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Moving Question

Ursula's picture

Right now BM and my H have 50/50 custody.  We currently live less than 5 minutes from BM, although when the 50/50 CO was entered we lived 25 minutes from her.  We want to move.  The schools in our area aren't good.  Our plan is to move in the summer of 2023.  We are looking to move 30-40 minutes away from where we are now.  BM is high conflict so we know she likely won't just accept it and not try to change custody.  My husband thinks he will try to have SD go to middle school where we will be living, and obviously BM won't go for that.  Do you all think it would be likely for him to lose 50/50 if we moved away? Anything we need to look out for?

Comments

justmakingthebest's picture

I have heard it is easier to get a court to change the order if they are moving a school level - Middle to High school for example. 

However, if SD has gone to school in one district this whole time and BM doesn't agree to the move, I wouldn't hold my breath of SD coming to live with you for school purposes- with the exception of you being willing to provide all of the transportation to and from school daily on BM's weeks/Days. 

Maybe after a year of that you can do change of circumstances and that you are no longer able to provide the transportation and see if you can get primary residential. That would be tough but I feel like the court wouldn't want to move her schools a 2nd time in 2 years. Who knows... 

I wish school zones made a difference in custody, but it doesn't seem like they do outside of initial custody proceedings. 

Ursula's picture

Thanks for the feedback.  I really think my H is looking at this all wrong thinking that he can get custody of SD if we move.  I'm leaning towards having her EOW and maybe an extended amount of time during the summer and over school holidays and long weekends.  BM has never been agreeable and I'm sure she won't be for this either.  I also don't want to pay a lawyer for any of this.  

Ispofacto's picture

It would be helpful if you'd update your profile with the ages of all the kids involved.

1+ hour round trip is a huge burden on a kid, and the parents too for that matter.  Not only for everyday, but for friendships and sleepovers and dances as well.  I doubt you'd keep 50/50.  It's highly unlikely a judge would reward DH for creating this hardship by giving him custody.  It would probably be cheaper to send your own child go to kindergarten and first grade in the "bad" school, and then private school until SD ages out.

 

Ursula's picture

SD is about to be 9 and she's in 3rd grade now.  Our DD is 4 and will be able to start kindergarten in 2024.  I agree it's unlikely that he would get full custody and I've had a hard time wrapping my head around exactly how he thinks transportation would work in this scenario.  I'd be more okay with him having EOW and maybe extra time in the summer and over school holidays and long weekends.  

I have looked at private schools around here, they're around 20k per year.  It's very expensive.  The only less expensive ones are catholic schools but you have to be catholic to attend those I believe.  

Ispofacto's picture

The catholic school in my area accepts all kids.  Also some private schools have scholarships available.

DD is a teacher and GD goes to a "bad" inner city school, on purpose.  School is what the kid makes of it, a good education can still be had.  

 

Ursula's picture

I'll have to look into Catholic schools as an option.  

I agree, school is what you make of it.  And I may be just overthinking things, but the high school that is districted for where we live now and where BM lives is the high school BM went to.  And she is so dumb.  I just keep thinking I do not want my DD to turn out like her.  

ESMOD's picture

I would also take school ratings with a grain of salt.  A large amount of a child's relative success has to do with their parents and home life.  Active and involved parents can have kids with educational success even in less than stellar schools. .There are always gifted programs etc.. for the kids that can rise to that level.. 

Ursula's picture

Thank you.  I know that's true and I'm sure I'm overthinking things.  I just want to make sure my DD has good opportunities and I don't want them to be diminished by where we "have to live" because of SD.  I also want SD to have good opportunities, but I realize that is less in my control.  

