Surprise surprise..

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As you guys are aware dh spoke to skid some time ago and inquired of his plans once he's out. The reply is he didn't want to come here cuz he and I don't get along and it probably didn't work out. Well now the tune is he's found God, reaching out to me, and can he stay on our couch if he gets a job, follows our rules. I KNEW that most likely he did really want to come here the whole time and the "we don't get along" was a way to paint me as the obstacle. Well dh and I discussed and he mentioned as before about skid "needing help." I feel moving him in would be enabling as it'd be easier to flop here and demand things (he already is pretty demanding, which gets on my nerves) rather than do for himself. When I pointed out that I have veto power with parole (after he told me that I'm gonna have to deal should he move him in) he changed his tune. He actually admitted later he didn't want him living here. Now to figure out how to respond if he writes to me, as well as what kind of reactions to anticipate when he gets the "no."

Well if he found God...then

Well if he found God...then he should know God will provide...just not at your house...good luck with that new found religion.

LOL, this response is

LOL, this response is hilarious!

My guess

I'm guessing your SS will say anything to get a place to stay. If it's a "hard no" in your mind, dont worry about replying to SS. Use your time and energy to make sure you and DH are firmly agreed.

Why would you even consider

Why would you even consider anything other than a HARD NO to him moving in? Don't let your DH chip away at your boundaries. There are services out there to help parolees get on their feet (not enough, but they are there). Let him find his own way in the world for once.

If he writes to you, ignore it.

What in my post would make

What in my post would make you assume that I AM considering anything other than a "HARD NO?" The fact that I told DH all I'd have to say is no to parole? Learn to read more carefully next time. And read this...CAREFULLY...I hope because of how demanding he is in large part, that he is not paroled to our area.

Tog is one of our treasures

Please dont dump on our treasure...

And good for you for hardlining.

Its not necessary to overthink things, if you are already not going to allow him to move in. Let your husband do the worrying.

I'm not dumping on your

I'm not dumping on your treasure. I am responding to her question as to how I'd consider anything aside from a "HARD NO" when nothing I've put in this post or replies has ever implied that. As a matter of fact I'd prefer never to lay eyes on him again-though I wish the best for him.

As to not overthinking things it's hard. Skid is manipulative enough that i feel I have to be one step ahead of him. He is apparently STILL pissy about the fact that he can't come here and in a letter to skid (that I had to find and read) he sounds like the reason is because of ME and how I feel. Which is only partly true...I wouldn't let him move in even if we are BFF's. And Dh won't tell him he doesn't want him living here which he admitted to me so I feel cornered and ganged up on.

I'm also battling resentment because I dont feel that skid who's changed soooo much for the better **eyeroll** has any business putting us in a spot like this. I don't want to diaper what will be nearly a middle aged man and he KNOWS he is putting dad and me in a hard spot.

ok...whelp Im thinking that we are all agreeing with you

So just perhaps be a little nicer. Things have a way of sounding sharp because its on here in text without voice intonation and body language. So - no I get that you are just wanting to figure out how to deal and not be the "bad guy". I can relate. DH often puts me under the bus by blaming me for the reason he has to say no. Its a ball-less move in my opinion. No is a complete sentence. No means no, and you dont need to give a reason, much less say "WELL Clove said no, so thats it...no, because shes a meanie".

I have SD22 Feral Forger, and she has asked at least 3 times to move "back into her old room". This last Christmas 2020 she was on the phone sobbing and telling SD15 "Eff you eff off shut the eff up" while at the same time asking to move back in. Shed left at 18 and pretty much ghosted us with no info on where she was living, or when she would be back or what to do with all the trash and stuff in the room. It was basically cold storage locker for trash. So, one day, when DH asked me if I wanted him to take anything to the dump, I said "yes and we will be getting everything out of that room today". So now its MY room and I watch sunsets and have a fish tank and pretty things. The doos is off. Its a room we all enjoy and she will NEVER be moving back in with me, because I wont live with her dirty disrespectful lying mean manipulative self.
While this sobbing ask was happening, SD15 begged me to say no and that if we said yes she would destroy herself. They dont like each other.

