy behavior with his daughter.

She's old enough to where she can bathe and wash and dress herself. She's not a toddler.

And yes it seems to be a common theme of maladapted bio parents being too codependent/enmeshed with their kid(s) - see 'mini-spouse' 'emotional incest' syndrome

Don't be so sure, I got my

Don't be so sure, I got my period at 9.

Same.

The only way.....

The only way I've ever been able to get DH to change behavior regarding SD has been to phrase it as my concern for her. Any tiny hint of criticism shuts him down.

"DH, I'm worried about SD. She's so overly demonstrative toward you, I'm worried other people might get the wrong idea. People (you decide whether to mention names) have hinted to me that its inappropriate. She's so (list of her positive qualities). I just cant keep from worrying about her".

The Making of a Mini Wife

Research "mini wife" here and on Google but especially here to learn what others, like me, have had to deal with and tolerate over the years from our own "mini wives" we deal with. None of it good.

Time to have a heart-to-heart with him and suggest you guys go to counseling to mitigate the damages this is already causing and STOP future crap. He really needs parenting classes if this is how he is raising his daughter. Good Lord. SMH

Your other option is to cut your losses and find a guy who isn't an enabler and Disneyland dad.

Best to you.

Ew

My DH is over the top with SD14 IMO, but nothing like this. I would not be able to be pushed aside while she holds the significant other role. He can still be a parent and give her attention, love, and be a father figure, while treating you like the romantic partner. I would have a serious talk about it again, but if he still accuses you of being jealous, I think you have your answer on if this will change. I personally could not handle it.

Oldie but goodie

https://goodmenproject.com/families/youre-not-your-daughters-handsome-pr...

Great article, thinkthrice!

Great article!

Thanks for sharing!

This is NOT normal, and your

This is NOT normal, and your bf is stunting his daughter's development.

I would be completely grossed out by such behavior. Why do you stay?

I'd leave him to his mini

I'd leave him to his mini-wife before you waste more of your life.

Additional info

For Valentines day this year, he bought me and mini wife the same box of chocolates. Her card was full of gushy sentiments "i hope you know how special, important and loved you are. You will always be my little girl"

Mine was "Happy Valentines day, love...."

It has sat on my gut since February, surely this is not normal treatment towards a daughter? I am not against parents celebrating V day with their kids but that upset me to the point I cant look at him the same anymore.

Why is he so obsessed with her?

Again

Several commenters have suggested you do some researching and reading -that will surely answer your question about the why.

Now its time to really focus and think about the what next...

"Why is he so obsessed with

"Why is he so obsessed with her?"

It's a very deeply rooted and very profound need within your SO and it is to the point of leaving a huge, gaping wound in his soul. Like my DH, your SO may not even be consciously aware of the reason or of his need/core issue. I've been in the trenches for 27 years and did therapy up the yin yang, so that's what I had learned. The need that causes your SO's obsession is usually fear-based. In my DH's case, he was scared shitless of losing my SD33. It's common for enmeshed dads to enmesh with one child but not his other ones. In my DH's case, it was my SD because she had a very cold personality, was enmeshed with BM, and DH felt very threatened by BM's and SD's enmeshment, so DH felt that it wouldn't take a whole lot for BM to have SD just up and leave DH never to be seen again without a care in the world. DH felt that if he could prove, and I mean waaaaaaaaaay over-prove that he loved SD, she'd have a heart and think twice before just abandoning DH forever never to be seen again.

If you've ever felt like describing your SO's behaviour towards your SD as being "like a drug," it is because it is. Every time your SO fawns on/coddles his little poopsie, he gets a dopamine hit. He's addicted to "feeling better" because his behaviour gets a response from SD that makes him feel good. This feeling creates a hit like a drug and the cycle perpetuates because it doesn't get to the crux of the matter. It's only a band-aid solution. It covers up your SO's fear only for a fleeting moment so he has to be relentless in his obsessive behaviour to keep himself from not feeling that intensive fear (or profound guilt). He needs the constant "fixes."

