Stepdaughter Shutdown
In the nine years of married life with DH, I've never been able to shut down his daughter's campaign to draw my husband away from our marriage and alienate his affection for me.
I've come to this website several times in the past for comfort and understanding, since I wasn't getting it at home from my husband. He is still a hot mess when it comes to his daughter,
but where he has failed to control her, the government has shut her down for me!
Who'd have thought it would take a global pandemic to get some relief? Before the pandemic struck, she had strong-armed her way into getting him to spend every Saturday taking her out to dinner and a movie. She's a 40 year old divorcee with no kids that works from home with no real social life. That's not my fault but I was constantly having to shoulder the fallout from that.
These past eight months of the pandemic have been the most peaceful, drama free bonding time for DH and me since our honeymoon 9 years ago.
I now have Dr, Fauci on my side! DH, this woman is not in our household and it's ok to say no to her! Healthy even.
Good!
The pandemic, while tragic for so many, has had its positive side, especially the lessening of family contact with negative people and all the family drama. How does your DH feel? Is it a relief to him? Or is he chomping at the bit to get back to the dinners?
DH enjoys being at home and
DH enjoys being at home and doing his hobbies and recreation that we have here. I think he's secretly glad that the pressure is off.
He talks on the phone and exchanges emails with her.
Another bonus for him is I've become a regular Martha Stewart with this extra time and he gets to enjoy my gourmet cooking every day! It's a big win for our relationship.
Any chance?
Any chance he will dial back the dinners once the pandemic is over? My DH is similar with SD59, not the dinners but overall support. They call each other regularly. I dont care except most of her calls are asking for $ or to pour out her problems.
Well, the good news is, by
Well, the good news is, by the time the pandemic is over, DH will be full retirement age and we will be spending 6 whole months thousands of miles away from her at our winter home.
Not just one month like now.
This pandemic can have a silver lining for her too in that it has forced her to see younger people as her future. People her age that are free to go out without fear of landing in the hospital or worse. I have always suggested that girl friends her age are the answer to her companionship needs, since she has not had even one boyfriend in the eight years since her marriage imploded.
Sounds good
I agree, this woman needs friends her age. Our SD does, too, however, people run the other way once they know her.
LOL. Yeah, my SD has a
LOL. Yeah, my SD has a personality that turns people off. Real loud and pushy.
Men don't like that.
In the nine years of married
9 years is a long time to be dealing with this. Is she an only child? Either way it is ridiculous. It's good the two of you will be living away most of the time. Where is her mom? Why doesn't she spend time with her? I just wouldn't tolerate someone competing with me for my significant other's affection like she is a mistress or something.
I fully expect she will always be a 40 year old problem child.
My only hope is she will someday meet someone, preferably with his own kids, so she can be on the receiving end of it. Preferably one with a bratty hot temper like she has. Then maybe she'll understand how it feels to be marginalized.
She is the only daughter but has one brother who is married and does not ask his dad to take him out to dinner and movie theater. Can you imagine if his son would act that way?
It definitely has the yuck factor. They even use our rewards card to buy the tickets so I get an email from the theatre afterwards asking how I liked the movie, when I wasn't even there.
It is strange. It is also
It is strange. It is also strange he would go along with it. What in the world is with some of these fathers and their daughters who want to be their wives?? Have you two tried counseling?
We consulted the pastor of our church. DH even wanted to bring his daughter into our counseling sessions! Like she has a right to know the most intimate details of our marriage? When DH suggested she be included, I could just cringe at the thought of it. She's already enmeshed in my marriage I'm certainly not bringing her in deeper. I told him, I'm not married to her and this is supposed to be confidential. Well, low and behold I found out he blabbed to his daughter what was being said in our private sessions with the counselor. Behind my back.
That was last year. We went to four sessions and then left for vacation and when we got back the pandemic started so we never went back.
He (the pastor) did set DH straight on some things and DH did ask for forgiveness for treating me so badly after that. He got a book on how to affirm me.
Sounds like your DH is trying
Sounds like your DH is trying. It also sounds like counseling with your pastor helped. Is it possible you two could do virtual counseling sessions with your pastor or a licensed therapist in the community? Why in the world would your DH be dating his own adult daughter? Since things are going good between you two, this might be the best time to get a counselor involved. Did he explain why he wanted his daughter in counseling with you two? Do you have any clue how they became so enmeshed.