NotYourAverageStepMama's picture

school from K-8, then a public high school, plus my husband attended a private Baptist school K-12, I suggest staying in the public school system or at least for high school be public school. There are many many more opportunities at a public school especially for high school than at a private school. My husband really missed out on a lot of opportunities by being at a small private school his whole life and he could of done much better for himself if he hadn't attended a private school. I was in all advanced classes at the catholic middle school, but I still ended up behind at first when I transferred to public school in 8th grade. I was able to test out and then was in all advanced, honors, etc. classes in high school, but I struggled in 8th grade because I simply did not learn the same things and/or the same way as my peers. Heck, I couldn't tell you anything more than the simple simple basics of evolution and neither could my husband. Regardless of believing whether creation or evolution I think it is important to still know the other side of things. 

Just my two cents from a couple who both went to private school. My brother who is still in high school had the opportunity to attend a trade high school to learn about a trade he is interested in and still doing regular classes so then afterwards he could either go into contrustion (the trade he is learning) and/or he could go to college for engineering. I came from a pretty big town so there are many many choices there, but the same choices aren't offered at a much smaller school.

**EDIT: There are definitely BAD public schools. I went to a high school with 800 kids in my starting freshman class as there is only one high school for the city. The city I come from isn't an inner city school, but it is vast in having rural area, suburbs, and ghetto. There were definitely people in gangs in my school, there were fights, and it wasn't a GOOD school in the terms of population and violence. Even had the highest teen pregnancy rate in the country when I went there. This was now 10 years ago since my 10 year high school reunion is coming up this summer. I graduated from there not the top of my class like my sister who was in top 10, but still good grades, good SAT scores, etc. I went on to get a bachelors and did half of my masters. My sister went to the same school (8 years younger than me) graduated top in the top 10 of her class, is double majoring in biomedical science and something else, got accepted into an ivy league school (chose a different school though), and is on a great track for her career. As I mentioned my brother (12 years younger than me) is on track to either go right into a trade with already having knowledge in the field and hands on classes or go to school for engineering, he goes to a trade high school in the county I am from, but plays tennis for the high school my sister and I attended. Both my siblings were in public school their entire education. It is possible to receive a good education and be set up for success in a school district with not the best ratings, but the support of parents and just even a teacher or guidance counselor who is dedicated can make all the difference. 

Ursula's picture

Thank you so much.  This is really helpful and gives me a lot to think about.  I only have my one daughter and I really don't know anyone that has been to a private school so this wasn't a perspective I had considered.  

NotYourAverageStepMama's picture

my comment after you had commented, but I just wanted to give you the prespective of someone who has attended both and my husband who only attended private school.

I have so many people who attended the same high school as me and graduated in my class who now just finished their doctorate and are doctors, one went to Yale Law school, and tons of sucessful people who went to the same BADLY rated high school and do not come from wealth. The unfortunate part of your SD is that it takes support from both sides especially when in a 50/50 situation for her to succeed in a school like that, but for your DD she shouldn't have any trouble being successful.

ESMOD's picture

I'm not totally clear on whether the schools in your area are the same ones that BM's address would have.  Sometimes it can be different based on county lines etc.. Like when I had a house that was on property that was split into two counties... Someone would go to the school in the county that the house was.. even though the other county's school was better and closer.. just the way it would have worked.

But, assuming that the school is the same for you and BM where you live now.. and part of moving reasoning would be to get SD into a better school district. 

I'm sure you realize that if you move SD into a school district that is not the same as BM's district that transportation when she is with BM would be a problem that would need to be resolved.  

You understand that BM will be unlikely to want to give up her 50% custody.. BUT, she is also not likely to be on board with doing transportation during the school week when it is her 50% time either.  That will mean that your DH (or you) would need to figure out how that works logistically.  Add to that the complexities that come up with school activities.. extra curriculars.. friends etc.. that will be 30-40 minutes away from SD  50% of her time due to custody split.  

AND... the extra wear and tear on SD herself when she would be witth mom having to factor in an extra hour to hour and a half of transportation time on top of her homework etc.. 

It's logistically not ideal and you may find that the quality of her education suffers from the extra commute etc..