The prognosis for parent/child enmeshment is slim to none because your SO is happy that he's getting positive feedback from his DD for what he does. Your SD is happy because she's getting worshipped and coddled. Those two are thrilled to pieces with what they're doing. You're the one not getting your needs met as a wife, so you're the only one unhappy. Even people fairly close to such parents and children will just think that they are "very close." They won't understand the true depth of it. Your SO is part of a dynamic that causes him to not be emotionally available to you, so you're the one left standing there on your own and even getting gaslighted and blamed.

The fear or guilt is so great in these dads that they will say and do anything to protect the obsessive dynamic. Any sign of evolvement or improvement or maturity in the child and the dad will sabotage it to knock things back into status quo. These dads want helpless dependent adult kids so that they'll never leave them. These dads will blame the SM, make all sorts of claims that she's jealous, insecure, or imagining it.

Don't make the mistake of counting down until your SD is 18. Enmeshed, coddled infantilized kids do not meet milestones when their peers do. They do not get BFs or GFs when their peers do and they often do not have fulsome friendships, if any, so you can't rely on relationships to divert your SK from your house to give you breaks. They remain at home to crawl up Daddy's ass right where he wants them. These kids do not get drivers licenses nor jobs when their peers do. They certainly do not launch anywhere near the time their peers do, if ever.

These dads are happy with their dynamic. Change comes only when the dad realizes there's a problem. Enmeshment with a child often doesn't end because the dads and kids are thrilled to pieces with what they're doing. These dads may change for a short while because of their spouse requiring it, but since the dad truly does not believe that there's a problem, any changes will be fleeting. The dad cannot afford to take the risk of losing his poopsie, so he's not going to want those changes that his spouse wants. He likely knows that in time his spouse is planning on leaving if things don't change, so he'll throw out "buying time" comments to give his spouse false hope that things will change or he'll throw out comments that make her stop and wonder if she's being unreasonable or even a bitch. Be on the lookout for "well she'll outgrow it," "she just needs to adjust," "she just wants her dad," "it's her who has always been more emotional than so-and-so," or "if I just meet her needs she'll come to realize..." Those comments are pure bullshit and are used to justify the dad's perpetuation of the dynamic and/or to buy time so that his SO won't quite leave him yet.

I'm so sorry that you're going through this. I have the C-PSTD to show for it because I didn't leave when I should have. DH and I just did two years of intensive individual therapy and couples counselling and are still going. It's been really tough. I realize that my case is very rare because my DH actually initiated the therapy and wanted to change to save our marriage. Most of these dads don't see a problem. They just see the SM as the problem for not wanting to enable a dynamic that hurts them.

Good luck! Hugs!

Evil4 gets it. Read her posts

Evil4 gets it. Read her posts. Nauseating.

Very insightful post

Evil5 has made a very insightful post. I hate to think of the pain she has endured to gain this knowledge. Peace.

Brava, Evil. Banging on the Like button.

You broke that down so well.

OP, I've shared before about my FIL and his enmeshed relationship with my SILs, especially the eldest. At least he never dated again after he got custody of his kids. But he doted on my SILs, spoiling them while holding DH to much higher standards. FIL got hooked on that pure daddy- daughter love, and got his emotional needs met by his daughters. He was afraid of losing them, and as they grew older they manipulated him shamelessly. I once walked into his home to see him in his recliner, forty-something SIL sitting on the floor at his feet, leaning on his knee as he stroked her hair. Yuk.

Evil explained that most of these dads don't want to change the dynamic, partly due to fear and partly due to selfishness. My eldest. SIL was an addict for decades. She needed help, but FIL enabled her addiction because it served HIS needs to have her dependent on him. When he died, she was in her forties and literally could not function as an adult. She limped on another decade + without her daddee, and those were the hardest years of her life before she finally succumbed to the years of self abuse. What a waste.

I always advise new members in situations where enmeshment is present to just get out ASAP, because there's no scenario where you won't suffer due to it. This sickness is deep and wide, with looong tentacles. Even if the skids are grown, even if the partner sees the error of their ways and seeks therapy, the damage is permanent and the skid remains a needy, broken thorn in your side. Plan your exit, leverage things to your advantage, and move on to something healthier.

Hell naw!!!

Hell naw!!! I would be annoyed af if I got the exact vday present as the skid.