Your relief is only temporary
*
She may just have well attended the session with your Pastor,
because DH went and told her everything anyway. That is betrayal. I know it because I have lived it. My DH would call SD or she would call him every morning for their chat. Through him, she knew EVERYTHING about me, us and more. He didn't see anything wrong with that. You know why? Because it has been their "normal" all SD's life, just as it has been with yours. Old habits are hard to change, especially the older they are and they longer they've gone on. They tend to persist, and in doing so he will tell you it's not happening, but will continue to do it because SHE wants him to. Sadly, for many women the DH's desire to please his daughter far supercedes that of him to please his wife. Here in lies the PROBLEM.
That's right. She doesn't
That's right. She doesn't want him to be happy, because she is divorced and unhappy.
What is it with them???
"What in the world is with some of these fathers and their daughters who want to be their wives??"
I think the men in question see in their daughters younger versions of the women they were attracted to years earlier. And if a former partner's young lookalike can get a response by practicing her skills of seduction on a receptive daddeee, as clearly often happens, well--flirting is fun! Why can't both parties enjoy the interaction?
It's a result of poor boundaries. Those caught in the dance would scream blue murder if you called it incest, but that's what it is--emotional incest, anyway. It's sick and sickening. IMHO of course, as one of our honored regular posters might say.
I say this as someone married to a DH with only one offspring, a son. SS28 has matured and settled down, but things were pretty rough with him for years. To this day I can barely stand the thought of him, and he's just about cool to me. I'm pretty sure if DH had a daughter we'd never have made it. I'd quickly have achieved escape velocity and gone into orbit. Any woman with step daughters has my complete and unreserved sympathy, and I heartily endorse any action short of outright criminality she uses to deal with the problems this situation inevitably creates.
All you said!
All you said!
Im not buying your story and
Im not buying your story and if by some chance it's true, well, if you stay you deserve what you get.
Why do people blame the
Why do people blame the victim? Not cool.
I vowed to stay nine years ago, for better or for worse. That notwithstanding, I'm still interested in getting insight from other step parents.
Google the term cancel culture.
Well, she is immature and she
Well, she is immature and she spent too much time with her parents when she should have been home with her husband. She involved them too much in her own marital problems and so I believe she thinks that lack of boundaries is normal behavior.
Gossipy people love to be the
Gossipy people love to be the go-to in the know person. It makes them feel important.
I told DH that he can consult
I told DH that he can consult his own counselor in the future because I already have my own. The four sessions we had together was enough joint counseling.
Have you ever asked him how
Have you ever asked him how many men he knows who takes their daughter on dates?
Good point.
Good point.
We surely don't know anyone else that has a dateless, childless, middle aged daughter. It's an unusual predicament DH finds himself in.
Your DH
should not be the one to "date" his dateless DD. He is already taken, right??
These men are so sick in the love triangle they create.
I so empathize with you. It took many blow outs and talks to get my DH to see things from my perspective (and sometimes he reverts back and its square one all over). Thinking back, I am not sure why I bothered . Hindsight is 20/20 as they say.
I would like to say that there is a happy ending...maybe it gets better but resentment is hard to let go.
All I can say is, I don't let
All I can say is, I don't let the resentment fester inside. I lament to and turn it over to God.
I once told my counselor that I feel like Leah in the Bible, not cherished by my husband.
Her reply to me was "remember you are precious to God".
I totally get
that your faith guides you and nourishes you in many ways.Its wonderful that you believe that you are cherished by god BUT you do not feel cherished by your husband. That is big, and you deserve to be.
I sure hope you do continue counselling with your husband.
Best of luck
Thank you Dovina.
Thank you Dovina.
I sure didn't feel cherished last year when we were in the midst of this drama but we have healed some since then.
I bought us a book called "Cherish". It's a study guide by author Gary Thomas. It was good because DH gets a man's perspective and finds out what is expected of husbands who are not cherishing this gift that God gave them.
Taking his middle aged,
*
I would regularly point out
I would regularly point out how enmeshed he was with his incest partner middle aged daughter. Eventually this pandemic will fade. Be prepared to put the big no on DH's return to his every saturday incest date with his failed adult daugther and inform him that he gets one Saturday adult daughter date per quarter and no more.