So... is the move just for the school district?  Are there other benefits that you and he would get that might make it worthwhile?  Because you could go to all the trouble of moving and find that BM is adamant about her staying in her current school district and just that it's a "better" one where you are going may not be enough to take to the bank with court.

Ursula's picture

Right now we live 5 minutes from BM.  We are districted for a different elementary school but the same middle and high school currently.  

Part of the reason we want to move is due to better schools.  The schools are much better in the area we are looking (9 and 10 ratings compared to the 2 rating for the high school where we currently live).  We also want a bigger house and moving would allow that.  I really don't think that is enough to change custody where H would be primary.  And BM would never agree to let SD go to the school where we would move.  

ESMOD's picture

I think he needs to be wary of this potentially changing his 50/50 arrangement if he isn't going to be wiling to do all the transport to BM's local school during his week.  That change could come with some financial consequences like child support.

Even if BM were to agree to allow her to attend in your new district, I would bet she will do zero transportation.. so he would have to figure that out.  

I'm guessing you could find a new and larger home within BM's school district.. but if he really wants to explore her going to a better school.. he may need to bite the bullet and discuss this with BM before he gets too far down that road.  Who knows.. maybe if he offers up transportation she might go for it?

Ursula's picture

I so wish he could talk to BM but that just isn't how it works.  He tried to send her a message this past weekend about signing SD up for some kind of team sport for spring because he thinks it could be good for her and was met with what the hell do you want from me? You're always confusing SD, stop messaging me about sports.  There is no such thing as a reasonable or productive conversation with her. 

CastleJJ's picture

In our state, as long as you live within 99 miles of the other parent, you can maintain 50/50 and you don't have to get permission to move from the other parent. Your arrangement just might go to every other weekend visitation and maybe dinner one night per week (if it isn't already this way). Plus if your CO was entered based on 25 minutes, and you only live 5 minutes away currently, moving 30-40 minutes is only is only adding 10 to 20 minutes to the original CO distance. I would check into your states guidelines regarding "long distance custody" to see if a mileage stipulation applies.

Ursula's picture

I was thinking some of the same.  That we could reasonably move the same distance away as when the CO was initially entered without giving BM much of a leg to stand on to try to take 50/50 away.  Right now they do a 5-2-2-5 schedule so SD is with us half the time and BM the other half.  

CastleJJ's picture

Yeah that schedule wouldn't be feasible if you move, but every other weekend and one dinner a week (maybe like 5 to 8 pm) could be. Then you could request week on/week off in the summer (I recommend weekday to weekday like Wednesday to Wednesday to give you guys full weekends to do stuff). 

As far as holidays go, you could just request half the break so BM gets half of Christmas break including Christmas Eve and Christmas Day and you get the other half including New Years Eve/Day. This could be switched between BM and you guys annually to ensure everyone gets Christmas every other year. You can argue for half of spring break, half of Thanksgiving break, and then one long weekend per year - so maybe President's weekend every year and BM gets Labor Day weekend every year, allowing Memorial Weekend to fall as "summer visitation." 

Ursula's picture

Yes, I think something like that could work perfectly.  I'd even be okay with doing long weekends and dropping SD off at her school on Monday mornings to give H a little more time.  

Harry's picture

Going to do four hours of transportation per day.  Picking up DD at BM drive her to school and back to BM at night.  Do he work?   He expects you to do it. ?  Do you live where it snows. So it will be an eight hour drive.  

Ursula's picture

Honestly I don't think he is thinking this through.  I'm pretty sure he thinks he will be able to get primary custody which I don't think is possible. 

ESMOD's picture

It sounds like since you are looking at your DD's interests as well.. and the family would benefit from the larger home in a potentially nicer neighborhood.. that moving may be a good option all things considered.

BUT.. your DH has to accept that the result of the move could be a change to his custody from 50/50 to more of an EOWE model with some longer breaks.. it also could mean he would have more child support obligation if the shift in time is significant enough.  I guess there is still a chance that BM would be up for SD attending in his district.. but you know the reality is she will likely fight it.. and would not want to be in a position where your move costs her time or money.

