what's right?
Had a bit of an argument with fiance last night over SD13.
I think she should have some general house rules and expectations, including a few small chores. He agrees with this, but seems reluctant to put them in writing and have a formal sit down with her to go through them. This is particularly important to me as we may very well have 50% custody of her come March. Part of the problem is that he and BM never gave her any rules growing up. He now sees what a colossal mistake that was and is trying to rectify it, but of course BM continues to run her household with no rules so its tough for SD to get repitition/reinforcement of proper behavior and expectations.
He thinks my expectations are "too high" in temrs of what should be expected of her.
How do you know what's right? I have no children of my own, so my ideas and contributions are solely based on how i myself was raised, how the well-behaved, well-mannered children i know have been raised, and through reading numerous parenting/step-parenting books. I am also not a child of divorce (nor is fiance) so i honestly cant relate to how SD may be feeling about everything.
I want us to have joint custody becuase there is a part of me that cares and wants to make a difference for this girl. then there is a part of me that wishes we had little or even no time with her becuase it can be such a drain when she doesnt behave. i try to tell fiance that if he gave her some rules/expectations that it would be a challenge at first but that over time she'd argue/push back less and that visits would become much more pleasurable for all involve.
everything ive read says kids need clear expectations of behavior and that the only way i can discipline as the SM is to have the rules set by the parent and then i merely enforce the rules with the whole "in this house we..." line. is that indeed the best approach?
You are correct kids need
You are correct kids need this to become productive adults. You are also correct in the fact that a child will buck the new rules, but with reinforcement from caring parents it will get better. Where you are mistaking is that this does not apply to step children where one parent lets them run wild. It doesn't work. AS soon as your SD mutters the words I don't have to do this at moms house or I want to go to mom's all your effort flies out the door. The crazy BM sees this as a win until the child gets older and the BM realizes she herself has lost control on her own child. I would just drop it. You should not have to fight this hard for what is right. Your DH and the BM should feel the same way you do on this, but they don't so it will not work. Now if you really want her to learn basic household chores make a reward chart as well. Sounds funny for a kid that age, but you have to start somewhere. I was in your same position once. When nobody wanted to help my SD learn the value of hard work I took it upon myself to remind her and DH I am not obligated to entertain this child either. In other words if SD wanted to have a friend over. Sure as soon as you get your chores done no problem. She had no idea how to do simple things at 13 so I did have to help show her how until she was able herself.
thank you all - sounds like
thank you all - sounds like im on the right path.
i had actually already put toghether my own list. a few of the rules are already in place (no TV on at dinner and no phone at table - these are things fiance and i abide my even when its just the two of us as sitting down to dinner together each night is very important to us).
House Rules
1. RESPECT EVERYONE!
2. MANNERS! (i.e., no eating with hands, no eating out of refrigerator with hands, saying please and thank you)
3. Pick up after yourself, including spills, etc.
4. No phone at table
5. No TV on during dinner
6. No phone, TV, music, etc. until homework is complete
7. Bedtime at 9pm on School Nights, 10pm on weekends
8. No phone/music/devices at bedtime, must be given to dad
9. No arguing; do as you’re told.
Chores
1. Empty dishwasher when needed
2. Set table before dinner and clear table after dinner
3. Make bed in the morning
4. Feed cat
Assuming 50-50 is granted and she is with us more:
5. Strip your bed every two weeks and help with fresh sheets
6. Clean toilet and sink in bathroom
7. Any other minor chores on an as needed/as asked basis
I think a couple are too
I think a couple are too vague - the empty dishwasher as needed one.
I think have a set number of days each week that it is her responsibility (or every day LOL) and make that clear in the rule list.
Apart from giving absolute clarity on that point I think your list is pretty fair and reasonable and I agree - if she were mine the list would be a lot bigger
This is not asking too much
This is not asking too much of a 13 year old. My SD8 does all of this. We have to remind her constantly, but she does it. Except the dishwasher, we don't have a dishwasher. She hand-washes the dishes. And puts them away.
she's only lucky we live in
she's only lucky we live in an apartment - otherwise things like shoveling and yard work might have appeared!
he's fully on board with the
he's fully on board with the rules and some she's already been abiding by. its simply making it more concrete and putting it in front of her face and/or posted on the fridge. He said he will talk to her tonight and/or we talk to her together this weekend.
Echo, i agree these are basic. Id have much more in place were it my own child but at this point i just want to not be disrespected or have my home trashed. I also would like to get to a point where im not embarrassed to eat out with her (at a recent family dinner out she ate chicken parmesan with her hands. no joke).
Wow... Those are rules that
Wow... Those are rules that expected of Ss5 in our home whenever he's here , he of course has to be reminded but c'mon, if your finace thinks these are TOO tough I'd really think hard about you're relationship. I can't believe that he'd think that these rules are too much for a girl that age.
so he went through these with
so he went through these with her last night. i was not home, but he said she took care of the dishwasher and cleaned up after dinner. she also fed the cat (this is an easy one too, because she LOVES the cat).
he seems fully on board with these - but i doubt ill be able to get much more but it is what it is. in some ways he's probably thinking the same thing i am - that she's just too far gone and its much too late to try and instill anything into her. but as long as i can get her to do a few things and at least be respectful and no eat like an animal i can deal with that for 5 more years (actually, 4 years 9 months, but who's counting
)
Can I make a suggestion?
Can I make a suggestion? Those rules ARE well in line for person her age (if not a bit less than reasonable). BUT... for a kid who has not had expectations set? And one who is approaching/entering puberty? A better approach may be a family meeting, rather than a sit-down to tell her what her chores will be.
List the household chores - all of them - on a grid that has you and her Dad listed as well as her. And then, between the three of you, start divvying them up. Yes, as the adults, you and Dad will handle more than she will. But you want her to SEE that everyone is doing a portion of the work needed to keep the household running.Forestalls the "Why do I have to do ALL the work?!?!" - she's 13, you're gonna hear it. You MAY find there are chores she would prefer to do, vs some that you plan to assign to her.
Make that grid/list re-negatiable on some level (every other month, three months?) with the clear expectation that one does not simply drop a chore - it's exchanged for a different one. She can't stop loading the dishwasher, but she could swap it for taking the trash out daily. Make it a family thing - believe me, it will be smoother.
its a challenge for sure
its a challenge for sure because not only has she never had chores, this kid comes from a household where she called all the shots and was in charge. fiance understands that i wont tolerate that in our home. in our home the adults are in charge and she's a child. he knows she's a disaster, he knows she's immature, and he wants to take action. but at the same time he's afraid of his own kid. her mother is afraid of her too. its obvious. she still is in charge at her mother's (which is the recently court battle we've had, the mother is letting SD call the shots with regard to visitation, even when SD's wishes are in complete violation).
SD and i have been butting heads recently because im the only adult in her life who dares to stand up to her and not take her crap.