So, DH told her no she needs to work things out where she is.

This last time, she texted and when he told her no, she told him he was no longer her dad that he was just her sperm donor. And then I got some nasty texts about how I was the reason she no longer has a father and that I am the cause of all her issues and I traumatized her (like that time she called me ugly and disgusting, that really traumatized her). So yes, these fathers that like to use us as the reasons their failed progency cannot come into our sanctuaries to mess up our lives - they cannot seem to say no...just no.

So this was back in April - anything new happen?

Exactly how am I not being

Exactly how am I not being nice? You're the one who told me I am "dumping on your treasure" (which came across sharp) because I pointed out to tog that I never made any comment or reply that implied I'd ever consider moving skid in. I wish DH would get the point of just saying "no."

As to being the bad guy I don't care on the level of skid is pissed and my personal view is that tha's HIS problem. I'm not looking for skid's approval though considering the history I'd be insulted if he liked me That said....skid has been very violent in the past and I highly doubt he's totally incapable of it now short of a complete personaltiy transplant. So part of it is not wanting to deal with potential retaliation. Another part of it is the fact that skid is still not letting up so me or dh saying no doesn't shut skid up or stop his whining or trying to stay here. And there is a good possibility that either now, when he's out or both I'll catch wind of "it's all HER fault I can't stay WAAAAAHHHHHH" and I resent all the blame being put on ME as to why he can't stay cuz dh won't be more direct with him and let him know it's not just ME who doesn't want it. I feel that if dh would be more willing to be direct and blunt (which I was being in earlier comments, not "not nice") with skid he'd shut up sooner with his demanding. He's managing to be a complete pain even from prison.

He's still whining to dad and upset that he can't stay. Oh and the parole date keeps getting moved back and back and back....

Hopefully you will have more time

Ive had to tell DH "just say no and let it be a complete sentence".

The last time he told SD22 Feral Forger "No", he added "you will have the same issues here that you have there, and you need to work things out with Clove".

Crickets then a nasty text later telling me I took her father from her.

I can understand with the history of violence you want to be removed from any and all conversations about him moving in.

ONE thing I presented to DH back when I was still hopefull was that he do a rental assistance for SD22, somewhere near to businesses in town (she doesnt drive, no license, and jobs are tough to get to when you dont drive). Get her set up in her own living situation not with us.

Is that something that would be possible?

I've told DH things along

I've told DH things along those lines re: the "no"...for whatever reason he feels he owes people explanations. We wouldn't be able to do rental assistance and I am hoping he is at least paroled to another county if not further away. He is being a pain in the ass even from prison. Even if we WERE able to do it I wouldn't...I don't see the need or obligation to fund an overgrown man-baby who should've been providing for himself a long time ago.

I'm pretty sure Tog was

I'm pretty sure Tog was agreeing with you.

I'm pretty sure I'm aware of

I'm pretty sure I'm aware of that. I'm talking about her comment that implied I'd consider moving him in.

tell him God

spoke to you in a dream and told you that him moving in would be a bad choice. That God has a plan for him to find his own wings and soar. Then give him a list of halfway houses in your area.

I don't want him in our area

I don't want him in our area as he is so demanding..the further away he is the better.

Lolol...Agedout I'm dying I'm

Lolol...Agedout I LOVE IT!!

An interesting observation

An interesting observation that I have made repeatedly over the years of my life is that extremely deviant people tend to Z out to the opposite extreme when they "find God". The most ardent partiers, most promiscuous lovers, etc... tend to become phenomenally judgemental when they transition to being devout.

Another observation is that even those who were formerly on the wrong edge of the behavioral range and "find God" rather than make a true change of character use the forgiveness of sin, past, present, and future, to justify continuing to do what they want to do rather than what they should do.

I am a spiritual person though I am not a participant in formalized or organized religion. IMHO a relationship with God is a personal relationship and only the individual is qualified to define, live, and adjust that relationship as they mature.