Ursula's picture

I feel 100% sure that BM would never just give permission to go to school where we would move.  Before SD was even in kindergarten it was a huge fight over where she would go to school before we moved close to her.  BM has always been insistent that she is the better parent and SD belongs with her more.  And she is all about the child support so I think for her it would be the perfect thing to use to try to get primary custody.  I have considered that he might have to pay more child support, and honestly I'm okay with that.  

ESMOD's picture

It's all a balance and it's good that you understand and can "live" with the possibility of him having to pay more CS.  I think you need to get your DH on that same level of understanding about what this is really likely to mean.  He may be a bit head in the sand that BM will do what is in the best interest of her child.. which would probably be better school.. but like you said... she thinks she is the superior parent.

Gemini's picture

Is your DH ok with the idea of seeing his daughter less? Is he ok with the possibility of going from 50% to 20%/30% custody? You're ok with it but it seems that *he* is not entirely on the same page. In his position, *I* wouldn't be ok with it, especially if he is the better parent and BM is not completely mentally stable. Form *his*perspective, he has to consider what's in both of his daughters' best interest.

Ursula's picture

I don't think he would be okay with it, but I think he could maybe come to accept it?  I totally get what you're saying.  He has thought for a long time that he would end up losing SD anyway.  Even though he has 50/50 right now, BM is very into PAS and doing anything to make him look bad to SD.  BM has an older child that BM was able to successfully push the dad out of the pic due to her craziness, and she pulls the same stuff with H and SD.  We have always hoped that living with us half the time would be a good influence on SD but she has more and more "BM" tendencies.  BM has also pushed on SD that soon she will need to choose who she wants to live with and that she has to pick BM.  

lieutenant_dad's picture

Quick story: my mom's best friend's son (we'll call him P) and his XW (we'll call her R) had a CO giving them 50/50 custody with the stipulation that BOTH parents had to live in the school district.

R gets a new BF who is on probation and isn't supposed to leave his county, got caught at her place in different county, and was hauled off back to his county with the threat he'd be in jail if he did it again. So what did R do? She packed her and the kids up and moved to an entirely different county and enrolled the kids in school there.

Seems like a slam dunk for P, right? Nope. Judge tells P that if he wants to continue 50/50 that he has to transport his kids to their new school an hour away each day, otherwise he'd have to take EOWE and breaks. Nevermind that R moved because BF got in trouble for violating his probation (parole maybe?). Nevermind that CPS had to get involved because the nature of BF's crimes meant that he needed to NOT be around minors. Nevermind that R lied to CPS about BF living with her (and CPS had proof of this). P was told too bad, so sad even WITH a CO.

So, my hopes that your DH will be able to take SD with him are slim. While moving may put your DD in better schools, it'll likely come at the cost of paying BM more CS. 

What about the school system makes it "bad"? Is it something that doing extra work with DD would make her a star pupil/get her into advanced classes? Is there a neighboring school that is better that you might be able to enroll her in? Having DD be top of her class in HS comes with some nice financial incentives for college that she may not get at a more competitive school. Unless she's actually at risk of not learning basics to graduate or is at physical risk, I'd highly recommend looking at supportive programs that give her the education you want her to have and keep her at the top of her class. In theory, SD will graduate before DD exits middle school, so you could move then and let DD take advantage of a more diverse HS then.

simifan's picture

Courts here (PA) mostly look at status quo. BM's school district would be primary. He lived in this district & sent SD to school there thus far - so he must have been okay with it. He wouldn't keep 50/50 unless he was willing to do all transport to BM's school on his weeks.