I find that maladjusted bio parents are desperate for love and attention and praise

Young kids especially are naive and see pretty much any adult who is consistently there/treats them halfway decent as iconic superstars. Maladjusted (even narcissitic tendencied) parents eat this up. Their spaws are pretty much the only people who will unconditionally love and adore them with not a lot of effort.

They have to put in effort for most spouses to love/adore them and even then, the love is conditional.

They go the path of least resistance that will soothe their fragile ego.

Control

This is all about control. He's selfishly trying to keep his baybeee all to himself for as long as he can. He doesn't seem to be aware that there is an adult relationship slipping through his fingers because he's incapable of understanding the difference between what should be two very different relationships.

There is something very sick about a man who puts his partner on the same level as a child to the point of giving them the same valentine's gift. He is apparently unaware that he's diminishing you and disrespecting you when he accuses you of jealousy. Pfft, a grown woman jealous of a little girl? What is WRONG with him?

Unfortunately, he doesn't love his baybeee as much as he thinks he does he simply loves the way his control over her makes him feel. If he really cared, he'd cut the crap and start teaching her to be independent and capable of taking care of herself rather than leaning on him all the time. The hances are she will never launch because daddee has sufficiently handicapped her. Oh how happy that will make him!

And don't get me started on the watching her undress - that is both inappropriate and twisted.

Start looking for a new home for you and your son today. This is not the guy for you. I bet you are losing respect and desire for him at a rate of knots ...

Harsh? Seriously? Not by a long chalk.

"Unfortunately, he doesn't

"Unfortunately, he doesn't love his baybeee as much as he thinks he does"

Yep. He's using her. To feed his need for control, or, possibly because he was lonely after his divorce so he was using her to meet needs that a child ahould not be responsible for (physical affection and companionship.) Although a child elevated to mini-spouse status is often an insufferable brat who is horrible to be around, it's not truly their fault. They enter adulthood lacking a lot of skills they need.

Too much

Dd8 can do most things related to personal hygiene alone besides brush her hair. There is no reason at all why her dad should be helping her shower or bathe. I love and adore my dd8, but there's no way in hell anyone is carrying her to bed. Wake up and go to bed, or better yet, you need to be in bed at bedtime. Idc if she falls asleep in the car, I'm waking you up (gently) and you're walking to bed. I think by 5, the carrying of children around needs to stop.
I think I'm like this because it's always annoyed me to see those things and also when I met DH, ss23, who was 13 was big on calling DH daddy and acting like a big baby. I made sure the day I had kids I refused to make them that unlikeable to other adults. Repelling actually. In any case, your SO is playing into this because of his own ego. You need to share that article with him that Thinkthrice shared with us.

"You need to share that

"You need to share that article with him that Thinkthrice shared with us. "

I'm willing to bet good money that he won't see why the article might concern him.

Yes!

Usually narcissists raising mini spouses don't see it as stunting/hobbling their children because it fills their selfish emotional needs.

You'll just get "but I WANT/LOVE to do xyz for minispouse... you're just jealous." Followed by "you just don't like minispouse, do you?"

OK your post gave me PTSD!!!!

OK your post gave me PTSD!!!! I remember the constant card playing on nights SD was here (and darts) I remember the times he would answer the phone when she called saying "Hello my love". I remember the three of us going out to eat and he would walk side by side with her and would rub her back or caress her hair as we were sitting at the table. And I remember when he would give her a dozen roses for Valentines Day. The first year we all lived her in our new home he got her roses, chocolates, a balloon AND a card. It was ridiculas!!!. All can say is if you can stick it out, once she gets her period I bet all this stuff stops. It did with my SD.

But for now I would definitly say that if she continues to bring her stuffed animal SO can carry it NOT YOU!!! And the watching her undress is where I draw the line to inappropriate and not acceptable. I would tell him that if BM caught wind of it she could call CPS. That should get him to stop!

"All can say is if you can

"All can say is if you can stick it out, once she gets her period I bet all this stuff stops. It did with my SD."

That didn't happen at all with my DH and SD33. In fact, my SD got her period late and when my DH and BM were preparing for it with DH driving over two hours to buy nameless brand pads for SD because they were supposedly the ones she'd feel the most comfortable with, I actually asked him if he was going to change SD's pads for her. He was that obsessed and did EVERYTHING for her.