I would regularly point out
I would regularly point out how enmeshed he was with his emotional incest partner middle aged daughter. Eventually this pandemic will fade. Be prepared to put the big no on DH's return to his every saturday incest date with his failed adult daugther and inform him that he gets one Saturday adult daughter date per quarter and no more.
You know for years DH
You know for years DH resisted doing the daughter date night, hoping she would find someone.
Then last year she dug her heels in, calling several times a week and leaving long messages on our machine wanting to go out to dinner. It was always at the last minute too when we already had dinner in the oven or plans for the night. The Saturday schedule evolved out of desperation to appease her and just be left in peace if she had a day she could count on. The lesser of two evils.
So, like Rags said, reduce it
So, like Rags said, reduce it to once a quarter.
"when we already had dinner in the oven or plans for the night"
So that's what you tell her then add that maybe she should call a friend... or join a club/gym/walking group/etc. because you think she should "get out more and spend less time with us oldies". It's not your (plural) job to hold her hand because she's bored.
I could hug you for saying
I could hug you for saying that.
Her pressure last year to have these weekly daddy/daughter dates caused so much harm to my marriage that DH was ready to get a lawyer. That's what he threatened to do if he was "limited to 4 hours per week" to see his daughter. You would think she was a 4 year old instead of a 40 year old. The pastor set him straight on how sinful threatening me with the D word is, and he has never uttered that word to me ever again. Thank God.
He has not appeased her, he has acquiesced & empowered
her by giving in to her "requests" (demands?). He has dug himself in deeper, and she has drawn him in nearer in her manipulative web. Becuase he has given her exactly what she wants, she has come to expect it. It's become a conditioned response. When she calls and leaves serial marathon messages telling daddy what her expectations are, daddy is the dancing dog.
I don't see this changing. I'd hope for the best, but prepare for the worse/obvious. After all, daddy seems to like dating his daughter. Do you ever get a date night with your DH?
You seem to have a good counselor. What says she?
I get him in all the
I get him in all the important ways. SD is the one that has to settle for crumbs. Rightfully so.
My counselor is a trained Biblical counselor. She's also a dear friend that I check in with once a week. She knows all too well the history here and always has sound life-giving words to share.
She has been through a lot with her husband as well, and we are like soul sisters in that respect.
I fully expect that SD will keep up the antics and the passive aggressive behavior. It is beyond my control so I have decided to consider the pathetic source and go on with my life with DH. At least I don't have to live with her. Those few months she lived with us were agony and prompted my first ever post on here 8 years ago.
Someday she will have to answer for her behavior because sewing seeds of discord between a married couple is prohibited in the Bible. Being a nosy busybody is too.
He wouldn't leave me out of
He wouldn't leave me out of any dinners with friends, that's for sure. I will underline the word friend.
Twirl
I feel your pain, or should I say I FELT your pain. I dumped my ass DH and so glad I did. It is never ok to ditch your wife for another broad. Especially an adult daughter.
I was reading your previous
I was reading your previous posts so I could catch up on your story. You have my heartfelt sympathy for what you've been through, and send you virtual hugs.
I haven't posted in a few years, but I've found this to be therapeutic to share my feelings and get some feedback anonymously.
Thread from one year ago.
Thanksgiving left a bad taste in my mouth this year. Because SD41 wishes to drag everyone back to a time before I entered the picture, which is more than 10 years ago. Ten years has gone by since her divorce as well and she has never moved on, dated anyone or matured one bit.
She may never grow up but one thing I know is that I 'm an overcomer and that is what God expects me to be. I'm thankful for the opportunity to sort this latest difficulty out.
That's their way of
That's their way of alienating you and making you feel like an outsider. Very typical skid tactic. Act excited to hear and even participate in the memories by asking questions and laughing, etc! And then slyly liken it to that time you and their dad did something. Wink wink
Right
I don't have to disappear even though they are trying to make me do so in the videos at least. Also in the game afterwards where I was not in any photos. They can play their little games but what ended up happening is, I sat down in the living room, saw what was on the screen, commented that I already saw that video and then promptly moved to the kitchen table and asked if I could help with anything in the kitchen. I then started a side conversation with SD, nervously talking a mile a minute until I looked back and made a joke about DH in the video, who was dancing crazy-like with his head under a towel and related to how I recognize DHs dancing and gave them a funny story of my own about what he did at a wedding we attended awhile back. I was not a captive audience, but let it just slide off my back like I didn't really care. Even though inside it was hard to stomach.