Ursula's picture

That has been my thinking too. I think he's looking at this all wrong tbh.  He has also thought of us moving and transporting SD to school during his time, but I don't know how that would realistically work.  I assume at the very least SD would have to go to BMs house every day after school during H parenting time until he could pick her up.  And that's assuming BM would even let SD do that.  A couple times this year H has asked if SD could ride the bus to her house after school and he would pick her up after work and BM has said no.

Livingoutloud's picture

No way he'd get full custody unless there's clear evidence of abuse and neglect. Why does he think he'll get it. I'd be taken aback if my ex moved 40 minutes away and argued he must have full custody of DD because he moved. He moved but it doesn't mean SD must follow.

It makes no sense. He'd likely get less custody not more, maybe like eow schedule if he moves away. 

Ursula's picture

I know he isn't going to get full custody.  I'll have to talk to him more about it.  He's even mentioned getting a laywer involved.  I have no intention of supporting another lenghty and expensive court battle.  

ESMOD's picture

Honestly, going to court seems pretty much a waste of time.  It will be a waste of effort and money and the chance of him wrestling full custody from her mother is slim to none.  

Her mom may not be the most stellar person and that school may not be the highest rated but unless he can prove that the status quo is an absolute danger to his child.. the courts will be much more inclined to do what causes the least amount of upheaval for her life.  And going on to school with kids she has grown up with.. the neighborhoods she has lived in? A mother who loves her (whether she is the best mother or not).  They won't be up for pulling her out.. they need more of a compelling reason than "well schools are better and we are thinking both kids could benefit).

Now, in a sane world his EX could agree to the shift in time so her daughter could attend the better school district.  To sweeten the pot, your DH could volunarily agree to continue to pay the same CS that he currently does and give her a bigger balance of SD's time off to compensate.  But you know his ex won't be reasonable.. so he really has to go into this possible move knowing that unless BM agrees up front to SD changing .. that won't happen and he has to understand he will likely lose custody time.. even if he goes to court.

Ursula's picture

I agree with you completely.  I think best case scenario he could keep 50/50 if he figures out the transportation to school during his parenting time.  I just wish there was a way to have a conversation with BM about this.  Ugh, so frustrating.  

ESMOD's picture

I think the only way he could possibly approach it with her is to send her a email

BM,  I would like to explore the possibility of moving where SD would have the opportunity to attend a better rated school.  She is approaching the time where it will be more important for her to be in a good educational environment and help her be better prepared for going to college or whatever she decides to do after graduation.  I think now would be a good time to make a change if necessary when there is a transition from primary to middle school.  

But, I would like to get your thoughts on how things might need to work if you and I end up living in a different school district.  

Obviously this could change both of our obligations to do transportation etc.. The plan would be to move where the travel would only be about 30 minutes so I'm not talking about out of state or anything drastic but if she is attending a school that is not in your district... there will be an issue of transportation during your custody time and vice versa.

It might be that you and I could decide on an adjustment to our current custody schedule to make those kinds of issues more minimal for both of us.

Would you be interested in our daughter having an opportunity to attend a better school district if we could find a home there?  If so, what are your thoughts on the logistics we could arrange.

and let her respond.

I did think about another kind of schedule where maybe instead of week on week off.. its more like one full week with the non school district parent and then the weekends on 2 of 3 of the other weeks of the month.. then make up that little bit of shortfall mostly during larger splits of breaks and summers?

I don't think there is any way of getting around asking her opinion really.  At least you know what her response will be at that point.. it may be nuclear.. but at least he will understand he may be looking at the worst case losing custody time and increased cost scenario.

 

justmakingthebest's picture

This is a really good idea. Nothing has been 100% decided yet, it is opening the conversation and at least you know what you are getting into. She could come back with: Move wherever you want, my daughter is staying right here!

She could come back with: I'm sure we can work out a good schedule but she should stay in town with her friends where she has grown up her whole life.

Or heck: I have been thinking about moving too, there are more opportunities for me in ___. 

Until you ask you just don't know. 