As my SD got older, she got craftier and way more obsessive. As these mini-wives get older, they develop a sly mindset and crank up the manipulation and tactics to divert their dear old dad.

When my SD finally moved out, it was to BM's house, then in with her BF that she didn't get until age 24. That relationship didn't last long because SD and DH kept skype open 24/7 to have CONSTANT contact. SD's exBF didn't want to "live" with dear old dad, so he broke up with her.

So, yeah the period did not help at all. In fact, as SD got older, the obsession got way worse and I already didn't think that was possible.

OP, wait until your DH tucks SD in at age 23 like mine did. When SS spilled the beans to his GF who went and told everyone and their dog about it, DH got all pissy and said that he doesn't literally tuck her bedding in. I snapped back that it's still a damn tuck-in ritual where SD tells him in her baby voice at age God-damned 23, "I'm ready Daddy," and they trot into her room with her 5'8" body hanging off the end of her fucking white little girl princess bed while DH sat on the side to have a bedtime chat. You should have seen the looks she gave me if I happened to walk down the hall past her room.

Honestly, I wouldn't wish mini-wife syndrome on my worst enemy. Oh! But wait! The mini-wife IS the SM's worst enemy.

Sorry, but posts about enmeshed dads with their DDs trigger me. LOL

Well not all childre or men

Well not all childre or men are the same. My SDhas wanted to pull away form DH as soon as she could. and I know DH was over-compensationg after the divorce and was so flipping worried SD would be jealous of me. He has a ton of flaws but he definilty didnt keep the mini-wife going and he was never a Disney Dad. Just a clueless single dad who would have benefitted from reading some parenting books!

I have read on here though how a lot of wmeon say things got better once the girls got their periods.

^probably because the pms

^probably because the pms kicks in; they start having age-appropriate opposite sex relationships and the maladjusted bio dad HAS to chill out now

The mini-wife finds her age-appropriate "spouse" pushes him to the backseat or the maladjusted bio dad suddenly gets a clue his behavior towards his daughter is unhealthy

I married a guy JUST LIKE THIS

He was an enmeshed dad with a single daughter. We were together for 6-7 years, until I had enough. We are now divorced.

It won't get better. This behavior won't change.

I now have an incredible partner who has 2 teens. I don't post here anymore because I hit the freaking jackpot. He's great and the teens are amazing.

He isn't going to change. In fact, some would argue that he has a right to "parent the way he wants". The only thing you can do is ask yourself:

1. Are you willing to put up with the behavior (happily)?

If yes, then stay and keep your opinions to yourself.

If no, leave. I did. No regrets.

^This is great advice and

^This is great advice and something I struggled with.

If it was in my face, I *had* to say something, thinking change would ensue (who doesn't want to make positive changes if it would make your partner feel more emotionally at peace?).

At the end of the day, all this guilt-riddled Disneyland Dad did was argue with me for weeks while DOUBLING DOWN on justifying his behaviors.

To avoid arguments and have peace, I started to avoid him and his kids during his parenting times (travelling in town or out of town) and I'd rage like h3ll if he tried to invite his kids here to the house last minute (because then I couldnt mentally prepare for their presence/space intrusion)

A small part of me understands that if these maladjusted bio parents don't see anything wrong with the way theyre acting, if it came down to it and they'd rather preserve their relationship with their kids over their relationship with their spouse, then they are NOT changing and not worth the hassle of dealing with long term.

Those are literally the only 2 choices

Long time no see, BrightSide.

Long time no see, BrightSide. I'm so happy to hear you traded in that clunker for an upgrade!

Congratulations!!!

Please share what the key elements are that makeyour new blended family life work so well.

What makes him and the Skids so amazing? What about the dynamics in play are so calming for you and additive to your life?

He needs to let her grow up

I think your BF is keeping his youngest babiefied for his own needs. He needs to be needed. She is insecure and needs him. Its a freaking co-dependent unhealthy relationship. Whether or not he thinks its true, he IS hurting her by keeping her a baby at the age of 10.

Its also wierd and creepy that he is so enmeshed with her. I am not sure I'd stay. Especially if you talk to him very bluntly about this and he doesn't see the problem.

You are here

I'm the side chick in my relationship

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