I asked my counselor how
I asked my counselor how should I have handled that. How would they (DH's kids) feel if I turn on the videos of my first husband and children from years ago and expect them to sit there and watch. I just think it's rude to make your guests uncomfortable just because the host wants to be self-indulgent.
Oh the precious little babies
Oh the precious little babies (I am shocked they're in they're 50's and are still this emotionally crippled) would have probably started crying.
Funny how it's ok for them to pull this sort of B.S.
Yes
Very middle school mean girl behavior she dishes out along with the Thanksgiving dinner.
My SD is 41,
Oh I'm sorry I had you
Oh I'm sorry I had you confused with another poster. Ugh. 41. People think when their skid turns 18 that they're done. Lololol.
Your post came at an
Your post came at an interesting time. We too, were enjoying the peace and quiet of our home as the SDs had gone radio silence since June and we haven't seen them since Christmas 2019 because of Covid. I felt badly for DH, because, although we have been enjoying drama-free time during this last little while, sometimes he looked despondent when I would bring up the subject of their silence, but he's not one to open up about how he's feeling, so I can't be sure if that was the reason. None the less, part of me hoped that they would call him because no one should be alienated from their kids. Right?
....be careful what you wish for.
It happened. They called him last night. He put them on speaker phone so that I could listen in. They tag team badgered my DH about him never calling them, or rushing them off the phone when they do talk. YSD (the ringleader) did most of the talking. Told him that she cries a lot about the fact that she feels unloved. A lot finger pointing went back and forth, and they tried to accuse me of not relaying their messages, which we were able to call them out on as being completely untrue.
Anyway, to sum it all up, the reason for their call was that apparently DH needs to go out for dinners with them to strengthen and repair their Father-Daughter relationship. (They are in their early 50's). A little background for context; we lived in the same town as them for 20 years and we only saw them on either Christmas and Easter, or Christmas and Halloween or Christmas and Grandkid events. Never any mention of Strengthening their Father-Daughter relationship in those last 20 years. Now, 30 years later, it's become a thing!
Anyway, He said to them, we now live 4 hours away from you guys ! It's not something that is that easy to manage. They said that they would meet him halfway. I thought, not a bad idea. He said, "Nooooo....we can't do that. We'll drive to your town if this is what you want to do. When do you want to do it." Silence...humming and hawing for a while. He told them to think of a date and he'll call them at the end of the week to set things up.
Then they said that they needed to "address the elephant in the room. Birchclimber. Can we just get together with out her?" DH asked them why they would need to exclude me. "Why would you want to do that." He said we're married. He didn't understand why I wouldn't be allowed to join them. "She's part of the family." They badgered him once again and said that "ALL families have these types of these Father Daughter outings. It's completely normal. They go to the ballgame with their dad. They go to dinner with just their dad. We have friends who do this with their dad. Why can't it just be us? She can visit with us at Christmas The point is, it would be nice to just be with you once in while." until his response was, "I don't know. It seems odd to me, if that's the way you see it. I don't agree. I'm just beaten. This is just beating me down." to which YSD said, "How do you think WE feel. We cry about this. Do you ever cry?" ...and on and on. It was just nuts.
Anyway, he never really agreed to not bringing me, so no sooner had we hung up when he received an email from them (on my email because he doesn't have one...tech challenged) stating that, "...just so we're all on the same page.... we want to make sure that it will just be the three of us."
If you've read any of my blogs, you'll know that these two (YSD in particular) have been lobbying through sob-story-emails to have our will changed. OSD told us one time that YSD said that she is "going to keep the pressure on until we're in the will" THIS is clearly the motive and when I mentioned it to DH this morning, he couldn't disagree but he wouldn't agree either. "I don't know...we'll see." Their manipulations might actually be working on him? My fear is that, if left alone with these two SDs, he is a People Pleaser/Guilty Dad Sydrome who may just tell them what they want to hear to shut them up. He has a history of doing that sort of thing in other circumstances. I'm not saying it's right, but it really wouldn't surprise me. He hates conflict and arguments. My concern is, if she records him saying what she wants to hear, which she would most definitely do, what could she do with that recording??