The primary debate on salvation is between the Calvinist salvation through grace perspective Vs the Araminianist salvation through works perspective.

I am a hybrid philosophy guy myself leaned slightly towards to the Araminianist side with the thought that works outweigh grace. Evil cannot be forgiven just by asking. A life long evil violent sociopathic psychopath cannot be forgiven as the death cocktail is being pumped into their veins because they are scared shitless at the prospect of death. No works, no grace, no salvation. IMHO of course. Salvation has a scale, as my logic flow works. Someone who has lived a decent life is saved by grace due to the decent life they have lived. Grace has no place for anyone who is unrepentant in their core.

I keep is simple in a way that works for me.

My formulation of this philosophy began when I was pretty young during summer visits to my GPs home. My GGF founded the community Church, donated the land, built the first building and my GM graced the inside corner seat of the left side 3rd pew for her entire life. That pew was family territory and everyone knew to stay the hell away from it whether my GM was present or not. She was the first female Deacon in the Church and there were no female Deacon's allowed. New Church members only sat in pew L-3 once. My GM never said a word to them though they always received the message from others in the congregation.

Anyway, a slobbering ranting elderly man screaming at the top of his lungs slinging fire and brimstone at the congregation made he whole organized religion concept a write off for me. As i got older and the age and style of the pastor of the decade at the head of the family church evolved I began to wonder at the whole don't think, God knows your life, etc... When a supposedly learned authority tells a group of people to not use their brain and follow some unknown pre-ordained "plan" I know that the dogma of that philosophy has nothing to with God. God does not bestow the greatest blessing then forbid human kind from using that gift. Intellect is that gift.

Choice has outcomes. Positive or negative. With the gift of intellect, comes owning the outcomes of decisions. God granted that gift to human kind, human kind owes it to itself to make optimal use of that gift.

I do not tolerate excuses for bad behaviors whether the source of those excuses is just clueless ignorance or religious dogma.

I am right with "God" as the intellectual gift I have been blessed with tells me is logical. I sleep just fine.

Just my thoughts of course.

As for your Skid and returning to your home.... I am on team help him. Help him stay the hell away from your home. Provide him with contacts at group homes for convicts re-entering society that minimizes his access to your home, you life, and your resources. Inform your DH that he has failed to parent and you will not sacrifice yourself, your marriage, your home, or your resources by throwing it all down the shitter that this kid has already actively dived into.

You are the only one who can provide his salvation through grace and IMHO he has not earned it through works. Once he does earn it through works, he will not need salvation from you. He will have earned it for himself. Serving a sentence does not demonstrate lawful living. Getting out, getting a job, supporting himself, and living decades of law abiding self supporting life demonstrates lawful living.

Don't risk it no matter how much your DH pressures you. Once the Skid proves himself, then engage. Not until them. As he performs for an increasingly extended time, a small reward may be in order and a way to motivate his improvement. Keep that as your sole prerogative.

Live well.

All IMHO of course.

Thank you for your insightful

Thank you for your insightful response...I tend toward the saved by grace but that you'll know people by their fruit. I highly doubt I ever am going to engage again..because skid is putting me in a spot where he's painting look like a bad guy (I'm not "forgiving" supposedly) because I no longer want a relationship with him, because there has been far too much toxicity for too many years, and he is trying to pressure dh and me re: staying here when he knows how I feel. Plus I see no reason for him to be around much at all anyway...he should be too busy with his own life to be up our rear ends all the time. Btw there wouldn't be a "return" to our home he never lived with us.

What kind of small reward did you have in mind, just out of curiosity? To me it should be the knowledge of a job well done and pride in his accomplishments.

I completely relate. I've had

I completely relate. I've had 2 entitled SS move in as "adults" and they are worse than toddlers thanks to DH. What's sad is that I am not sure how to get veto power in my house. How do I do that? I guess the only veto power I would have is "if SS moves in then I'm moving out". I screwed up along time ago by not setting firm boundaries and just trying to make my husband happy when in fact he wasn't interested if I was happy at all in return.