ESMOD's picture

I think I might put the part where it won't be more than 30 min or so away closer to the top of the communication would probably be better.. so she doesn't think he is considering a move to the moon..haha.

HowLongIsForever's picture

We are also in a 100 mile radius state.  Once he left, SO has always lived roughly 20 miles from BM.

Before we moved in together he was 17 miles door to door.  With the routes it was a 45 min drive based on traffic.  Where we are now is 24 miles door to door (22 to school).  Because it's all freeway, it's just under a 25 min drive.  It's actually slightly quicker than the bus route they take from BMs.

Custody is 50/50 in a 2-2-5-5.  SSs are late elementary and tween.  Schools are similarly ranked (both top 10 in state).  As long as BM lives in that district, that is the SSs home district.  All exchanges are at school or summer camps (summer camps are by us because they're quite frankly way better).

On the other side, BM has skids who head in the opposite direction.  27 miles door to door & 34 miles to school.  They are 30/70 (EOWE) during the school year & 50/50 (week on week off) in the summers. 

When she married this guy last year and he moved into her house, he added 20 some odd miles for his kids.  Their BM is super high conflict (ha! that's what she gets for treating me as an adversary without provocation) and would never, ever give an inch.  Their custody didn't change with the distance, though.  All three high school as of next year.  That BM had no say in it.

We haven't run into any trouble on the social or recreational side of things yet. We're in a much more kid & outdoor activity friendly area.  We actually do all of the social hosting for SSs and those parents all happily make the drive. 

SSs play one sport around BMs in the spring, but only because she won't put them in an actual functional league (about halfway between houses). 

I imagine this will change once YSS is in middle school.  OSS is a jerk so his location doesn't really matter outside of the classroom.  I think YSS, on the other hand,  is going to require them to revisit the schedule in a few years.

I would check the order to see if there is standard distance and also be clear on your commute time.  BM might not be able to do anything about the distance but your DH will still have to be reasonable and realistic about the transportation.  The swapping custody though?  I think that's completely unrealistic, especially if BM would never so much as pretend to consider it.

Cover1W's picture

When I met DH the SDs were 7 and 9 and he had 50/50 (still does) with an awful every other Fri/Sat/Sun and every Tues/Wed schedule. The school trip back then, before traffic became much, much worse, was just over an hour one way. It was awful. DH and BM managed to change the schedule slightly so that there was less back and forth and then it became every other week when they were around 9 and 11 or so. That helped hugely. They also went to our local middle school, a highly rated school and had a school bus pick up just up the street so no driving them. But there was a bad commute from BMs house.

Now they both go to high school near BMs (not a good one BTW, ours is much better...but BM) and the timing of the commute back and forth here is terrible.

The commute effected YSD much more than OSD. OSD is PASd so it doesn't matter but YSD is coming here roughly a couple times a week, maximum, since January. DH expected this but he's still upset about it. Plus, he cannot put his foot down about schedule consistency so there's that too.

bananaseedo's picture

Honestly, I think it's horribly unfair to make kids commute like that to a school just so one parent can move and keep 50/50.  It's not right.  It's bottom line, selfish. If he wants to keep 50/50 the best is to stay in the same school area-or if BM moves over to the area you are considering.  If he makes this move, he won't maintain 50/50 and chances are he'll become an EOW dad.

If she's already pas'ing- his move will be nail in the coffin to be of importance to his daughter life.

Trust me, you do NOT want EVERY weekend, nor is it fair to either parent OR the child.  Your daughter is only 4- personally I would wait to make the move if BM isn't going to move to the new district.  Your DD should be absolutely fine through elementary, by the time MS hits, SD wll be much older and things could change custody wise 

When parents move like that, it does have an effect on the kids left behind.  DH was able to stay a lot more involved in SD's life by us being in the same area.  My ex moved 45 min away and he was already a dead-beat, the distance just gave him an excuse to see them even less....it was the wrong move IMO- had he stayed it's possible he would have been a TAD more involved with them.