As far as an answer to their email? He said to just type, "Why can't it be all of us." I began to type that reply but then deleted it. I told him that I'm not replying. If they want to rehash the conditions of their Father Daughter dinner, they can call him on the phone.
I'm not sure what's going to happen here. My anxiety is through the roof....
HOLY GAWD
What total grown ass B's.
Yea never negotiate with terrorists.
Your DH needs to watch what he says or writes. I would put nothin past these evil SD's.
You really lucked out with this crew. BUT your DH has your back and that makes all the difference.
Blessings
Thanks for your input
Thanks for your input Stepdrama2020. Funny you should mention "negotiating".
I just sat down with DH and we had a calm discussion about this. He said that the way that his two DDs talked to him yesterday, was reminiscent of the way that "the ex" used to argue with him. Just non-stop, can't-get-a-word-in-edgewise, incessant talking. He said, "I can't seem to get away from that". I told him that maybe it's time that he gain some control and deal with it so that his DDs don't feel like they can talk to him that way. I also said that the entire call sounded more like a husband/wife argument, then father/daughter discussion. I reminded him that he already has a wife. He doesn't need two more of them. He nodded in agreement. He then said that he feels like he's in the middle of this family dynamic. I corrected him and said that actually, he's in the driver's seat. He is the one who needs to set the boundaries, or they will continue to find new ways to drive a wedge between us. I also mentioned that I am hurt by the SD's exclusion of me especially after over 30 years of bending over backwards to be accepted by them and to be looked upon as a member of this family. He agreed that it's not reasonable for them to exclude me and that he will call them tonight to say that either "All of us go for dinner, or none of us go for dinner. Non-negotiable" .
I thanked him for that.
...but I'd be a fool to think that it's going to be that easy...
Husband for all the other things...
Would never allow me to be excluded from a "family gathering".
Their whole approach is divisive and toxic. Why do they need to exclude you to get digging into your wills?
Good for you!!!
" I corrected him and said that actually, he's in the driver's seat. He is the one who needs to set the boundaries, or they will continue to find new ways to drive a wedge between us."
You sound like such a wise lady. After 30 years you deserve DH's support. He sounds as if he has a hard time being strong but too bad. That's just part of the job of being a good DH. What ever you do, don't back down. SD's sound like they are 5 years old, for cryin' out loud! As has been mentioned, a daughter date once every 3 months is plenty. It's time SDs get on their big girl panties and grow up.
Your story gives me anxiety
Your story gives me anxiety because I have a very similar situation in most respects and I fear this alone time thing to manipulate is on the horizon. Stand your ground and say no to this, as you don't want to start this crap up. I do so wish you the best in this nasty situation. Love on your husband so that he wants to continue being loyal to his wife.
Response
Birchclimber,
We are no doubt between a rock and a hard place. There is no reason these adult daughters need a private dinner date while leaving the wife at home. It's just hurtful in more ways than one. They can call on their dad's personal phone or email him if they want to have a private conversation with him. Thank goodness yours live four hours away, and can't drop in. If I was him I would refuse to drive even two hours to meet them.
How unpleasant it would be at that table, knowing they don't want you there. Uncomfortable to put it mildly. The deciding factor to me is that DH wants you there and is holding onto hope that they will someday see the light. Spending time with PA adult offspring is the last place I want to be, but I force myself for my husband's sake. Before I go I give myself a pep talk. "It's only one day, then it will be over.....I can handle it.....be the bigger person....."
Freedom
Ten days from now my DH is retiring and we are flying south the very next day and not coming back until the end of April. Yay! Five whole months of freedom from outside SD interference. When we get back it will be three whole years since the dinner date routine of 2019. The habit has been broken! I don't know if the SD battle horn will start sounding again when we get back in town but I'm happy to say, I don't need to worry about that for more than half the year from now on.
Yay for You, TwirlMs! Enjoy
Yay for You, TwirlMs! Enjoy all of those months of skid-free drama, in the sunny south. What a well deserved treat for you and your DH. As for the Dinner Dates...fingers tightly crossed for you, that your SD will have moved past that chapter in her life upon your return.
Thank you so much. Here's to
Thank you so much. Here's to a new year of peace and confidence in our place at our husband's side!
Glad to hear this!
Hope all works out well for you. This is an opportunity for both of you to get closer and gain understanding. Perhaps the distance will also give DH a different perspective.
Hi Sandye
I sure do look forward to him being among the strong male role models that live at the same resort as us down there. He won't have time to miss SD one moment, but she will probably amp up the texting to make sure she gets in his head.
At Thanksgiving she was forcing videos of 1st family on him so much that by the end of the day, DH called me by first wife's name a couple of times. He never does that at home.
Update: My DH did have a
Update: My DH did have a conference call with his two adult DDs. Again, he put them on speaker phone so I could listen in. He told them that if I couldn't join them for these dinner outings that they are proposing, then he's not going. They insisted that it's a Father-Daughter get together! Why would Birchclimber want to come to a Father Daughter get together? We're your DAUGGGHHTERS!! He told them that I am his wife and part of this family. He said that we can ALL get together, have a nice meal and get "things back on track again like a normal family." They kept insisting that I should not be there because then it will all be phony and that we are not a normal family. They won't be able to really TALK* to him if I'm there. (*Translation: Birchclimber is onto our Bull crap and she is aware that we have an agenda in getting together with you now, after pretty much ignoring you for the last 30 years. But we can't manipulate you and reiterate all of our financial sob stories if she's there because she knows what were up to and she will shut us down.)
He asked them what is it exactly, that they can't say to him in front of me?? They insisted "nothinggggg, but that's not the point. We just want to spend time alone with our DAAAD! Why would Birchclimber want to be there if she knew that she wasn't wanted there?? " He said, "well, I want her there so I'm bringing my wife. These can't be all your rules. You want to do the dinners. I'm agreeing to that, but I want my wife there! You can feel comfortable to say anything you want to say to me with her there." YSD asked him if he brings me with him every time he visits his other family members and he said yes, he does. (That's actually not true, but they don't need to know that!) In response to that, YSD said that it's not healthy to bring your wife with you everywhere you go! He laughed at the irony. We're married 30 years...she couldn't make it 8 years, but yet she's an authority on healthy marriages!?
One of the highlights was when YSD tried to throw in the whole Grandpa guilt trip. You know; your own grandkids don't know their grandfather. You don't really know your grandkids... They feel unloved....etc. Well, it didn't work. He SHUT HER DOWN! He said, "OH, YDD! Don't try to lay the HEAVY on me!!" For the first time ever, she was speechless. She actually couldn't think of one of her usual retorts to that. She was Gobsmacked.
They kept arguing back and forth, for 15 minutes until he had had enough. He said, "Look. I'm not changing my mind about this. I'm not arguing about it anymore. Give yourself some time to think about it and if you want us all to get together, call me and we'll set up a time"!
They were blindsided! I was impressed. He was exhausted.
...and now, we wait for the next round.
Wow
I am impressed with how your DH has taken this head on and stood by your side. With a two against one odds. Saying no to those entitled daughters is healthy, showing them they can't double team your DH.
My DH has his moments of being brave but he struggles with her inevitable temper tantrums that follow.
You gave me some gems I might teach to DH. Like "no, you're in the driver's seat." That is exactly what these men need, affirming his role as your protector.
I hear you Twirl. Make no
I hear you Twirl. Make no mistake; I have no delusions. I'm still waiting for the fall out from this. I'm sure more tantrums are to follow. I can only hope that my DH holds his course and doesn't cave under their pressure.
Yes, let's hope this moment
Yes, let's hope this moment is a new awakening for those daughters that sound more like 5 yr. olds than 50 yr. olds.
This is undoubtedly a tough
This is undoubtedly a tough situation, but, wow, your husband rocks! Keep loving on him and thank him gently for loving you like he does. Those SDs are nasty, conniving little witches-wow.
Double the Wow!
Your DH seems to be getting it. Fantastic! He needs a big, big hug for his effort. Your SD's are so rude and immature! Keep encouraging him. If he waivers, gently prod. The irony of this is that SDs might find themselves in the role of a SM some day. It would be interesting to ask them what they would do if they married someone with kids and spent 30 years trying to get approval from them, having to endure rude comments like you have, etc.
Tag Team Trouble
Your DH deserves a medal! Thats a great story to read among the comments. Hopefully he stays strong through all this. Good for you in catching on to their hijinx.